It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.

Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.

Thank you.

 

Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.

 

Question about Jesus Christ

page: 4
8
<< 1  2  3    5 >>

log in

join
share:

posted on May, 1 2017 @ 12:03 PM
link   

originally posted by: randyvs
a reply to: Woodcarver




Lol. You're so cute. Proof of god's existence is on the internet? And all of the atheists just refuse to google it. Oh man. I can't stop laughing.


Is the internet prejudice or something? If that's your point then lets
both laugh? Together, starting now? Or maybe that's nervous laughter?




Lol. You're so cute.

Off topic but I get it a lot.

Here's some evidence that you don't even know what you're talk'n about.


you do realise that your opinion about that is not shared with the nearly 7 billion people who live and breath their respective religions with gods who wrote books thousands of years ago telling them what they should eat, who they can #, and who they should kill?


No, it's just funny that you think the best evidence for a god should be sought for on the internet instead of in real life. That really sums up my understanding of what you think a god is.

You are right about me making a mistake about the claim that 7 billion people have religious beliefs that include a God, because over the tens of thousands of years I'm sure it was way more than 7 billion.




posted on May, 1 2017 @ 12:20 PM
link   

originally posted by: randyvs
If you were at all interested you would just google the info
and I've even provided clues in easy to watch you tube vids.

I have done that, Randyvs. I have Google'd and searched. I haven't found any scientific evidence, any repeatable experiment that demonstrates either a) the existence of your God or b) the divinity of the supposed person 'Jesus'.

What I have found, are creationist websites, which are so incorrect it astonishes me they are able to look themselves in the mirror each morning, or peoples' *opinions* on why they think the majesty of nature is evidence of God. Just opinions. Where is the scientific evidence you claim of?

If you want to argue your case and debate your position, then provide the evidence you say exists. Don't play some bullsh*t child's game of 'nyah nyah - if you can't see it then that's your problem'.

You say, "Be a man and challenge yourself". Well, why don't you be the 'bigger man' and stop speaking in riddles and just....show us.

But you won't, will you. Because you have nothing. Just your religious faith. (shrug)



posted on May, 1 2017 @ 12:30 PM
link   
a reply to: noonebutme

Most people who believe in God based on evidence will say all of existence is evidence, some part of existence is evidence, or some personal experience they have had is evidence. The problem is there is no objective way to prove "evidence" is objective. All objectivity is determined by subjectivity. So I think for you there is no evidence that would ever quality as good objective evidence for the existence of God.

There are many people who believe there is not a shred of evidence to support the existence of God. For those people who still believe in God they do so based on a choose rooted in faith. You can't prove a negative so you can't prove God does NOT exist. So as much as you put all your faith in science your limited view of the Universe is just as imperfect as everyone elses.


edit on 1-5-2017 by dfnj2015 because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 1 2017 @ 12:34 PM
link   
a reply to: CollectSecretHistory

RE: "Why is the Lord Jesus Christ not the Son of God to you?"

Jesus is a false idol. There is only one true all-powerful all-loving God. And that God is God.



posted on May, 1 2017 @ 12:44 PM
link   
a reply to: noonebutme




I have done that, Randyvs. I have Google'd and searched. I haven't found any scientific evidence, any repeatable experiment that demonstrates either a) the existence of your God or b) the divinity of the supposed person 'Jesus'.


Where did I say scientific? Good thing you only searched with those
prejudiced parameters. If I searched with that kind of tunnel vision
I would still find plenty. Do me a favor and critique the info here if
you will?



I can't make it any easier than just sitting on your coolo and watching.
No wiggling claims that archaeology isn't science.



posted on May, 1 2017 @ 01:03 PM
link   
a reply to: randyvs

I think there's historical evidence Jesus existed as a man. As a God the evidence may be a little less convincing.

en.wikipedia.org...



posted on May, 1 2017 @ 01:31 PM
link   
a reply to: dfnj2015

Wi wi wikipedia? I'll just ask politely that you please refrain
from being any part of this discussion. Only so you don't
embarrass yourself any further.
edit on Rpm50117v31201700000050 by randyvs because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 1 2017 @ 04:37 PM
link   
a reply to: randyvs

Ok, so I watched it. It's very fascinating, archaeologically speaking. But it doesn't prove the existence of God or that the person known as Jesus was his son.

It corroborates some of the places and sites described in the Bible -- which I have never argued didn't exist.

So again, when you say facts that prove God.. that video didn't. It attempts to support some of the locations the Bible mentions, sure. But that alone is not proof of God. Or that Jesus was his son.



posted on May, 1 2017 @ 06:38 PM
link   
a reply to: noonebutme




So again, when you say facts that prove God.. that video didn't. It attempts to support some of the locations the Bible mentions, sure. But that alone is not proof of God. Or that Jesus was his son.


I'll be damned. That's my initial response, because I believe you actually watched
and actually took the time and the first step towards understanding Randys view.
and you're the first one in this whole site to show that much interest. Step one
however is in the shallow end of an olympic sized pool.

From here I would like to inform you that the rabbit hole runs right down to the
center of the earth. That's just saying it doesn't come close to ending there. I
want to thank you for being the first to show enough interest in where I'm
coming from. I won't assume you want more. I will just simply ask if you can
begin to see that my view isn't without merit. And if you want more you only
need to indicate that. Because I'm not here to convert you or anyone else.
I'm just trying my ass off to show that there is far more truth involved than
most seem to know. That's it.



posted on May, 1 2017 @ 07:23 PM
link   

originally posted by: CollectSecretHistory
Why is the Lord Jesus Christ not the Son of God to you? Why do you think that the Bible is not the complete word of God. I am just looking for those that have a reason on these things and I am not going to be commenting back unless I really feel compelled too. I completely understand that Jesus is God and the Bible is the word of God but I want to know what comes to your mind as a reason if you do not believe so.


The Bible was written by man to enslave everyone and be liberation for others,,, God exists all around us he doesn't need a book to explain that, he likes the fact we keep looking/searching for the same answers yet never finding the truth, that's is within us.



posted on May, 2 2017 @ 06:00 AM
link   

originally posted by: CollectSecretHistory
Why is the Lord Jesus Christ not the Son of God to you? .


For much of my youth. I suspected there was a Higher Power sometimes. But wasn't raised in church.
Although, even being raised with a secular upbringing. At times I expressed faith.

For instance running around with the guys in my youth in the military, running around chasing women. We scored one night. Found a couple of chicks to hang out with. Had sex with one. Condom broke. I told her. Got her number. She failed to get mine. I put the number in my car seat. And then mysteriously it disappeared. I dug through the car twice looking for that number. And with my secular upbringing as I scanned the car I prayed to God help me find that number.

I hit a deer on the trip back to my Coast Guard boat station in Hatteras. Later I suspected that deer hit was no accident. As Hatteras Island had very few deer population wise. I suspected years later that God inspired that deer to run out in front of the car at 60 miles and hour in response to that unplanned pregnancy that might have occurred.

Then a few years later at the Air Station I got into a spell where I couldn't sleep. Miserable. Didn't know why. Didn't use drugs as the Guard didn't allow it. Didn't drink too much, except on the weekends with the guys. Not overly promiscuous. A few partners here and there I liked. Half dozen or so.

Any way back to that lost number. Harry Potter is dressed sort of like a rescue swimmer in one scene, which was my occupation at the Air Station.

The deer scene.



See that deer shining with glory and light?



posted on May, 2 2017 @ 06:02 AM
link   
Faith is not something we always possess even in our youth. It grows with age and experience.



posted on May, 2 2017 @ 08:29 PM
link   
..
edit on 2-5-2017 by Visitor2012 because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 2 2017 @ 08:42 PM
link   
Christ isn't the sir name of Jesus. His name was Jesus of Nazereth or Jesus of Joseph. He's referred to as Jesus the Christ because he was recognized to be enlightened and awakened to the Spirit of God. A spirit which he profoundly discovered was his essential self, inseperable from the Father and immortal. He also discovered that it was also our eternal selves. Thus was born the true gospel..the good news which he sacrificed his life to deliver.

Christ is the heavenly spirit that dwells within. It isn't a human being, a man or a woman though it dwells in all of us...as us, if we have the sight and wisdom to recognize this for ourselves. Jesus (the flesh), is the son of man and the enlightened vessel through which Christ spoke to bring us this recognition. Christ said 'before Abrham was, I am' 'no man can come to the father except through me'. Christ was not referring to the perishable vessel of Jesus.

Confusing Christ, with the son of man, and believing the vessel through which Christ spoke was the only son of God is a foolish mistake. Jesus said 'You are Gods. You are all children of the most high'. The fundamental self of everyone is inseparable from God and immortal. That was the good news. To worship the messenger is to deny Christ's teachings and the salvation it can lead to.

Perhaps this is why Jesus frustratingly felt he had to leave his disciples who's minds couldn't grasp what he meant when he said 'the kingdom of heaven is within you'. That by worshipping him, they would not find their own salvation through Christ. He said he would leave and send them the helper in his father's name. The helper, whom awakened Jesus to the truth, will also lead them to all Truth where they will see that Christ is in all, and know the truth of themselves.
edit on 2-5-2017 by Visitor2012 because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 2 2017 @ 11:55 PM
link   

originally posted by: Visitor2012
Christ isn't the sir name of Jesus. His name was Jesus of Nazereth or Jesus of Joseph. He's referred to as Jesus the Christ because he was recognized to be enlightened and awakened to the Spirit of God. A spirit which he profoundly discovered was his essential self, inseperable from the Father and immortal. He also discovered that it was also our eternal selves. Thus was born the true gospel..the good news which he sacrificed his life to deliver.

Christ is the heavenly spirit that dwells within. It isn't a human being, a man or a woman though it dwells in all of us...as us, if we have the sight and wisdom to recognize this for ourselves. Jesus (the flesh), is the son of man and the enlightened vessel through which Christ spoke to bring us this recognition. Christ said 'before Abrham was, I am' 'no man can come to the father except through me'. Christ was not referring to the perishable vessel of Jesus.

Confusing Christ, with the son of man, and believing the vessel through which Christ spoke was the only son of God is a foolish mistake. Jesus said 'You are Gods. You are all children of the most high'. The fundamental self of everyone is inseparable from God and immortal. That was the good news. To worship the messenger is to deny Christ's teachings and the salvation it can lead to.

Perhaps this is why Jesus frustratingly felt he had to leave his disciples who's minds couldn't grasp what he meant when he said 'the kingdom of heaven is within you'. That by worshipping him, they would not find their own salvation through Christ. He said he would leave and send them the helper in his father's name. The helper, whom awakened Jesus to the truth, will also lead them to all Truth where they will see that Christ is in all, and know the truth of themselves.



This is all religious rhetoric.His name is Yahoshua(transliteration from Hebrew) which means Yahweh is deliverance.The word christ is transliterated from the Greek word christos and is the translation of the Hebrew word mashiach(English transliteration) which means the anointing which the definition is to rub or smear oil upon and was symbolic of having the empowerment of the creator God.

Yahoshua the mashiach has nothing to do with the pseudo spiritual religious rhetoric many people believe in from Christianity to New Age spiritualism.All of the quotes you used from the scriptures are categorically false conflations to fit your religious agenda that is not even original thought but just confirmation bias of your religious Belief System religion nothing more.

You can no more prove what you believe is true than you can prove what dark matter is.The fact is there is nothing to prove anything of what the religious believe the scriptures mean.Yahoshua very clearly stated that he only spoke in parables so those that believe they see and hear is the proof they are blind and deaf and they read into them what they want to see and hear.He clearly stated ONLY the disciples were given to "know" the kingdom of their heavens.

They clear fact is NONE can "know anything about the creator God through belief through faith of their religion(even those that claim they have no religion).The only way to know the creator God is if it is given to them to know and they cannot communicate that to anyone else.That disqualifies ALL belief through faith as religious rhetoric and it is categorically false.Thousands of years of history have been the evidence of humankind's complete ignorance of the creator God.There is no methodology that can ever know the inscrutable, to believe you can is the epitome of ignorance.



posted on May, 3 2017 @ 05:52 AM
link   

originally posted by: Rex282

This is all religious rhetoric



You just watch out for the fornication revenge deer that sneak out of the woods without freezing to look at the headlights while you're traveling at 60 miles and hour on an island 60 miles from the mainland with only a couple dozen deer on the entire island.



posted on May, 3 2017 @ 06:53 AM
link   

originally posted by: dfnj2015

originally posted by: Woodcarver

originally posted by: Raggedyman

originally posted by: Woodcarver

originally posted by: randyvs
a reply to: dfnj2015




would want people to have as a religion.


IT'S NOT ABOUT RELIGION!



God has no religion.
you do realise that your opinion about that is not shared with the nearly 7 billion people who live and breath their respective religions with gods who wrote books thousands of years ago telling them what they should eat, who they can #, and who they should kill?

Maybe "randy's" #ing opinion is moot after that revelation. It is for me anyways.


But Randy's opinion is true
God has no religion
Jesus ended religion for christians, for everyone if they so choose

But if you define religion as just a belief in God, then that's a different thing
well, it's true that he has that opinion, but both you and him presuppose that God exists. Without evidence of this claim then that is also just opinion based on zero evidence, so it can all pretty much just be thrown to the wayside.

You might as well define religion as a belief in God because that is the only context that it is ever used in.


You seem like a smart person. God could certainly exist and He is successfully hiding any evidence of his existence.

What is the point of having God's proving ground for faith if having faith is just as simple as a decision to brush your teeth? People choose to have faith precisely because there is no evidence. If the evidence existed, then people would make a decision to believe in God. Why must a belief in God be a decision and not a choice?


what reason do you have to think that god is real? We know that cats and dogs are real, because we can see them. We know that oxygen is real because we can measure it. When did you see god? When were you convinced it was real? As a child, were you taught that this was real by other people? As far as i can tell the only place we even get a reference to god is in ancient books written by men who have no understanding of the world. This is why there are so many gods speculated about. This is why the believers of these gods are geographically located. They literally thought thunder and lightning were the gods talking to them. You wouldn't want any of those people anywhere near you. But people base their entire lives on what they say about a god?

There were plenty of gods speculated before this one. Nobody thinks they were real. Why don't you believe in Mithra? For lack of evidence?
edit on 3-5-2017 by Woodcarver because: (no reason given)

edit on 3-5-2017 by Woodcarver because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 3 2017 @ 01:18 PM
link   
a reply to: Rex282

a reply to: Rex282

I'm glad you got that all out. Feel better?


Despite how it appears, I have no religious belief systems. There is no need for belief. No seeker of Truth should depend on that. I no more need Jesus to be true than the story of Santa Clause. However, the words in specific parts of the bible and other religious texts, coincidentally do ring true with my own discoveries. So I wanted to share my insight on Jesus with others because I enjoy doing so and that's what this forum is all about! No need for dismissively obtuse retort here.

I base my Insight on my own direct experiences not from what I read in books. The only way to know the mysteries and unlock inner discovery is through one's own longing and the direct experience which come from grace alone.

The identification with mind, body, and it's senses, something the disciples could not break free from, are as useful to divine revelation as the eyes are to a blind man. The Truth, which we all are, behind the lens of perception, is beyond the mind and body, and as you said, beyond words to describe. But is most certainly within us.

If Jesus or Yahoshua, or Siddhārtha Gautama never existed, if the Bible, Quran, Bhagavadgita, Upanishads, were never written, the truth remains as it was before they were born and will be after this World is gone. Jesus could be called John Doe for all I care or a made up cartoon character in a fictional book, makes no difference to the Truth of what we all are. Unborn, Immortal beings dwelling in mortal form, imbued with the essence of the forces of creation and inseparable from the source which manifests everything. Even that doesn't come close to conveying it nor produce the fruit of peace and joy such recognition provides.

I've discovered this before reading a single word of scriptures. And it wasn't until afterwards when I realized that these characters in these books are referring to the same thing in their own ways. The truth is not exclusive to religious texts, there are many thousands if not millions of people on Earth today and throughout history who have awakened to the Truth. This is the driving force behind my take on the text in the Bible. If you disagree with me, I'm totally fine with that. I enjoy our exchange nonetheless.

But if you want to tell someone what is right, wrong, FACT, ignorant or rhetorical then let's put the books down, talk eye to eye and back it up with what profound truth you have discovered about yourself which refutes what I said about the fundamental self.
edit on 3-5-2017 by Visitor2012 because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 4 2017 @ 02:47 PM
link   
Now behold the awful prize of treason.




posted on May, 4 2017 @ 09:41 PM
link   

originally posted by: CollectSecretHistory

Why is the Lord Jesus Christ not the Son of God to you?



I read The Bible as can be true and cannot be true.

For example the story of Adam and Eve in paradise, could have really happened, then I think if it happened it could have happened inside evolution, so creationism and evolutionism could both be true.

Same with Son-of-God could be true could not be true.

Somehow I incorporate this duality into my belief system.



new topics

top topics



 
8
<< 1  2  3    5 >>

log in

join