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Europe should have never discarded its Christian identity

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posted on May, 14 2017 @ 05:05 PM
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a reply to: TerryDon79



We're on about the roots of a country. Not a celebration.

BTW, I'm from the UK. Our roots aren't from religion. It goes back a lot further than Christianity. So which roots should I follow?

Saxons?
Romans?
Vikings?
Neanderthal?


I don;t get your point here. I'm talking about the Christian identity, one that Europe is discarding wholesale.




posted on May, 14 2017 @ 05:07 PM
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a reply to: LesMisanthrope

You're the one who claimed that religions do good things, ignoring the people aspect. Ridiculous point indeed.
And another stupid question - "Do you think Christianity is better than Islam?" Ridiculous question. As it has been mentioned thousands of times here in this thread Islam is hundreds of years behind Christianity, so of course Christianity is better than Islam. Christianity had more time to mature.



People are led by the contents of their beliefs.

Then we're in trouble with the Muslim citizens here.



posted on May, 14 2017 @ 05:08 PM
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a reply to: LesMisanthrope

But a lot of countries have had multiple identities over the course of its years. Some religious, some not.

Just because the UK was Christian, doesn't mean it has to stay that way. Just like it didn't stay Roman, Saxon, Viking or Neanderthal.

Things change and so do countries.



posted on May, 14 2017 @ 05:18 PM
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a reply to: Deaf Alien




You're the one who claimed that religions do good things, ignoring the people aspect. Ridiculous point indeed.
And another stupid question - "Do you think Christianity is better than Islam?" Ridiculous question. As it has been mentioned thousands of times here in this thread Islam is hundreds of years behind Christianity, so of course Christianity is better than Islam. Christianity had more time to mature.

People are led by the contents of their beliefs.

Then we're in trouble with the Muslim citizens here.


This is the dumbest argument I have ever seen. "Ignoring the people aspect"? No you're ignoring the religious aspect. I'm quite aware that it is people that compose religions, but you refuse to mention the religious aspect or beliefs of these people—except when it comes to Submission.



posted on May, 14 2017 @ 05:20 PM
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a reply to: TerryDon79

Apply that thinking to the Native Americans, or Aztecs. "Hey, things change. No point in hanging on to your culture."



posted on May, 14 2017 @ 05:25 PM
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originally posted by: LesMisanthrope
a reply to: TerryDon79

Apply that thinking to the Native Americans, or Aztecs. "Hey, things change. No point in hanging on to your culture."


Why have you moved the goalposts from roots to culture?

They're 2 different things.

But if you think the UK should hold on to their roots, why are you saying Christian? Why not Pagan? The English were Pagans long before Christianity. Surely that's the real roots?



posted on May, 14 2017 @ 05:31 PM
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a reply to: TerryDon79




Why have you moved the goalposts from roots to culture?

They're 2 different things.

But if you think the UK should hold on to their roots, why are you saying Christian? Why not Pagan? The English were Pagans long before Christianity. Surely that's the real roots?


I never mentioned the UK once. This isn't a thread about paganism. Why will you avoid the argument?

You guys are tedious in trying to dance around the issue.



posted on May, 14 2017 @ 05:33 PM
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a reply to: LesMisanthrope

You have been igoring the people's aspect. And Mr. Sherlock I know people create religions. *Facepalm*
And submission means to submit to the will of Allah, just like Christians submit to the will of God (same thing actually).
Are you aware that most Muslims are not radical and do not try to make others submit? That's the people aspect.



posted on May, 14 2017 @ 05:35 PM
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originally posted by: LesMisanthrope
a reply to: TerryDon79




Why have you moved the goalposts from roots to culture?

They're 2 different things.

But if you think the UK should hold on to their roots, why are you saying Christian? Why not Pagan? The English were Pagans long before Christianity. Surely that's the real roots?


I never mentioned the UK once. This isn't a thread about paganism. Why will you avoid the argument?

You guys are tedious in trying to dance around the issue.



The threads about Europe. That would include the UK.

So this thread should only be about Christian roots and not anything before that? That would make it not about most countries roots.



posted on May, 14 2017 @ 05:36 PM
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a reply to: Deaf Alien

Islam means Submission in English. it doesn't mean "submit to the will of allah".

Why are you again talking about Islam? Are you aware this is a thread about Christianity?



posted on May, 14 2017 @ 05:40 PM
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a reply to: LesMisanthrope

The OP implied Muslims. And other posters have brought it up. So I assumed that you picked it up.
There are good and bad parts of every religion. You made Christianity out to be a shining beacon of all religons worldwide.



posted on May, 14 2017 @ 05:41 PM
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a reply to: TerryDon79




The threads about Europe. That would include the UK.

So this thread should only be about Christian roots and not anything before that? That would make it not about most countries roots.


This thread is about Europe. That would include the rest of Europe.

Yes this thread is about the Christian identity. Do you propose a pagan one? I think the last ones who tried that were the Nazis.



posted on May, 14 2017 @ 05:42 PM
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a reply to: Deaf Alien




There are good and bad parts of every religion. You made Christianity out to be a shining beacon of all religons worldwide.


I made it out to be at the core of the western identity, one that is better than all the rest. You mere played apologist for Submission.
edit on 14-5-2017 by LesMisanthrope because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 14 2017 @ 05:43 PM
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a reply to: LesMisanthrope

You mere played apologist for Pat Robertson and the Christians in Africa.
edit on 5/14/2017 by Deaf Alien because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 14 2017 @ 05:47 PM
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originally posted by: LesMisanthrope
a reply to: TerryDon79




The threads about Europe. That would include the UK.

So this thread should only be about Christian roots and not anything before that? That would make it not about most countries roots.


This thread is about Europe. That would include the rest of Europe.

Yes this thread is about the Christian identity. Do you propose a pagan one? I think the last ones who tried that were the Nazis.


Wow!

In a single page you've gone from roots to culture to identity. That's a hell of a goalpost move.

And I never said anything about changing europes identity to a pagan one. I said that's where it's religious roots are (mainly).

Actually, the Nazis are comparable to the OP by forcing all of Europe to be a specific religion (Christian) because it's their roots (even though it isn't).



posted on May, 14 2017 @ 05:49 PM
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a reply to: Deaf Alien



You mere played apologist for Pat Robertson and the Christians in Africa.


False. You merely mentioned their names. What am I supposed to do with that?



posted on May, 14 2017 @ 05:53 PM
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a reply to: TerryDon79



Wow!

In a single page you've gone from roots to culture to identity. That's a hell of a goalpost move.

And I never said anything about changing europes identity to a pagan one. I said that's where it's religious roots are (mainly).

Actually, the Nazis are comparable to the OP by forcing all of Europe to be a specific religion (Christian) because it's their roots (even though it isn't).


I don't think you know what widening the goalposts is. Equivocation, maybe, but the concepts are nearly interchangeable.

Is Christianity a part of Europe's roots? Is Christianity a part of European culture? Is Christianity a part of the European identity?
edit on 14-5-2017 by LesMisanthrope because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 14 2017 @ 05:58 PM
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originally posted by: LesMisanthrope
a reply to: TerryDon79



Wow!

In a single page you've gone from roots to culture to identity. That's a hell of a goalpost move.

And I never said anything about changing europes identity to a pagan one. I said that's where it's religious roots are (mainly).

Actually, the Nazis are comparable to the OP by forcing all of Europe to be a specific religion (Christian) because it's their roots (even though it isn't).


I don't think you know what widening the goalposts is. Equivocation, maybe, but the concepts are nearly interchangeable.
No they're not. None of them mean the same thing.


Is Christianity a part of Europe's roots?
A part of it, yes. Just like Paganism, slavery and a whole bunch of things that aren't relevant today.


Is Christianity a part of European culture?
Not really these days. There's been a massive shift AWAY from religious culture in many European countries.


Is Christianity a part of the European identity?
Not to all of the countries, no. Just look at the Nordic countries, for instance. Sure, Christianity had an influence, but that doesn't mean it's their identity.
edit on 1452017 by TerryDon79 because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 14 2017 @ 05:58 PM
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a reply to: LesMisanthrope

I am pointing out how ridiculous your argument is. You accuse me of being an Islam apologist, implying that I support radical Islam. So I pointed out that you being a Christianity apologist means that you support radical Christians.



posted on May, 14 2017 @ 06:09 PM
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a reply to: LesMisanthrope

Non of those discoveries or advancements came about due to Christianity, otherwise we'd have worked it all out long before. Considering much of what was "remembered" during the renaissance was worked on way before, by non-Christians.

I acknowledge a lot of the things Christianity has helped bring about, I apologise for not mentioning them. It wasn't my point, my point was it was humans that advanced us despite the carnage that so-called Christians have brought to the world.

See the problem with a lot of people and a lot of our history is that people need a doctrine to go by and in my personal opinion it's the indoctrination that has people not thinking for themselves, it's useful for thick people, it's useful for those seeking hard found answers, it's useful for a lot of things.

It doesn't make free thinking people though, people make free thinking people. Religion is not necessary for good people. Education is. Morals too.

I'm not bashing Christians, I was aiming to be respectful as I usually do.




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