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Venezuela, Socialism, Bernie, Kittens and Rainbows.

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posted on Jun, 19 2017 @ 01:10 PM
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a reply to: introvert

USSR was socialist and North Korea still is.




posted on Jun, 19 2017 @ 01:17 PM
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a reply to: allsee4eye

USSR was communist and North Korea's government is based on Juche ideology.

It's dictatorial government.



posted on Jun, 19 2017 @ 01:19 PM
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a reply to: introvert

They are command economies failed due to too much demand and too little supply. Command economy is not efficient like market economy is. Market economy has more supply than demand.



posted on Jun, 19 2017 @ 01:24 PM
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originally posted by: introvert
a reply to: allsee4eye

USSR was communist and North Korea's government is based on Juche ideology.

It's dictatorial government.


If I call myself a king, will you bow?
The Soviet Union called themselves a communist utopia...

However, the USSR was a failed socialist state....period...
In other news, water is wet and the sky is blue...

-Chris



posted on Jun, 19 2017 @ 01:42 PM
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originally posted by: allsee4eye
a reply to: introvert

They are command economies failed due to too much demand and too little supply. Command economy is not efficient like market economy is. Market economy has more supply than demand.


There is some truth to that.


originally posted by: Christosterone

originally posted by: introvert
a reply to: allsee4eye

USSR was communist and North Korea's government is based on Juche ideology.

It's dictatorial government.


If I call myself a king, will you bow?


No, but what does that have to do with anything I said?



However, the USSR was a failed socialist state....period... In other news, water is wet and the sky is blue...


The USSR was communist. There is a difference between that and simple socialism, such as someone myself believes in.

You cannot have a pure socialist state and you cannot have a pure capitalist state.

You have to have a proper mix of both.



posted on Jun, 19 2017 @ 01:43 PM
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So, Here's the problem with this thread and OP.

Most people that support Sanders and some of his ideas or any so called "Progressive or Socialist programs" Don't want us to be Venezuala or North Korea or Russia or Syria or Iran or any weird country or government like that.

They just want a way to reel in the rampant corporatism (meaning large corporations can do whatever they want without consequence and buy our politicians in the process) and they want to help those less fortunate or who have hit a skid of bad luck and need a hand up.

I realize that sometimes that concept gets bastardized.

But let's be real here. Who also cares what kind of car Bernie Sanders drives? LOL



posted on Jun, 19 2017 @ 01:45 PM
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originally posted by: havok
Excellent points.
Just like seeing the Antifa protests in CA or anywhere else. It's all fun and games until the idiots protesting can't eat because they destroyed their neighborhood grocery store.

What I never understood is how all the Bernie supporters thought that everything he stood for was free? Ok, who exactly did they think was going to pay for everything? Nothing in this world is "free".




Still him and Rand Paul were the best choices out of everyone running. That says a lot right there.



posted on Jun, 19 2017 @ 01:49 PM
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a reply to: amazing



But let's be real here. Who also cares what kind of car Bernie Sanders drives?


Good point. I, for one, do not care.

Many socialists such as myself do not want a top-down, dictatorial government where all is controlled by the state. We want simple things like universal healthcare.

It is a fallacy to think we can all be equal in every aspect of life. Some people will make tons of money and can buy fancy cars and such, but we have to set a level as a society as to the standards we set for the lowest among us.

We are only as good as our weakest link, even if others are made of gold. We have to be able to strengthen the weak ones to keep it all together.



posted on Jun, 19 2017 @ 01:55 PM
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originally posted by: introvert
a reply to: amazing



But let's be real here. Who also cares what kind of car Bernie Sanders drives?

Many socialists such as myself do not want a top-down, dictatorial government where all is controlled by the state.


Then stop calling yourself a socialist.


economic and political theories advocating collective or governmental ownership and administration of the means of production and distribution of goods.


edit on 19-6-2017 by FauxMulder because: Socialism sucks.



posted on Jun, 19 2017 @ 02:09 PM
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originally posted by: FauxMulder

originally posted by: introvert
a reply to: amazing



But let's be real here. Who also cares what kind of car Bernie Sanders drives?

Many socialists such as myself do not want a top-down, dictatorial government where all is controlled by the state.


Then stop calling yourself a socialist.


economic and political theories advocating collective or governmental ownership and administration of the means of production and distribution of goods.



You are giving us a good example of how uninformed people are about socialist ideologies. You can socialize specific sectors of society or programs without everything having to be socialized as well.

The healthcare industry is one example.



posted on Jun, 19 2017 @ 02:10 PM
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originally posted by: amazing


But let's be real here. Who also cares what kind of car Bernie Sanders drives? LOL


It kinda DOES matter that Bernie drives a $175K CAR.
A guy whom gets rich condemning others for being rich, while others are poor is like a ...,well, like a Hypocrite.



posted on Jun, 19 2017 @ 02:34 PM
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originally posted by: introvert

originally posted by: FauxMulder

originally posted by: introvert
a reply to: amazing



But let's be real here. Who also cares what kind of car Bernie Sanders drives?

Many socialists such as myself do not want a top-down, dictatorial government where all is controlled by the state.


Then stop calling yourself a socialist.


economic and political theories advocating collective or governmental ownership and administration of the means of production and distribution of goods.



You are giving us a good example of how uninformed people are about socialist ideologies. You can socialize specific sectors of society or programs without everything having to be socialized as well.

The healthcare industry is one example.


You guys can't just change the definition of socialism because the actual socialist countries show how crappy it really is.

Just because a country has universal healthcare doesn't make it socialist country. Is it a socialistic program? Absolutely but the definition of socialism is not "a mix of free-market and socialist policies"



posted on Jun, 19 2017 @ 05:00 PM
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a reply to: FauxMulder



You guys can't just change the definition of socialism because the actual socialist countries show how crappy it really is.


I'm not changing any definition. Socialism and socialist ideologies go well beyond the dictionary term people latch on to.



Just because a country has universal healthcare doesn't make it socialist country. Is it a socialistic program? Absolutely but the definition of socialism is not "a mix of free-market and socialist policies"


Bingo. It's a socialist program but it does not make the entire economic model of the country socialist. It's a mix.



Absolutely but the definition of socialism is not "a mix of free-market and socialist policies"


I did not say it was. Socialism is not rooted in free-market principles. But it can be intertwined with capitalist systems.



posted on Jun, 19 2017 @ 05:48 PM
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originally posted by: introvert

originally posted by: allsee4eye
a reply to: introvert

They are command economies failed due to too much demand and too little supply. Command economy is not efficient like market economy is. Market economy has more supply than demand.


There is some truth to that.


originally posted by: Christosterone

originally posted by: introvert
a reply to: allsee4eye

USSR was communist and North Korea's government is based on Juche ideology.

It's dictatorial government.


If I call myself a king, will you bow?


No, but what does that have to do with anything I said?



However, the USSR was a failed socialist state....period... In other news, water is wet and the sky is blue...


The USSR was communist. There is a difference between that and simple socialism, such as someone myself believes in.

You cannot have a pure socialist state and you cannot have a pure capitalist state.

You have to have a proper mix of both.



The USSR was communist?

Hey, was the second "S" stand for in the USSR acronym???

Thanks in advance

-Chris



posted on Jun, 19 2017 @ 06:25 PM
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originally posted by: Christosterone

originally posted by: introvert

originally posted by: allsee4eye
a reply to: introvert

They are command economies failed due to too much demand and too little supply. Command economy is not efficient like market economy is. Market economy has more supply than demand.


There is some truth to that.


originally posted by: Christosterone

originally posted by: introvert
a reply to: allsee4eye

USSR was communist and North Korea's government is based on Juche ideology.

It's dictatorial government.


If I call myself a king, will you bow?


No, but what does that have to do with anything I said?



However, the USSR was a failed socialist state....period... In other news, water is wet and the sky is blue...


The USSR was communist. There is a difference between that and simple socialism, such as someone myself believes in.

You cannot have a pure socialist state and you cannot have a pure capitalist state.

You have to have a proper mix of both.



The USSR was communist?

Hey, was the second "S" stand for in the USSR acronym???

Thanks in advance

-Chris


Communism is an extreme form of socialism, but you have to understand the difference between simple socialism and full-on communism.

Like I said in the post you responded to.



posted on Jun, 19 2017 @ 06:47 PM
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a reply to: introvert

So I wasn't sure of the difference between them...So I've looked it up. Every source agreed the major difference was communism is not controlled by the people and socialism is. So basically one is Democratic the other is a Dictatorship. Now if we think a little deeper on this and look at our US government do you think the people are in control of merely duped into thinking they are? If you conclude we are duped and other powers truly control this country rather than we the people...What then would that really make a socialist US?



posted on Jun, 19 2017 @ 06:49 PM
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a reply to: RickyD

Left is high tax command economy. Right is low tax free market. Of course, no country is entirely command or free. But it gives you an idea what left and right means.



posted on Jun, 19 2017 @ 07:02 PM
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originally posted by: RickyD
a reply to: introvert

So I wasn't sure of the difference between them...So I've looked it up. Every source agreed the major difference was communism is not controlled by the people and socialism is. So basically one is Democratic the other is a Dictatorship. Now if we think a little deeper on this and look at our US government do you think the people are in control of merely duped into thinking they are? If you conclude we are duped and other powers truly control this country rather than we the people...What then would that really make a socialist US?


I think you are asking the wrong question, but an excellent observation.

The US has socialist aspects, that's for sure, but for the most part it is a corporate entity that allows the upper echelon to control money, government and people.

What we should be asking: Are the effects of extreme capitalism really that much different than communism?

Not really. The effects are the same in many regards. It still creates poverty and materialism over the benefit of the collective good for the sake of profit and the leadership is still confined to a select group.

At least communism is honest. You know what you are getting.

Pure capitalism gives you the impression of change while the same players stick it in your backside for generations.

That is why we need a mix of the two systems.


edit on 19-6-2017 by introvert because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 19 2017 @ 07:02 PM
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a reply to: allsee4eye

I know what they mean but I wanted to be clear on what intrptr meant in his post so I looked it up on multiple sites. You also over simplified left and right to a point that you really didn't do either side much justice, however essentially yes you are correct. More social programs must be paid for so the left usually seeks to gain funding for such through tax...Where as the right does not advocate for such social programs and therefore doesn't need the tax to fund it. The right wants other things and they seek funding through taxes for that, so both sides want to further develop the central government at least they do in the US. The libertarian is the group seeking to have a smaller central government these days.
edit on 19-6-2017 by RickyD because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 19 2017 @ 07:05 PM
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a reply to: introvert

What it all boils down to as far as I can see is you're going to take it in the rear no matter what, unless you make the right friends or find your way into the right group no matter what country or government...If you can't or won't do so...You are shafted.



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