Another Day Without Immigrants

a reply to: BuzzyWigs

When I said "create jobs that are beneath people" I was referring to taking jobs which you yourself have said are beneath "us" and making them pay a decent wage, that's creating a job that's no longer beneath anybody. And in case you forgot:

America needs people to do the jobs that are beneath you.

You said that.

They aren't taking jobs that you want to do.

You said that.

And then you told another member that they were too privileged to understand.

So you very much quite literally made the argument that "those jobs" are beneath the rest of us. You did it multiple times. To sit here and claim I made that up on your behalf is even more disingenuous than your previous comments. Denying that you said it when I can quote you saying it is not even rhetorically ridiculous, it's flat out absurd.

I don't give two poops about your anecdotal evidence and claims to be a woman of the people, buzzy. It means dick all, and it's a complete and total deflection as to the point I made: taking low paying jobs that you claim are beneath us and making them better paying would be taking jobs away from the illegal aliens. Take away exploitative conditions and suddenly people are more willing to work those kinds of jobs, and that means they aren't there for the illegals to take. Everything you've presented as being something drawn from your career is anecdotal. I can come up with all kinds of anecdotal evidence from my career as well, if that's the road you want to go down.

The rest of whatever drivel you posted is crap I never said (and like...actually didn't say, rather than the kind of didn't say you claim where you actually did say it but pretend you didn't) so I won't bother addressing it. Declaring yourself to be right doesn't mean you actually are, but if it makes you feel better to do so then by all means, you go girl.

Bless your little heart you sure try, don'tcha? That is all.

originally posted by: BuzzyWigs
a reply to: Shamrock6
The Mexicans, Guatemalans, Salvadorans, Cubans, Hondurans, etc who come here just want to work. They work in "menial" labor jobs.

Menial labor?

So skilled labor is menial?

I dont know actually, Im asking.

In my area back in the late 90s.

A framer or interior finisher made $14 to $20 per hour. Not as much as a plumber or electrician, enough to feed your family and stay off public assistance.

Now those same jobs are nearly exclusively held by illegals and the pay is $10 to $12 per hour.

After 17 years of serious inflation.

Ill stop there before I say some more facts that may get me in trouble here.........Ive seen plenty of American families bankrupted and pulled apart by the cut throat tactics illegals pull.

I will say this though....the churches can leave with the illegals since they are so concerned with their needs.

Bottom line, if America didn't have the Kept Voter pool of subsidized and entitlement supported should-be-workers, far more Americans would be fully on board with tighter border controls and seriously reduced immigration and work visas. The only reason the country has a contingent of "Open the borders" people is because welfare and subsidies pay better than those "menial" labor jobs do. This is the tail wagging the dog. Make entitlements worth less than work and watch how many American born ditch diggers and produce pickers suddenly find their backbones, swallow their pride, and do an honest day's work instead of living off the honest day's work of others in exchange for voting for politicians who want to increase the handouts the way they do presently.

The anti-immigration position, in my opinion, goes hand in hand with self responsibility and a sense of capitalism. I'm not at all in agreement with the neocon position of foreign born labor being a good thing for this country.

a reply to: blueyedevilwoman

Now those same jobs are nearly exclusively held by illegals and the pay is $10 to $12 per hour.

What? No. No, they are not.

I'm talking about the crew hired by talented carpenters, painters, landscapers, chefs, etc. as well as talented housekeepers, nannies, etc. But, that's just my own life experience. Apparently I am delusional.
Your Mileage May Vary

a reply to: BuzzyWigs

Btw, nobody has to tell me your wrong. You make it quite clear all on your own.

It's kinda scary... but to soothe my concern I tell myself you really mean well. But that still doesn't mean much, because lots of damage has been done by people who really mean well.

originally posted by: BuzzyWigs
a reply to: LadyGreenEyes

So, they can be exploited, and that's acceptable? They can work for lower pay be treated as outcasts, and that makes t alright for them to be here, because some company can make more money using them? That makes it more wrong!

So stop doing that to them.

I don't. If I ran a business (coming in the future), I'd make sure all hired were American when possible, and definitely legal! Blame the crooks that hire them, not me. Hint; they are the same ones demanding we welcome illegals.

originally posted by: Spiramirabilis
a reply to: LadyGreenEyes

So, they can be exploited, and that's acceptable?

It's not acceptable for anyone to be exploited. Please - get real

Facts are facts though. You remember what facts are - right? Many people in this country are benefiting from their labor. Instead of punishing people for coming where they're wanted, if you don't want them here - why don't you instead focus on why they're here in the first place?

They're just looking for something better

Yes - we know - they're criminals

Well, that would be my position, but apparently it isn't the position of some advocating for illegals. I am all for laws punishing companies that knowingly hire them.

And also!!! You, dear reader, might not be aware that a LOT of the Latino/Latina immigrants are Doctors, and Professors, back in their home countries. But here, they can only get work as busboys or short-order cooks. And they DO IT, with a smile, and appreciate the assistance they might get from kind social workers or churches or other orgs.

So, if this country DOES go to war against itself, remember that those "Mexicans" and "Illegals" you despised might be the very people who can rebuild your house, nurse your wounds, perform emergency surgery, or grow your food. And you might have to stop acting so high and mighty. oh you lucky person born in this country.

And their kids who were born here are ALSO CITIZENS! You think they'll be willing to help YOU when they grow up and need help? They're super-helpful, super-gracious, super-humble people. Some day you might be begging them for help.
Just think about that.

a reply to: Shamrock6

Damnit! And just when my lawn needs cutting too.

a reply to: BuzzyWigs

Yea, people are usually pretty happy when they can game the system and not only get away with it, but convince other people to become shrill advocates for them as they do it.

As the blowhard known as Rush once famously said: it's hard to beat Santa Claus, especially when the alternative is having to be your own Santa Claus.