Let's talk about the newest religion: scientism

a reply to: firefromabove

While the scientific method is a legitimate process to learn about the world around us, scientism is the cult based on the idea that science has all the answers to life

But does this cult actually exist? I'm sure there are a few crackpots who believe science has all the answers -- every mad idea has a few crackpots to embrace it -- but I don't see any evidence of widespread scientism. Certainly no scientifically literate person can believe that science has all the answers. Every field of inquiry has its well-known unknowns.

Science has never claimed to have all the answers, that's the whole point of science. A negative result is just as illuminating as a positive result.

Props for spending so much time coming up with a bunch of nonsense to justify believing in an invisible, non-existent being who can conjure rainbows on command though.

a reply to: firefromabove

Science isn't a religion. And it doesn't attempt to prove the 'why' of things, only the 'how'. There are other branches of human sciences call psychology, sociology and philosophy that do that better.

However, I have *faith*, that if I jump out of a cliff, I will die when I hit the ground 100meters below. I believe that, even though I won't attempt it. Why do I have faith? Because the underlying principles behind my *faith* are demonstrable and provable, others can replicate the experiment with similar results (ie: gravity, acceleration, material sciences, biology, etc).

Religion has no such capability.

Another good example of why I have *faith* in science has been said by many others over the years....

If a great human tragedy hit the Earth and we lost ALL books, everything, both religious and science - in 1000 years, there would be completely different religious tomes about, praising this god or that god, this magical demon or some crazy sky fairy. They would not be the same and completely different to what exists now and before. Just as we have so many hundreds of religions that have come and gone.

Yet all the books on science would be the same. All the same results, all the same facts. Gravity would be gravity, physics, biology, chemistry, maths -- all the same.

So if you want to claim that science is a 'religion' - fine. But at least it's one that can prove itself.

Religion has no such capability.

originally posted by: firefromabove
While the scientific method is a legitimate process to learn about the world around us, scientism is the cult based on the idea that science has all the answers to life

Science doesnt know the origin of life.
Science doesnt know life after death experience.
Science doesnt know most paranormal activities.
Science doesnt know a lot of things.
But science today know a lot more, how things work compared to thousand years age religions.

originally posted by: firefromabove
It masquerades as logic and reason but in reality is a belief system in and of itself

What reality is that? Your Imigination?

originally posted by: firefromabove
1. It has its own creation myth: big bang, an explosion created everything, planets formed over billions of years, and life popped into existence which then "evolved" into the life we see around us

It's a theory. You can challenge a theory.

originally posted by: firefromabove
2. It has its own "prophets" and "saints": men like Darwin, Einstein, Newton, Eratosthenes, Carl Sagan, Neil deGrass Tyson, Bill Nye, Richard Dawkins etc. (Science be upon them) Its blasphemous to even question their claims or disagree on even the tiniest aspect of their " science".

I question them all the time. And I continue to question them.

originally posted by: firefromabove
3. It has its own versions of "magical sky fairies": these are fantastical creatures like ape men, dinosaurs, and trillions of unknown transitional forms that have never been discovered, but are believed to have existed.

Bone from the past. Tested and tested for age verification many times. Proven evidence and peer reviewed by others.
Magical sky fairies do not have bones for verification.

originally posted by: firefromabove
4. it also claims the existence of heavens containing other worlds and strange objects like black holes, white dwarves, red giants, brown dwarves

Get yourself a telescope.

originally posted by: firefromabove
5. It also has its own class of priests: these are the scientists who have exclusive access to instruments the commoners cannot dream of looking at.

Commoners can access telescope, microscope, library, laboratary and medical equipment, etc for educational purpose.

originally posted by: firefromabove
The priest class also act as oracles, who just happen to know everything - the age of the universe, the distance of a star, the speed at which the galaxy is moving, what's in the core of a planet millions of miles away, what it rains on a planet in a differential solar system and so on.

Compared to religious priest who know nothing at all, but mass controlled, mass destruction, and bootlicking their honorable Kings for power and wealth? Compared to religious priest who know nothing at all, but their false divination above all human,to defy God?

originally posted by: firefromabove
The commoners dare not question the priests methods. They also do not understand any of the equations that the priest class scrawl on black boards. " it must be true because these guys won't lie"

Like I said, I question them all. Both Darwin and Einstein has been proven wrong on some cases. No one is perfect. No theories is flawless. Pitman has been proven to be the greatest hoaxes in evolutionary history. Science quickly adapt to changes.

originally posted by: firefromabove
6. It has its own holy scriptures: books like Origin of species, the selfish gene, a brief history of time and the countless papers on evolutionism and mainstream science.

Hah. Darwinism is not a mainstream science. If you have better theory, why dont you make your own book? It's perfectly legal. I'd love to read your challenge to the Origin of Species.

originally posted by: firefromabove
I'll stop here for now. Its a fact that scientism is not objective truth. Its a cult based on a belief system. It does not permit dissent. It punishes it with ostracism and defamation.

The fact is that you will die if you do not breath oxigen, an O2 atom. That is science.
Religion do not teach you that. Religion teach you God's love and obediency or you will burnt in Hell. That's a pathetic fact.

originally posted by: firefromabove
This is the new religion of scientism.

Welcome to death of blinded faith.

Science isn't a religion, it's based on evidence not faith, it evolves and changes as new data and discoveries emerge. Science doesn't have 'preists' that are unquestionable, for example you list Newton and Einstein despite the Theory of General Relativity coming solely from finding gaps in Newton's Third Law when studying the wobble of mecury's orbit. Scientific data is openly and readily published for transparency; if you are unnable to understand or interpret it you only have yourself to blame for not educating yourself in mathematics and science, all it takes is time and effort.

originally posted by: firefromabove
a reply to: Woodcarver

I said scientism is a religion and made a long post substantiating why

Sure but it is a really dumb point.

a reply to: firefromabove

Well, yes, the religion of science has its faults in that it is a product of humans. And much of it makes good sense and/can be proven. Contrast that sturdyness with the vagaries of a god religion of any sort, and there is a clear winner for some one that walks up on the argument with having neither side at heart.

I suggest that you move on up the scale of scientific possibilities to where it starts edging into concepts of the universe being a mass consciousness, etc. That concept, to use an old metaphor, almost "touches the face of God" to my way of thinking.

originally posted by: Kandinsky

originally posted by: SaturnFX
I always find it ironic and amusing to read the anti-science folks...on the internet.
Carry on. Every nation needs people to dig ditches.

Have you watched or read Gaiman's 'American Gods?' It's a great show involving all of mankind's gods fighting for our attention as they need to be relevant. Given a choice between the old Abrahamic God, the Hindu pantheon or the gods of 'scientism,' I'd favour the lab coated gods of the latter.

Infant mortality, plagues and candle-power are all the Old God offers and even candle-light was arguably a scientific discovery. No, let's put our lot in with scientism and enjoy freedom of travel, longevity and all the luxuries we take for granted.

Indeed
Although, I imagine Venus would have a chance to convert me after a few drinks

Sounds like a neat premise. Ill have to look it up. I like Gaiman also. decent writer.

originally posted by: EasternShadow

originally posted by: firefromabove
While the scientific method is a legitimate process to learn about the world around us, scientism is the cult based on the idea that science has all the answers to life

Science doesnt know the origin of life.
Science doesnt know life after death experience.
Science doesnt know most paranormal activities.
Science doesnt know a lot of things.
But science today know a lot more, how things work compared to thousand years age religions.

originally posted by: firefromabove
It masquerades as logic and reason but in reality is a belief system in and of itself

What reality is that? Your Imigination?

originally posted by: firefromabove
1. It has its own creation myth: big bang, an explosion created everything, planets formed over billions of years, and life popped into existence which then "evolved" into the life we see around us

It's a theory. You can challenge a theory.

originally posted by: firefromabove
2. It has its own "prophets" and "saints": men like Darwin, Einstein, Newton, Eratosthenes, Carl Sagan, Neil deGrass Tyson, Bill Nye, Richard Dawkins etc. (Science be upon them) Its blasphemous to even question their claims or disagree on even the tiniest aspect of their " science".

I question them all the time. And I continue to question them.

originally posted by: firefromabove
3. It has its own versions of "magical sky fairies": these are fantastical creatures like ape men, dinosaurs, and trillions of unknown transitional forms that have never been discovered, but are believed to have existed.

Bone from the past. Tested and tested for age verification many times. Proven evidence and peer reviewed by others.
Magical sky fairies do not have bones for verification.

originally posted by: firefromabove
4. it also claims the existence of heavens containing other worlds and strange objects like black holes, white dwarves, red giants, brown dwarves

Get yourself a telescope.

originally posted by: firefromabove
5. It also has its own class of priests: these are the scientists who have exclusive access to instruments the commoners cannot dream of looking at.

Commoners can access telescope, microscope, library, laboratary and medical equipment, etc for educational purpose.

originally posted by: firefromabove
The priest class also act as oracles, who just happen to know everything - the age of the universe, the distance of a star, the speed at which the galaxy is moving, what's in the core of a planet millions of miles away, what it rains on a planet in a differential solar system and so on.

Compared to religious priest who know nothing at all, but mass controlled, mass destruction, and bootlicking their honorable Kings for power and wealth? Compared to religious priest who know nothing at all, but their false divination above all human,to defy God?

originally posted by: firefromabove
The commoners dare not question the priests methods. They also do not understand any of the equations that the priest class scrawl on black boards. " it must be true because these guys won't lie"

Like I said, I question them all. Both Darwin and Einstein has been proven wrong on some cases. No one is perfect. No theories is flawless. Pitman has been proven to be the greatest hoaxes in evolutionary history. Science quickly adapt to changes.

originally posted by: firefromabove
6. It has its own holy scriptures: books like Origin of species, the selfish gene, a brief history of time and the countless papers on evolutionism and mainstream science.

Hah. Darwinism is not a mainstream science. If you have better theory, why dont you make your own book? It's perfectly legal. I'd love to read your challenge to the Origin of Species.

originally posted by: firefromabove
I'll stop here for now. Its a fact that scientism is not objective truth. Its a cult based on a belief system. It does not permit dissent. It punishes it with ostracism and defamation.

The fact is that you will die if you do not breath oxigen, an O2 atom. That is science.
Religion do not teach you that. Religion teach you God's love and obediency or you will burnt in Hell. That's a pathetic fact.

originally posted by: firefromabove
This is the new religion of scientism.

Welcome to death of blinded faith.

Lol

a reply to: firefromabove

Lol

Care to share the joke?

this is a strawman thread.

an intentionally misrepresented proposition that is set up because it is easier to defeat than an opponent's real argument.

intentionally misrepresented model of science that is set up because it is easier to mock than actual science. please stop trying to insult our intelligence firefromabove, you embarrass yourself far more effectively than you do the scientific method.

When Science do not follow the data and ignore information since it does not fit the story/model you want to create then the "Scientist" becomes faith driven fools.

"Scientist" could have been leaving pseudo science like psychology behind for real models on how information manifest within the brain and how information exchange between 2 separate brains is possible thru entanglement.

Maybe they would learn something and know why people who go thru the Fear Amagydala overload get a low level bliss state in their nerve system and start to be able to sense energy vibration/information to a higher degree than a person in a body who have not changed the function of the Amagydala.

Will be interesting to see how objective science will evolve the next 300 years.

Many "Scientist" say OOB is impossible. Maybe they should become Scientists and solve how the mechanism work on quantum level thru entanglement.

a reply to: noonebutme

So if you want to claim that science is a 'religion' - fine. But at least it's one that can prove itself. Religion has no such capability.

Depends on if the religion is awareness based or faith based.

“If scientific analysis were conclusively to demonstrate certain claims in Buddhism to be false, then we must accept the findings of science and abandon those claims.”

Dalai Lama

When Science is done right it is awareness based counter to faith based.

a reply to: firefromabove

I think there are SOME people who treat science as a religion. There are those who blur the line between scientific THEORY and scientific FACT, but most do nothing of the sort. There are many, many "men of science" who are also devotees of religions other than "Scientism".

I do get where you are going with this though. It is a popular trend today for those of a certain age group to treat science in the manner you have described. I chalk it all up to scrolling through way too may memes on social media.

originally posted by: GeauxHomeYoureDrunk
a reply to: firefromabove

I think there are SOME people who treat science as a religion. There are those who blur the line between scientific THEORY and scientific FACT, but most do nothing of the sort. There are many, many "men of science" who are also devotees of religions other than "Scientism".

I do get where you are going with this though. It is a popular trend today for those of a certain age group to treat science in the manner you have described. I chalk it all up to scrolling through way too may memes on social media.

so what you are saying is...the problem is with people religiously buying into science and not science behaving religiously. subtle difference but one worth noting. the same difference as blaming dumb people for misusing guns instead of blaming gun manufacturers for giving them the opportunity.

a reply to: Woodcarver

ha! He's only been here since Jan 2017. Care to share?

a reply to: Kandinsky

Hey I'm all for science but this?

I'd favour thelab coated gods of the latter. Infant mortality, plaguesand candle-power are all the Old God offers

With bio-warfare creations of the last century Jehovah was an amateur

a reply to: EasternShadow

The fact is that you will die if you do not breath oxigen, an O2 atom. That is science. Religion do not teach you that. Religion teach you God's love and obediency or you will burnt in Hell.

Is there oxygen in hell? How would a fire sustain itself?

a reply to: firefromabove

I have this for you OP.



Science may not be a religion so to speak. But one could
argue it's premise was founded in the garden.

originally posted by: randyvs
a reply to: firefromabove

I have this for you OP.

Science may not be a religion so to speak. But one could
argue it's premise was founded in the garden.

i will see your youtube video and raise you one.