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Trump collusion with Russia? There's no proof either way unless Trump testifies under oath.

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posted on Jun, 15 2017 @ 02:24 PM
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a reply to: Gandalf77

The FISA warrants were obtained illegally by conflating any communication with anyone remotely associated with Russia as being a form of collusion.

If there existed any evidence of collusion between Trump, his associates, and Russia, it would have surfaced.

A senator meeting with a country's foreign ambassador in a public setting is not collusion. Selling a multimillion dollar beachfront home to wealthy Russians is also not illegal. Communicating with Russian officials about possible terrorist threats that affect both the US and its allies is also not collusion.

Now that they realize they cannot get Trump or his people for collusion they are going to go all in with obstruction of justice.

The end result will be the implosion of the already sinking Democratic Party.




posted on Jun, 15 2017 @ 02:37 PM
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originally posted by: ColdWisdom
a reply to: Gandalf77

The FISA warrants were obtained illegally by conflating any communication with anyone remotely associated with Russia as being a form of collusion.

If there existed any evidence of collusion between Trump, his associates, and Russia, it would have surfaced.

A senator meeting with a country's foreign ambassador in a public setting is not collusion. Selling a multimillion dollar beachfront home to wealthy Russians is also not illegal. Communicating with Russian officials about possible terrorist threats that affect both the US and its allies is also not collusion.

Now that they realize they cannot get Trump or his people for collusion they are going to go all in with obstruction of justice.

The end result will be the implosion of the already sinking Democratic Party.


I respectfully disagree here. It is not logical to suggest that any evidence would have surfaced. This is an ongoing (and widening) investigation. These people do know how to keep things like critical evidence from the public. Leaked evidence has a way of tainting a case and rendering it inadmissable. Law enforcement 101.

Also, I don't think we know enough about the FISA warrants to state that they were illegally obtained. We don't know what they had to get those warrants in the first place. (If you have a source that shows otherwise, please share.)

I do agree that those examples you provide don't add up to collusion.
However, if (and it's a big hypothetical if) someone on Trump's campaign went to a Russian official with an offer of friendly policies in exchange for assistance with the election, that's collusion and THEN some--i.e., treason.



posted on Jun, 15 2017 @ 02:50 PM
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a reply to: allsee4eye

Ahh except Flynn told the russian ambassador that trump would.. on FBI wire tap...



posted on Jun, 15 2017 @ 02:51 PM
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originally posted by: ColdWisdom

originally posted by: Lucidparadox
Trump colluded with Russia.

The chief admiral of the NSA confirmed it. He also stated they have hard evidence. recordings, documentation, etc.

The reason this isnt all out in the open right now, and why everyone is running around throwing circumstantial evidence out there..

Is that the hard evidence was most likely obtained illegally by NSA spying programs.

Everyone knows the truth, but they are forced to find other evidence and other ways to prove it because the actual evidence isnt usable.


Boy that's a real croc if sh!t, right there.

No NSA has confirmed any kind of collusion with Russia.

You know how I know?

Because it would have been leaked to WaPo by now, whether it was collected illegally or not is irrelevant.

The act of leaking itself is already class 3 felony, yet every other day we are hearing the details of private conversations our POTUS is having with foreign leaders.

Did you think that was legal?

If evidence on Trump or anyone else associated with him ever came to surface it would be leaked to WaPo and echoed all over CNN, MSNBC, ABC, CBS, TNYT, Huff Po, Salon, BBC, you get the idea.


VERY hesitant to share this...as it was quickly removed after it was put online. Make of it what you WILL.


edit on 15-6-2017 by DanteGaland because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 15 2017 @ 02:52 PM
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a reply to: ColdWisdom

I have seen no one claim the wire taps were illegal.. only that unmasking the names was.

Which would not at all comprise the legitimacy of the tapes.



posted on Jun, 15 2017 @ 03:00 PM
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a reply to: Gandalf77

I assume it would go in the reverse direction..

Russia would have offered dropping the tapes on "x" schedule and trump would drop sanctions and not interfe with Russia's actions with its neighbors.

Trumps people wouldn't know Russia had hacked the dnc. So they would have had to go to them..

Which they had access to through manifort , Flynn and carter.

Then you had Flynn caught telling the Russian ambassador they would drop sanctions ( maybe a smooth over call after obama added sanctions, to tell Putin the deal was still on ).

AND you had trumps ONLY change to the GOP party platform being that THE US wouldn't give Ukraine military aid (maybe the initial down payment to show he would Russia he would come through?)..

Quid, pro quo rarely is that transparent..



posted on Jun, 15 2017 @ 03:00 PM
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originally posted by: JoshuaCox
a reply to: ColdWisdom

I have seen no one claim the wire taps were illegal.. only that unmasking the names was.

Which would not at all comprise the legitimacy of the tapes.


Just like with a STINGRAY cell phone device...the SIGNIT might not be 100% "admissible" ... so, they BOOTSTRAP and use that inadmissible evidence to find stuff they CAN use.

Also, with PETABYTES of data to comb through...it takes TIME to sort out what's relevant. Many angles...



You Come at the King, You Best Not Miss


^^ TRUTH to that...





posted on Jun, 15 2017 @ 03:09 PM
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Russia has universal healthcare. If there is one thing Trump can learn from Putin, it's universal healthcare.



posted on Jun, 15 2017 @ 03:13 PM
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originally posted by: allsee4eye
Russia has universal healthcare. If there is one thing Trump can learn from Putin, it's universal healthcare.


Irony..
I feels it.



posted on Jun, 15 2017 @ 03:20 PM
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Why not get Putin to testify under oath ? and while you're at it get Kim also



posted on Jun, 15 2017 @ 03:22 PM
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a reply to: manuelram16

That would require capturing him first. Pretty much impossible.



posted on Jun, 15 2017 @ 04:34 PM
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a reply to: JoshuaCox

a reply to: DanteGaland

You two aren't listening.

If there was evidence of any kind of a crime committed by anyone associated with Trump, it would have already been leaked.

What are they waiting for?



posted on Jun, 15 2017 @ 04:40 PM
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originally posted by: ColdWisdom
a reply to: JoshuaCox

a reply to: DanteGaland

You two aren't listening.

If there was evidence of any kind of a crime committed by anyone associated with Trump, it would have already been leaked.

What are they waiting for?


Sorry, but you can't claim with any degree of certainty that evidence would already have been leaked. That is an impossible claim to make. There is no logical way you can prove such a statement.



posted on Jun, 15 2017 @ 04:43 PM
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originally posted by: Lucidparadox
Trump colluded with Russia.

The chief admiral of the NSA confirmed it. He also stated they have hard evidence. recordings, documentation, etc.

The reason this isnt all out in the open right now, and why everyone is running around throwing circumstantial evidence out there..

Is that the hard evidence was most likely obtained illegally by NSA spying programs.

Everyone knows the truth, but they are forced to find other evidence and other ways to prove it because the actual evidence isnt usable.


Golly that's some great fiction right there. You should write a book or something. An espionage thriller perhaps?
edit on -050004pm6kpm by Ohanka because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 15 2017 @ 04:44 PM
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a reply to: ColdWisdom

Maybe they are waiting for Trump's 2020 election?



posted on Jun, 15 2017 @ 04:45 PM
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a reply to: allsee4eye


Why does everyone say it is trump who colluded with the Russians? I do not think trump PERSONALLY colluded, but I think he knew what was happening, and some of his team did collude. So the FBI says trump is not personally under investigation, is not the same as saying his team is not.


That being said, I believe Comey 100%, and the FBI does have a Russia investigation going on (omg, please people stop thinking and saying there isn't, don't be ignorant). Now, on to trump, trump does not ask God for forgiveness here is the link....www.businessinsider.com...


So if trump does not even ask god for forgiveness(and that is his ABSALUTE right) why would he have any problem lying under oath anyway??.....When swore in they say "So help you God", well he does not respect God enough to ask him for forgiveness, (again no prob with that) he could very easily lie under oath, as he does daily anyway. It makes no difference if HE is under oath, he lies so much anyway.


edit on 15-6-2017 by kurthall because: (no reason given)

edit on 15-6-2017 by kurthall because: fix

edit on 15-6-2017 by kurthall because: add



posted on Jun, 15 2017 @ 04:53 PM
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a reply to: kurthall

What is Trump's goal of colluding with Russia? To get universal healthcare from Russia? That would do wonders to his legacy.
edit on 15-6-2017 by allsee4eye because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 15 2017 @ 05:39 PM
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a reply to: allsee4eye

The NSA can prove it if it happened. I wouldn't trust Trump testifying under oath.



posted on Jun, 15 2017 @ 06:39 PM
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a reply to: allsee4eye


Did you read what I said? I said I do NOT think trump PERSONALLY Collude with the Russians. However Some of his team MAY have and they are under investigation. Flynn for one. The Russians wanted trump to win over Hillary, that is why they tried to influence the election. The fact is whether any of trumps team knew details or not about how the Russians hacked our systems they DID hack us. Comey told you that, the FBI certainly is not denying it. trump, who should be wanting to get to the bottom of how Russians were trying to affect our election , and impede our democracy, instead he says its FAKE NEWS, and points to Hillary.


On another note. trumps approval rating is 39%.


edit on 15-6-2017 by kurthall because: add



posted on Jun, 15 2017 @ 06:43 PM
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a reply to: allsee4eye



Hahaha, did you read how much MORE health care is going to cost you under the new bill?????? Also I am pretty sure in Russia, you have health care, but it is CRAP. Waiting lists, and yada yada. Canada has a MUCH better system than Russia. Why don't you go to Russia, get sick and see how that goes for you.




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