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Why I decided to oppose universal healthcare

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posted on Jun, 15 2017 @ 07:26 PM
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a reply to: windword

Some of us do mind paying for others' kids to be educated because those kids don't actually get educated between crappy teachers, corrupt school districts, and parents who don't give a crap so their kids waste the opportunity and ruin things for others kids who are trying.



+5 more 
posted on Jun, 15 2017 @ 07:26 PM
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a reply to: allsee4eye

You're a psychopath and no different to those elitists who most of us here on ATS despise.

Based off your reasoning the following would happen:

The rich get healthcare, even with genetic diseases.
The healthy poor who get the odd cold or misfortune like a broken bone go into poverty because of your system
The sick poor simply die.

And we end up with rich, diseased, weak bloodlines that eventually end humanity.

I believe the following:

Universal salary cap ($200,000 p.a.)
Universal Basic income
Universal Basic education
Universal Extended education
Universal Health care, all aspects of.
Universal Real Estate Cap ($1,000,000)

The above alone would fund basically every service ever needed by anyone, ever, for the high functioning of society.....instead of the current model that focuses on the functioning of high society.

And if you dont know how to live off $200,000 per year...well...I give up.
edit on 15-6-2017 by LightAssassin because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 15 2017 @ 07:27 PM
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a reply to: allsee4eye


Not everyone has kids. Everyone does need health care, at one time or another.

Not everyone who has kids puts their kids in public schools. A lot of those people DO MIND paying for other kids education. Enter Betsy Duvos!



posted on Jun, 15 2017 @ 07:27 PM
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a reply to: Ohanka

Source



posted on Jun, 15 2017 @ 07:27 PM
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originally posted by: ketsuko

originally posted by: Hazardous1408
Those who won't look after the weakest in society (re:" If some poor people have genetic disease and needs to see the doctor a lot, why should I be forced to pay for his health fees"), are no friend of humanity.

It borders on sociopathic to measure the health of your people with dollar signs.


Those who force others to look after them used to be called "massa" too.

In other words, if you compel others to do for you, you're no better than a slave owner.


Literally nobody will ever hold a gun to your head and force you to become a doctor or a nurse...



posted on Jun, 15 2017 @ 07:27 PM
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a reply to: ketsuko

It is a question of willingness. Everyone's kids need education, not everyone need healthcare. That's why everyone is cool with paying for universal education for kids, but not everyone is cool with paying for universal healthcare.



posted on Jun, 15 2017 @ 07:29 PM
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a reply to: ketsuko


I agree. Mark the date, Ketsuko!



posted on Jun, 15 2017 @ 07:29 PM
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originally posted by: Ohanka

originally posted by: ketsuko

originally posted by: Hazardous1408
Those who won't look after the weakest in society (re:" If some poor people have genetic disease and needs to see the doctor a lot, why should I be forced to pay for his health fees"), are no friend of humanity.

It borders on sociopathic to measure the health of your people with dollar signs.


Those who force others to look after them used to be called "massa" too.

In other words, if you compel others to do for you, you're no better than a slave owner.


Literally nobody will ever hold a gun to your head and force you to become a doctor or a nurse...


But you will hold a gun to my head and force to pay for you health care, just like you hold a gun to my head and force me to pay for kids to be educated, and hold a gun to my head and tell me how my kid *will* be educated and where when that doesn't leave me enough to pay for a private education out of my own pocket.



posted on Jun, 15 2017 @ 07:29 PM
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a reply to: allsee4eye

First, there are a lot of people who have a HUGE problem paying for schools. But men with guns take your fing house if you don't.


Being strong or weak has little to do with who uses health care.



posted on Jun, 15 2017 @ 07:29 PM
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a reply to: Ohanka

Eugenists are evil because they murder people. Murder is not okay in anyone's books. Nature weeds out the weak to maintain a sizable strong in the population naturally, through diseases.



posted on Jun, 15 2017 @ 07:30 PM
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originally posted by: Ohanka

originally posted by: ketsuko

originally posted by: Hazardous1408
Those who won't look after the weakest in society (re:" If some poor people have genetic disease and needs to see the doctor a lot, why should I be forced to pay for his health fees"), are no friend of humanity.

It borders on sociopathic to measure the health of your people with dollar signs.


Those who force others to look after them used to be called "massa" too.

In other words, if you compel others to do for you, you're no better than a slave owner.


Literally nobody will ever hold a gun to your head and force you to become a doctor or a nurse...


Not to mention, most doctors and nurses (in the UK at least) are happy to pay even more in taxes so long as it goes to the NHS.




posted on Jun, 15 2017 @ 07:31 PM
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a reply to: seasonal

True, some people don't have kids, so they think, hmm, why is my tax dollars going to paying for other people's kids education.



posted on Jun, 15 2017 @ 07:31 PM
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originally posted by: allsee4eye
a reply to: ketsuko

It is a question of willingness. Everyone's kids need education, not everyone need healthcare. That's why everyone is cool with paying for universal education for kids, but not everyone is cool with paying for universal healthcare.


But you misunderstand me.

I am *not* willing to. I stopped being wiling to the day I walked out of a teaching job in a corrupt, crappy inner city school. The kids there didn't have a chance and were trapped in that hell because people are willing to pay for that system to continue to ruin their lives and keep them mired there.



posted on Jun, 15 2017 @ 07:33 PM
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originally posted by: ketsuko

originally posted by: Ohanka

originally posted by: ketsuko

originally posted by: Hazardous1408
Those who won't look after the weakest in society (re:" If some poor people have genetic disease and needs to see the doctor a lot, why should I be forced to pay for his health fees"), are no friend of humanity.

It borders on sociopathic to measure the health of your people with dollar signs.


Those who force others to look after them used to be called "massa" too.

In other words, if you compel others to do for you, you're no better than a slave owner.


Literally nobody will ever hold a gun to your head and force you to become a doctor or a nurse...


But you will hold a gun to my head and force to pay for you health care, just like you hold a gun to my head and force me to pay for kids to be educated, and hold a gun to my head and tell me how my kid *will* be educated and where when that doesn't leave me enough to pay for a private education out of my own pocket.


Just like you'd put a gun to my head and force me to pay towards War, and bombs, and corporate subsidies...



posted on Jun, 15 2017 @ 07:33 PM
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Why doesn't the American tax payer deserve the same kind of health care our congressmen and representatives receive complements of the American tax payer? How much work do they do?

Are they such a special "class" that they deserve the best health care while the man in the street can go bankrupt from just a short hospital stay even if they do have insurance.


edit on 15-6-2017 by olaru12 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 15 2017 @ 07:33 PM
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a reply to: ketsuko

Good point. Rich people don't send their kids to public schools. They send their kids to private schools. So they should not be forced to pay for poor people's kids education with public schools.



posted on Jun, 15 2017 @ 07:34 PM
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a reply to: allsee4eye
The common flue is lethal, in fact it kills thousands every year!!

CDC
Why does CDC estimate deaths associated with seasonal flu?

CDC feels it is important to convey the full burden of seasonal flu to the public. Seasonal flu is a serious disease that causes illness, hospitalizations, and deaths every year in the United States. CDC estimates of annual influenza-associated deaths in the United States are made using well-established scientific methods that have been reviewed by scientists outside of CDC.

How many people die from seasonal flu each year in the United States?

The number of seasonal influenza-associated (i.e., seasonal flu-related) deaths varies from year to year because flu seasons often fluctuate in length and severity. Therefore, a single estimate cannot be used to summarize influenza-associated deaths. Instead, a range of estimated deaths is a better way to represent the variability and unpredictability of flu.

An August 27, 2010 MMWR report entitled “Thompson MG et al. Updated Estimates of Mortality Associated with Seasonal Influenza through the 2006-2007 Influenza Season. MMWR 2010; 59(33): 1057-1062.," provided estimates of the range of flu-associated deaths that occurred in the United States during the three decades prior to 2007. CDC estimated that from the 1976-1977 season to the 2006-2007 flu season, flu-associated deaths ranged from a low of about 3,000 to a high of about 49,000 people.

On December 9, 2016, CDC posted estimates of seasonal flu deaths from more recent seasons in the United States. CDC estimates that from 2010-2011 to 2013-2014, influenza-associated deaths in the United States ranged from a low of 12,000 (during 2011-2012) to a high of 56,000 (during 2012-2013). Death certificate data and weekly influenza virus surveillance information was used to estimate how many flu-related deaths occurred among people whose underlying cause of death on their death certificate included respiratory or circulatory causes.


I am all for true universal healthcare. But Obamacare never even came close, it just made insurance mandatory and exponentially more expensive.
edit on 6-15-2017 by worldstarcountry because: i forgot the link!



posted on Jun, 15 2017 @ 07:37 PM
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originally posted by: allsee4eye
a reply to: ketsuko

Good point. Rich people don't send their kids to public schools. They send their kids to private schools. So they should not be forced to pay for poor people's kids education with public schools.


Lol... this just keeps getting better...


The society you want to live in exists in many 3rd world countries.

So just move.

But don't complain when you're poor in that country and need a doctor or an education.

Just die. As you have decided is best for others.
edit on 15-6-2017 by Hazardous1408 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 15 2017 @ 07:38 PM
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a reply to: allsee4eye

This is not 4000 BC.

Your statements are akin to a game of dungeon and dragons or mad max.

There are incredible "strong" people who break a leg. There are frail and weak people who are healthy and productive. In todays society there is safety nets that help people.

Like roads? Like fire dept? Like public water? Like parks? Like libraries? Like the military? Like side walks? Like NASA?......



posted on Jun, 15 2017 @ 07:38 PM
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originally posted by: allsee4eye
a reply to: ketsuko

Good point. Rich people don't send their kids to public schools. They send their kids to private schools. So they should not be forced to pay for poor people's kids education with public schools.


Taxes are the price you pay to live in the nation-state. It needs them to function.

It is in the state's interest to have a healthy and educated population.

The unbelievable selfishness of rich people does not trump the needs of the people & needs of the state.




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