How bad is obamacare for our nations families financially? Really bad.

a reply to: Dfairlite

Another unintended consequence of participating in Obamacare's Medicaid Expansion, is that the government can put a lien on your assets after you die, and were over age 55.

Source: www.cbsnews.com...

(If liberal CBS News is reporting this about ObamaCare, the asset recovery provision of Medicaid must be a serious concern.)

a reply to: carewemust

You can't stop fixing once you start....you start printing money to.fix that you have to print to fix this...you fix this that leaks. Two problems. Interventions unintended consequences and the speed of government's ability to evolve with society.

They are eternal constant problems in history though. As unique as we want to be it's the same as it ever was.

a reply to: Byrd

Sorry.

Even with subsidies, many of us could not afford the price gouging.
I could barely afford the premium.....and totally not afford the deductible in excess of $6000.00 per year.
We won't even talk about drug prices.

Who the hell decides what a person can and cannot afford, anyway?

a reply to: luthier

President Obama wanted Single Payer. But as he said, "We can't get there directly." So they developed a program that would spring so many leaks, Americans would eventually BEG for Universal Health Care.

For now, we put some more patches on ObamaCare, (renaming it to AHCA TrumpCare in the process).. but the transition to UHC is inevitable.

a reply to: carewemust

Why not look at the Swiss model? Before it's too late

Universal health care is not a problem. Single payer is.

Heck Germany's system would be better than that

a reply to: DontTreadOnMe

Merck, Pfizer etc

originally posted by: luthier
a reply to: carewemust

Why not look at the Swiss model? Before it's too late

Universal health care is not a problem. Single payer is.

Heck Germany's system would be better than that

It surprised me to learn this week that 118,000,000 people in this country are already insured by the Federal Government. This means 1/3 of America in on Universal Government-Run healthcare already.

originally posted by: DontTreadOnMe
a reply to: Byrd

Sorry.

Even with subsidies, many of us could not afford the price gouging.
I could barely afford the premium.....and totally not afford the deductible in excess of $6000.00 per year.
We won't even talk about drug prices.

Who the hell decides what a person can and cannot afford, anyway?

The insurance companies.

Seriously.

Now (as our European friends have pointed out) all this would change if we thought of medical care as a basic human right instead of a "for profit industry." At one time medical care WAS a human rights issue (just like education)... but it was changed to a for profit industry.

While you might like capitalism, throughout history we see a lot of negative examples when education is not universal (only given to those who can afford it) and when health care is only for those who can afford it and both are run as for-profit (capitalistic) enterprises.

originally posted by: carewemust
a reply to: luthier

President Obama wanted Single Payer. But as he said, "We can't get there directly." So they developed a program that would spring so many leaks, Americans would eventually BEG for Universal Health Care.

Before you go much further, you might like to go back and see what happened to the original Obamacare idea, what it covered, and what happened when Congress got it. Maybe you don't remember the "death panel" screeches and so forth (you can see the brawls here on ATS if you look into history) (wikipedia for brief overview)

a reply to: Byrd

When was this phantom basic human right healthcare?
I'm not young.....I sure don't remember it.

I remember what my father went through, before his union job went to BCBS and before the birth of Master Medical.....it wasn't all that great of insurance before BCBS....it just didn't cost what it does now, even accounting for inflation.

Let's face it, we had the chance to go to single payer in the 50s....but the companies and unions got together to make healthcare a "perk"...setting the stage for what we have today.

a reply to: DontTreadOnMe

It's an interesting moral topic.

Is being alive a right?

It's strange that nearly everyone is forced to buy car insurance. Universal coverage, to protect law suits and bank loans, but to protect a human life from disease or injury is not a universal need.

I don't think single payer is the way to go but it's hard to not have a moral obligation for basic universal coverage. Unfortunately it means a small price of freedom you have to buy insurance. Like auto insurance in most states.

I think competing non profit health and pharmaceuticals is the best whole fix but triple payer would be better than single. If it were employer, employee, and gov. Throw in a workfare option for unemployed. Instead of just waiting in the waiting room they can clean the toIles, or make some coffee for the nurses.

Honestly what can we expect with long power so strong?