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Went to a local mosque and this is what I overheard being taught to young Muslims

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posted on Jun, 12 2017 @ 11:03 AM
link   

originally posted by: BHAWWWK

originally posted by: 23432

originally posted by: destination now
a reply to: 23432

Well that was totally scripted, bears no relation to the shuffling women dressed head to toe in black that I've seen in areas of the UK, let alone Saudi..they can't even go out on their own.

And of course, totally ignores my question, which was not about hijabs, it was about segregation and separate entrances, how is that empowering?

ETA I prefer to walk through the front door, with my head held high, and be accepted and welcomed into a place as an equal, that, to me, is empowerment.


I disagree.

The issue here is Islam's allowance of Privatisation of Female Sexuality .

The female sexuality used as a commodity and Islam allows women to have an opt out .

Separation and segregation of sexes are both designed to create an enviroment where the faithfull have no distractions and can focus on being one with God .

You may visit any muslim family and can see whole families preying together .



The video you provided is a conveniently wrapped up narrative for the Hijab in modern 21st century society with a pro-feminism bow on top.

We all know that the Hijab, Niqab and Burka have been around much longer than 2001 and the reason why they were worn had absolutely nothing to do with "women's empowerment". We also know that The Daily Show is a Liberal propaganda machine.

In other words, that was a poor choice on your end as an explanation to someones sincere question.

If you, yourself had asked them to explain a Trump Administration policy you disagreed with and they provided you with a YouTube clip of someone on the Sean Hannity show giving an explanation as their answer, would you take it at face value?

I strongly doubt it.

I'm disappointed in you, don't let it happen again.


Hijab pre-dates islam and the reasons for it's invention and usage of it is well documented .

For example Jewish Hijab or Persian Hijab are well documented ; just like Christian Sharia and Hijab .

I am a man and i don't presume to tell women to cover or not ; it is Islam that tells women to cover and leaves the limits of coverage to the woman concerned .

Do some men force Hijab on some women ?

Doo-ooh , of course some men do it but it is not the norm but exception.

Strange as it might seem to the uninitiated , it is other women who applies the pressure to comply .

This is a " power play " between Women if you like and a covered Women sometimes will act as if the uncovered Women are not worthy .

In other words they pass judgement ; like normal humans do to one another all the time .

Islam says no compulsion in religion and every individual will account for their bad deeds in the afterlife .

Anyhow ; I doubt any of what I wrote will make a difference to you .

You might as well listen to Muslim Heavy Metal while pondering your next " put down " ?







posted on Jun, 12 2017 @ 11:13 AM
link   

originally posted by: 23432

originally posted by: BHAWWWK

originally posted by: 23432

originally posted by: destination now
a reply to: 23432

Well that was totally scripted, bears no relation to the shuffling women dressed head to toe in black that I've seen in areas of the UK, let alone Saudi..they can't even go out on their own.

And of course, totally ignores my question, which was not about hijabs, it was about segregation and separate entrances, how is that empowering?

ETA I prefer to walk through the front door, with my head held high, and be accepted and welcomed into a place as an equal, that, to me, is empowerment.


I disagree.

The issue here is Islam's allowance of Privatisation of Female Sexuality .

The female sexuality used as a commodity and Islam allows women to have an opt out .

Separation and segregation of sexes are both designed to create an enviroment where the faithfull have no distractions and can focus on being one with God .

You may visit any muslim family and can see whole families preying together .



The video you provided is a conveniently wrapped up narrative for the Hijab in modern 21st century society with a pro-feminism bow on top.

We all know that the Hijab, Niqab and Burka have been around much longer than 2001 and the reason why they were worn had absolutely nothing to do with "women's empowerment". We also know that The Daily Show is a Liberal propaganda machine.

In other words, that was a poor choice on your end as an explanation to someones sincere question.

If you, yourself had asked them to explain a Trump Administration policy you disagreed with and they provided you with a YouTube clip of someone on the Sean Hannity show giving an explanation as their answer, would you take it at face value?

I strongly doubt it.

I'm disappointed in you, don't let it happen again.



Anyhow ; I doubt any of what I wrote will make a difference to you .



I could be mistaken but I am fairly confident that no one involved in this thread (that includes you) is an authority on Islamic law, doctrine and so forth.

You will Interpret it one way and others will Interpret it in another.

In reality nobody has gained any ground in this entire discussion. Those with like minded beliefs ban together in their tribes on either side and resume the US vs THEM mentality.

If one thing is clear then it is none of this makes any difference to anybody involved with this thread.
edit on 12-6-2017 by BHAWWWK because: ...



posted on Jun, 12 2017 @ 11:16 AM
link   

originally posted by: BHAWWWK

originally posted by: 23432

originally posted by: BHAWWWK

originally posted by: 23432

originally posted by: destination now
a reply to: 23432

Well that was totally scripted, bears no relation to the shuffling women dressed head to toe in black that I've seen in areas of the UK, let alone Saudi..they can't even go out on their own.

And of course, totally ignores my question, which was not about hijabs, it was about segregation and separate entrances, how is that empowering?

ETA I prefer to walk through the front door, with my head held high, and be accepted and welcomed into a place as an equal, that, to me, is empowerment.


I disagree.

The issue here is Islam's allowance of Privatisation of Female Sexuality .

The female sexuality used as a commodity and Islam allows women to have an opt out .

Separation and segregation of sexes are both designed to create an enviroment where the faithfull have no distractions and can focus on being one with God .

You may visit any muslim family and can see whole families preying together .



The video you provided is a conveniently wrapped up narrative for the Hijab in modern 21st century society with a pro-feminism bow on top.

We all know that the Hijab, Niqab and Burka have been around much longer than 2001 and the reason why they were worn had absolutely nothing to do with "women's empowerment". We also know that The Daily Show is a Liberal propaganda machine.

In other words, that was a poor choice on your end as an explanation to someones sincere question.

If you, yourself had asked them to explain a Trump Administration policy you disagreed with and they provided you with a YouTube clip of someone on the Sean Hannity show giving an explanation as their answer, would you take it at face value?

I strongly doubt it.

I'm disappointed in you, don't let it happen again.



Anyhow ; I doubt any of what I wrote will make a difference to you .



I could be mistaken but I am fairly confident that no one involved in this thread (that includes you) is an authority on Islamic law, doctrine and so forth.

You will Interpret it one way and others will Interpret it in another.

In reality nobody has gained any ground in this entire discussion. Those with like minded beliefs ban together in their tribes on either side and resume the US vs THEM mentality.

If one thing is clear then it is none of this makes any difference to anybody involved with this thread.



if any reader has learnt the true meaning of Taqiyya by reading this thread than it is a result ; if not , it's just digital currency anyway .

Islam means Peace .



posted on Jun, 12 2017 @ 11:25 AM
link   
a reply to: 23432

What something means can be very different than what something is.



posted on Jun, 12 2017 @ 11:30 AM
link   

originally posted by: BHAWWWK
a reply to: 23432

What something means can be very different than what something is.


when in doubt , do some research and use critical thinking to question the narrative .

mohammed married a 9 years old girl is what everyone gets to hear .

they never ask what happened to the girl in question .

that's because " they " were never interested in the well being of the girl to begin with .

mohammed and the girl remained married for life and mohammed died in her lap .

walks like a duck , talks like a duck ; it is usually a duck .
edit on 12-6-2017 by 23432 because: (no reason given)

edit on 12-6-2017 by 23432 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 12 2017 @ 11:36 AM
link   
a reply to: 23432

I do know what happened to Aisha. I read "After the Prophet: The Epic Story of the Shia-Sunni Split in Islam" by Lesley Hazleton

Extremely fascinating read.



posted on Jun, 12 2017 @ 11:54 AM
link   

originally posted by: BHAWWWK
a reply to: 23432

I do know what happened to Aisha. I read "After the Prophet: The Epic Story of the Shia-Sunni Split in Islam" by Lesley Hazleton

Extremely fascinating read.


Well in that case you are rare breed .



posted on Jun, 12 2017 @ 12:57 PM
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Our actions matter - before you choose to be mean, think about whether the other person may be having a tough time



posted on Jun, 13 2017 @ 05:38 PM
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Well....all I have to say about it is....

1. I'm not religious. I do not find myself preferring any religion over any other religion.

2. I do believe in freedom of religion....within reason. I mean if your religion is that people should be killed for not being agreeable to your religion that's not a religion anymore. That's a mob or a gang or something.

3. Young Muslims may or may not be taught to be violent and aggressive and angry but I'm not a huge believer in coincidence when the same thing happens over and over and over. When you've got crazy people running around killing people with swords and knives and basically anything they can get their hands on and yelling about Allah, that's not a coincidence. That's not an accident. That's not an individual who is interpreting their religion the wrong way. There has to have been some kind of organized effort to cause these people to behave in this way. Some of it can be explained away by the copycat phenomenon but not all of it. At some point you have to ask yourself why they don't just stop doing it. "Hey. This is kinda making us look bad. We probably aren't going to accomplish anything by doing it more". They should not have to tell their followers murder is wrong.

4. Possibly, the media should use a little more discretion about sensationalizing crazy behavior and religious murder. I mean I guess you can never be too sure how people will respond to what they see in the media. Unfortunately.


5. By the same token, I'm sure there are people out there who are loving every minute of this whole mess. They've been trying to end freedom for decades and now they have an excuse. All they have to do is sit back and wait for people to get tired of the body count.



posted on Jun, 13 2017 @ 05:52 PM
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a reply to: BrianFlanders





By the same token, I'm sure there are people out there who are loving every minute of this whole mess. They've been trying to end freedom for decades and now they have an excuse. All they have to do is sit back and wait for people to get tired of the body count.


Thankfully the people that fit into that box are also a minority.



posted on Jun, 13 2017 @ 07:45 PM
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----





posted on Jun, 13 2017 @ 08:26 PM
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originally posted by: hopenotfeariswhatweneed
a reply to: BrianFlanders





By the same token, I'm sure there are people out there who are loving every minute of this whole mess. They've been trying to end freedom for decades and now they have an excuse. All they have to do is sit back and wait for people to get tired of the body count.


Thankfully the people that fit into that box are also a minority.


Unfortunately, the people who control the world are also a minority. It doesn't stop them from getting what they want.



posted on Jun, 15 2017 @ 07:29 PM
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that's all well and good, but small consolation in the face of a significant percentage of Muslims who are not terrorists by profession yet advocate terrorist acts... this is no radical fringe, this is a sizeable 25-40%, depending on the country... and while the numbers are smaller you still have an overwhelming percentage of Muslims, compared to other religions, that actually perpetrate the attacks... it's not even close...

I can't imagine what it's like being a Muslim of the mindset at the church you visited... I think it's reasonable to assume they are in the majority... yet unlike other religions where indeed there are crimes and attacks committed by a follower, that's just it, it's a single follower, few and far between and an infinitesimal percentage... I would find it difficult being associated with a religion where well over a third of the membership was made up of people who condone killing in "defense" of Islam...




posted on Jun, 17 2017 @ 08:46 AM
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Wrong, 23432 is an expert and presumes to tell others what they should believe and what they should think, has spent the last week or so presumably camping out in this thread doing exactly that.

Makes remarks like "if you were educated" when he really means "if you were as smart as I believe I am" and other remarks like "to the uninitiated" meaning "those who are at least as initiated as I am"

He writes with authority and conviction on the subject...yet tells us islam means peace when it means submit.

I'm wary of anyone who defends any retarded belief system with such conviction.

The need for religious belief is retarded...pious, religoous people are mentally ill, they lack something, seek confirmation, there's something missing in their lives and they feel the need to fill it with mumbo jumbo, perform bizarre ceremonies and partake in crazy rituals.

It's a mental illness, I'd go as far as to say I find religious zealots even more unstable and unhinged than feverish transgenders. At least they have a cause, of sorts. I've no place in my life for nutters who think the magic sky man is there, watching them 24/7 like they're on some reality t.v show.

In my experience most religious people are trying to dupe the god they believe exists because they cherry pick the things they do and don't want to do...again it's the old, love easter and christmas bit, but can't be arsed with lent.

Pathetic.



posted on Jun, 17 2017 @ 09:15 AM
link   

originally posted by: 23432

originally posted by: BHAWWWK
a reply to: 23432

What something means can be very different than what something is.


when in doubt , do some research and use critical thinking to question the narrative .

mohammed married a 9 years old girl is what everyone gets to hear .

they never ask what happened to the girl in question .

that's because " they " were never interested in the well being of the girl to begin with .

mohammed and the girl remained married for life and mohammed died in her lap .

walks like a duck , talks like a duck ; it is usually a duck .


Here's a perfect example of how he is being deliberately misleading.

You got one thing right, nobody cares about her wellbeing, let me explain why - she's dead well over 1,000 years, there's nothing anyone can do about it now.

So you think that her being accustomed to her situation by the time she was an adult is somehow indicative of her acceptance, or that she enjoyed being made a sex slave?

Stockholm syndrome? I'd expect more from someone of your self-purported education.

Nope, nobody cares about her, you're right about that.

People care about now - the prophet is seen as someone to aspire to be like, they think mohammed was the perfect man and they see him as a leader and role model.

Couple that with recent revelations in the UK with the child sex rings being exposed...and the perpetrators? Would you Adam and Eve it?

So stop trying to justify and play down the kiddie fiddling aspects of the whole sordid affair like it's inconsequential...see, your rhetoric isn't exactly harmless, is it?

You've spend all of this thread attempting to twist things...islam means peace...really? In what context? Peace, as in...if you submit there will be peace? Give in? Don't struggle? Islam is peace if you're submissive.

Maybe islam wouldn't be such a problem if it wasn't so ambiguous...and if people like you weren't around to try and spin it in such a way, unfortunately for you this schtick no longer works...people are wise to your act. Someone who is as self congratulatory and clever as you ought to have figured it out by now.



posted on Jun, 17 2017 @ 10:07 AM
link   

originally posted by: LungFuMoShi

originally posted by: 23432

originally posted by: BHAWWWK
a reply to: 23432

What something means can be very different than what something is.


when in doubt , do some research and use critical thinking to question the narrative .

mohammed married a 9 years old girl is what everyone gets to hear .

they never ask what happened to the girl in question .

that's because " they " were never interested in the well being of the girl to begin with .

mohammed and the girl remained married for life and mohammed died in her lap .

walks like a duck , talks like a duck ; it is usually a duck .


Here's a perfect example of how he is being deliberately misleading.

You got one thing right, nobody cares about her wellbeing, let me explain why - she's dead well over 1,000 years, there's nothing anyone can do about it now.

So you think that her being accustomed to her situation by the time she was an adult is somehow indicative of her acceptance, or that she enjoyed being made a sex slave?

Stockholm syndrome? I'd expect more from someone of your self-purported education.

Nope, nobody cares about her, you're right about that.

People care about now - the prophet is seen as someone to aspire to be like, they think mohammed was the perfect man and they see him as a leader and role model.

Couple that with recent revelations in the UK with the child sex rings being exposed...and the perpetrators? Would you Adam and Eve it?

So stop trying to justify and play down the kiddie fiddling aspects of the whole sordid affair like it's inconsequential...see, your rhetoric isn't exactly harmless, is it?

You've spend all of this thread attempting to twist things...islam means peace...really? In what context? Peace, as in...if you submit there will be peace? Give in? Don't struggle? Islam is peace if you're submissive.

Maybe islam wouldn't be such a problem if it wasn't so ambiguous...and if people like you weren't around to try and spin it in such a way, unfortunately for you this schtick no longer works...people are wise to your act. Someone who is as self congratulatory and clever as you ought to have figured it out by now.



Islam is clear in it's message ; there is a higher power that created everything and deserves your love because of it .

That " fiddled kiddie " , as you so eloquently put it , goes to live a full life and she has had and still has far more power than most will ever have .
You are re-writing her existence to suit your narrative ; you are going against the " Truth " .

Quran says marriage is only valid if it's between consenting adults and sex in marriage also requires consent too .
In your imagination there exists a " child sex slave " while the reality is the individual concerned was an adult according to the norms & laws of the " Natural World " .

In your opinion Muhammed was acting againts the very religion he was preaching ?

And no one noticed it last 1400 years ?



These are laughable arguments that solemnly relies of sophistry ,indeed .

Sophistry works best if the audience is ignorant of the given subject and this thread demonstrates the danger of having an opinion without having knowledge .

In your mind , it seems that the muslim males are just pedo supporting perverts and muslim females are victims .

Such a simplistic World View is not only shallow and lacks understanding ; it is also dangerous for Humanity on the whole .

Gender Revisionism is as bad as any other type of Revisionism .

Uneducated and Uninitiated on this thread will argue in favour of known lies and fabrications ; their narrative is set up to function anti Islamic ; it is expected , this is by and large a US audience after all .

Both Atheism and Polytheism are illogical belief systems .

Oriental wisdom says ;

Feminist till a husband comes along and Atheist till the plane starts to go down .


And those who believe and do good works: such are rightful owners of the Garden. They will abide therein.

Bakara 82 .





You may argue against Muhammed Ali and expect to be taken as someone more knowledgeable about being muslims and American ; good luck with that narrative.





edit on 17-6-2017 by 23432 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 17 2017 @ 10:16 AM
link   

originally posted by: 23432

originally posted by: LungFuMoShi

originally posted by: 23432

originally posted by: BHAWWWK
a reply to: 23432

What something means can be very different than what something is.


when in doubt , do some research and use critical thinking to question the narrative .

mohammed married a 9 years old girl is what everyone gets to hear .

they never ask what happened to the girl in question .

that's because " they " were never interested in the well being of the girl to begin with .

mohammed and the girl remained married for life and mohammed died in her lap .

walks like a duck , talks like a duck ; it is usually a duck .


Here's a perfect example of how he is being deliberately misleading.

You got one thing right, nobody cares about her wellbeing, let me explain why - she's dead well over 1,000 years, there's nothing anyone can do about it now.

So you think that her being accustomed to her situation by the time she was an adult is somehow indicative of her acceptance, or that she enjoyed being made a sex slave?

Stockholm syndrome? I'd expect more from someone of your self-purported education.

Nope, nobody cares about her, you're right about that.

People care about now - the prophet is seen as someone to aspire to be like, they think mohammed was the perfect man and they see him as a leader and role model.

Couple that with recent revelations in the UK with the child sex rings being exposed...and the perpetrators? Would you Adam and Eve it?

So stop trying to justify and play down the kiddie fiddling aspects of the whole sordid affair like it's inconsequential...see, your rhetoric isn't exactly harmless, is it?

You've spend all of this thread attempting to twist things...islam means peace...really? In what context? Peace, as in...if you submit there will be peace? Give in? Don't struggle? Islam is peace if you're submissive.

Maybe islam wouldn't be such a problem if it wasn't so ambiguous...and if people like you weren't around to try and spin it in such a way, unfortunately for you this schtick no longer works...people are wise to your act. Someone who is as self congratulatory and clever as you ought to have figured it out by now.



Islam is clear in it's message ; there is a higher power that created everything and deserves your love because of it .

That " fiddled kiddie " , as you so eloquently put it , goes to live a full life and she has far more power than you will ever have .

Quran says marriage is only valid if it's between consenting adults and sex in marriage also requires consent too .
In your imagination there exists a " child sex slave " while the reality is the individual concerned was an adult according to the norms & laws of the " Natural World " .

In your opinion Muhammed was acting againts the very religion he was preaching ?

And no one noticed it last 1400 years ?



These are laughable arguments that solemnly relies of sophistry ,indeed .

Sophistry works best if the audience is ignorant of the given subject and this thread demonstrates the danger of having an opinion without having knowledge .

In your mind , it seems that the muslim males are just pedo supporting perverts and muslim females are victims .

Such a simplistic World View is not only shallow and lacks understanding ; it is also dangerous for Humanity on the whole .

Gender Revisionism is as bad as any other type of Revisionism .

Uneducated and Uninitiated on this thread will argue in favour of known lies and fabrications ; their narrative is set up to function anti Islamic ; it is expected , this is by and large a US audience after all .

Both Atheism and Polytheism are illogical belief systems .

Oriental wisdom says ;

Feminist till a husband comes along and Atheist till the plane starts to go down .


And those who believe and do good works: such are rightful owners of the Garden. They will abide therein.

Bakara 82 .





You may argue against Muhammed Ali and expect to be taken as someone more knowledgeable about being muslims and American ; good luck with that narrative.






And now you presume to tell me what's in my mind...you're going all-out here to defend the pedophilic relationship of a man and 9 year old girl...you can spend all day arguing your points but at the end of the day you're just some dude on a forum trying to justify pedophilia.

Do you genuinely think a girl of such a young age is capable of giving consent?

I suppose that, if a middle aged man wants to marry a girl of 9 in the modern day, it should be up to the child whether or not they get married, then?

What exactly are you trying to say, here?

Lastly, don't put words into my mouth, I didn't say all muslims were pedo's. The sad fact is that most of them don't even know anything about their chosen prophet - I made that clear, didn't I? Most of them are frauds, pious frauds who pretend to be something they're not...hence my claim they're trying to trick god, or think they can outsmart or outwit god.

No, they ain't all pedo's, you said that not me. But if they were to be perfect muslims, if they spent their lives trying to really be like their prophet then a lot more of them would be.

I ain't no fan of christianity, either. But at least their hero didn't do half the crap this monster mohammed did. Jesus never cut nayones head off, or molested children. Christians are still maniacs in spite of it, so it's hardly surprising the them's what follow a psychopath are more likely to become one.

Congratulations to you, though. In your attempt to be pious and self-righteous you've shown us all your true nature, not only do you defend a disgusting belief adn political system, but you also are an advocate for child molestation...and quite unashamedly, I might add.

Must be awesome being you.

Lastly...nice avatar, it don't suit you. A grubby old man wearig nothing but a dirty mac might be more suitable.



posted on Jun, 17 2017 @ 10:27 AM
link   
Lastly, I just want to highlight something for you...maybe you're not as clever as you seem to think.

I'm always pretty wary of folk who proclaim themselves to be clever and it's oozing out of everything you post.

Atheism is not an illogical belief system, that makes zero sense. Atheism is the lack of a belief system...and what is illogical to you and whoever else you care to quote isn't necessarily illogical to all else.

You need to get over yourself...I suggest you take time out from ATS, you've spent the last 6 or 7 days in this thread massaging your own ego. A small period of self reflection might be in order.

Someone of your education shouldn't have too much trouble with that, ask yourself what you're hoping to achieve here and why you've failed so epically after such a long period of effort.

The answers will come to you, don't go looking for it in memes. You seem to rely too much on memes, perhaps you'd do better on 4chan or reddit.



posted on Jun, 17 2017 @ 10:29 AM
link   
You carry on arguing about Islam not meaning peace .


In the mean time ;





And here is my actual inspiration in taking part in this thread ;




These two men are admired by almost ALL of the World Population .

You are just an ignorant user who want to bash religion .




Peace , ehm , I mean Islam of course .


edit on 17-6-2017 by 23432 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 17 2017 @ 10:41 AM
link   

originally posted by: LungFuMoShi
Lastly, I just want to highlight something for you...maybe you're not as clever as you seem to think.

I'm always pretty wary of folk who proclaim themselves to be clever and it's oozing out of everything you post.

Atheism is not an illogical belief system, that makes zero sense.



Please , you need to stop your sillyness ; you are now arguing against the encyclopedia / dictionary definitions .

Why ?

Because you can't bring yourself to admit that Islam means Peace ?

When confronted with an overwhelming evience ; unbias people usually concede whereus you get wilder with your accusations .

According to you Gandi and Muhammed Ali are pedo supporting or clueless about Islam .

Gandi is not even muslim for crying out loud !!!

Stop hitting your head on the wall with Atheistic world view ; literally you are arguing against a dictionary and if I reply that you are " Literally Incorrect " than you will take this as some type of smugness ?

Drop that chip off of your shoulder if you want a debate ; if not , carry on believing whatever you want to and carry on arguing against encyclopedias / dictionaries .



edit on 17-6-2017 by 23432 because: (no reason given)

edit on 17-6-2017 by 23432 because: (no reason given)



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