schools must allow for minority students to speak in ebonics

a reply to: crazyewok

"Safe" with enough atomic bombs aimed at each other to blow up the solar system.

You really are hilarious to me, how you think you're so much more civilized than the people you've "conquered". You do the exact same stuff, minus any kind of respect for the planet or empathy for its inhabitants.

Give me a break. You associate yourself with the White race when it pleases you. But when it doesn't suddenly you're associating yourself with a nationality.

a reply to: prepared4truth

And all of whiteys evil technology is why we are the dominate ones.


How do you have a chance of destroying us when we have nukes and everything else while you guys are living in squalor killing each other in the ghetto


If you dont like whiteys evil technology and life style then please immigrate to a low tec non white country! You will be much happier cause your NEVER going to get you own way where your living now, not in your life time and all hatred and resentment field people like you do is cause problems and issues for the descent hard working blacks that DO want to be productive law abiding members of society.

originally posted by: crazyewok
a reply to: Spider879

Ok then they have 2 options then:

1) STFU and continue life in the Ghetto.

2) Get a good education, good job and assimilate into the country.


Reparations are not going to happen. Period.

So one can wollow in poverty or try and make a life for themselves.

Haha..first off we have never been poor or lived in a ghetto, second no amount of reparations can clean away the shame of your ancestors so please keep it.

a reply to: Spider879

Then why are you bitching and complaining ?


If you have a good job and a nice life then ditch the hatred of us whites and live and let be.




O and its your ancestors shame too as it was your ancestors that sold you into slavery. Africa is just as guilty of slavery.

Not that I feel once ounce of shame and guilt as I was not alive then.

a reply to: crazyewok

Ahem you do know that blacks and others participated in the creation of that awful instrument of death don't you..
But by all means continue..

a reply to: crazyewok

Who is complaining, I merely. Try to explain.

originally posted by: Spider879
a reply to: crazyewok

Who is complaining, I merely. Try to explain.

And I am trying to explain that blacks like prepared4truth do not do the restbof you any favours.

They just create hatred and perpetate the stereotypes.


I have no problem with the colour of ones skin. Be a descent hardworking individual and I have no issues with you like anyone else.

But start treating me like crap because I am white and act like I owe you something you will be meet with extreme disrespect from me.

originally posted by: Spider879

originally posted by: crazyewok
a reply to: Spider879

Ok then they have 2 options then:

1) STFU and continue life in the Ghetto.

2) Get a good education, good job and assimilate into the country.


Reparations are not going to happen. Period.

So one can wollow in poverty or try and make a life for themselves.

second no amount of reparations can clean away the shame of your ancestors so please keep it.

I'm white, my ancestors didn't own slaves, and fought on the side of abolition. Exactly what shame do they have? Why should I be punished for their righteous actions? Only a tiny portion of whites have ancestors who were slave owners, yet you would punish all those innocents, for your own gain? Sounds bad man. I am actually in favor of reparations, in the form of land. All that land out West that the Feds have seized, give it to blacks and Indians, let them develop it, it would benefit everyone.

a reply to: sapien82
Yes I understand that, just as shortened text is used in the gaming scene, e.g. brb, bk, afk, kk, gtg, lol, lmao, ty, yw etc., which has now spread to social media and other types of online communication, it allows more people to communicate across language barriers of a specific circle or community. This is a good thing, it increases language, however, it also can be isolating because if you don't know the specific lingo for that one group you will find it hard to communicate, especially if the particular language they are using is not mostly formal English with adapted bits. So yes there is a place for adapted language and newly formed language, however, like most things, there is a correct time and place for it, which is not in school as a substitute for proper English, as this only serves to decrease the language capacity by the removal of the wider used language.

Just as a side note, I have noticed that even within the English language there has been a culling of words. New dictionaries, whilst adding in new terms that have become so popular they are being used by the majority, are removing other older and sometimes not so old words. I find this rather sad as it then limits the language rather than letting it flourish and the use of those words will die out as the generation using them also die out, unless it is passed down verbally along with the meaning. I do often wonder why our 'wise overlords' would want to orchestrate this.

originally posted by: Spider879
a reply to: AnkhMorpork

Whapp'n? cool runn'n mon, we's be ire mon.

That read suspiciously like a Bajan ( someone from Barbados) or a Trini (someone from Trinidad) not to be confused with the term tranni, a Jamaican would drop the apostrophe and the be.. and go with we ire mon.
cool runn'ns??. no one really say that anymore, that's like soo 80ts
But good try tho, one should note however that slang can make it's way into any dialect to be discarded later as simply a trend.

Yep, I learned it from a Trinidadian.

Also, he'd say - whatagoin? for what's going on? or how are you?

Whapp'n, whatagoin?

Me ire mon. you?

Cool runn'n (you can't get rid of that), ire.

originally posted by: Oldtimer2
a reply to: crazyewok
Remember years back my wife at time took a child dev course,they had a"chitlin" test,was regarding black slang,I used to work in Construction and some people from the south had their own language,was easier to understand the spanish speaking,had an idea of what they were trying to convey,others talked gibberish

Sorry sir, but I do not quite understand what YOU are saying?

a reply to: AlexG85

I understood all of it, which bit are you struggling with?

I just finished reading through the last several pages of this thread, and have come to a conclusion. Some of the people defending ebonics are not doing so for the reasons they claim. They are doing so, from what I can see, out of a racist attitude themselves. The issue seems to be that some dislike English, because it's considered to be a "white" language. Instead of understanding that it simply is the predominant language on the planet, for many reasons, they prefer to label it as "oppressive", and claim that certain groups are being victimized, if "forced" to learn to speak and write in proper English.

No, I am not debating the definition of that term, either. I can easily converse with someone from Great Britain, or Australia, or many other places, with little to no problem. A term here and there might be different, but it's quite easy to discuss those, and compare notes on the differences. Ths is not true for ebonics. I can't help but note, either, that my response on the lack of usage of such things, from blacks I was around as a child, which proves this is NOT some leftover African dialect, as someone claimed, was completely ignored by that poster. Facts hurt, do they?

No, someone is not a victim because they are expected to learn the predominant language of the land, to be able to function properly in society.

No, it isn't racist, or elitist, or superior, to claim that English is, in FACT, the predominant language, and used virtually worldwide. That is a fact of history, and is what it is. Deal.

No, it is not caving in to "oppressors" t learn to speak properly. There are no slaves in this country, legally (black market human trafficking set aside for this debate). There are no children, or even grandchildren, of slaves, in this nation today. There is no justifiable reason to play the "blame whitey" game, and claim that every shortcoming of every black person is due to some evil white oppressor, including a refusal to speak intelligently. And, yes, I said "intelligently". It has been proven, quite well, in this thread that ebonics is, in fact, a "black thing", for the most part, though others do use it. It has been shown that historical variations in English over the centuries do not excuse the bastardization of the language today (and nice work there, to True Brit!).

No, it is not a "rich culture" that refuses to learn the language, and chooses instead to self-segregate, then claims victimhood and blames others for that segregation.

No, white people do not owe anything to black people. There is no "white privilege", and no "white guilt" is necessary, for people who did nothing wrong.

No, saying "thugs" or "drug dealers" isn't racist.

That someone makes alot of money on rap does not mean that the poor language used therein is acceptable in the business world.

No, someone does not have to be black to understand and discuss issues in the black culture. You can't claim that, and then demand anything from people you say can't understand your issues.

No, you can't claim it's an issue of what people are taught at home, and use that as an excuse for not demanding proper English in the schools. If the children cannot learn, how can they grow up to teach their children? That is a self-perpetuating hindrance.

Common sense dictates that one learn the language of the land, and be able to effectively communicate, to gain employment, and get long well with others. To teach ebonics in the schools, or even encourage the usage, is to hold back those students, and make them slaves. I recall hearing of cases of blacks not being allowed to register to vote, because they could not pass a test, to read or write properly, and thus were considered incapable of understanding the issues. Why on earth would anyone want to go back to a time like that? Why demand that someone NOT get a good education? Why demand that teachers learn to talk down to the students, instead of lifting up said students, and teaching them a better way? That is the real oppression.

originally posted by: Spider879

originally posted by: crazyewok
a reply to: Spider879

Ok then they have 2 options then:

1) STFU and continue life in the Ghetto.

2) Get a good education, good job and assimilate into the country.


Reparations are not going to happen. Period.

So one can wollow in poverty or try and make a life for themselves.

Haha..first off we have never been poor or lived in a ghetto, second no amount of reparations can clean away the shame of your ancestors so please keep it.

Spider, I generally agree with every post you make on ATS, but this time, as a white woman, I will protest your statement. Some of my own ancestors came here as criminal outcasts (same with many Australians). England sent the "deplorabes" over here to get them out of sight and out of mind, not caring whether they lived or died.

To my knowledge, having done an extensive genealogy on my ancestors, none of them had slaves. They were either misfits, exiled, or Quakers. No slave stuff. Also, it was Africans who were first selling their own people to the slave traders. And third, if anyone is due reparations it is the Native American Tribes whose land was stolen from them, and whom were FORCED to speak proper English and to accept Christianity. THEY are the ones who have a gripe. They are the ONLY ones that deserve reparations.

The rest of us had nothing to do with slavery. So please, do lighten up on that. I've never sought to own a slave. I'm not responsible for those who did. And I won't be "white shamed." I didn't choose to be born here, but my parents did choose to teach us PROPER ENGLISH.

And as a person who has worked with the public and the front-line staff in many situations where people didn't speak ANY English, I have worked as an interpreter between them and monolingual management.

That's all I have to say. I was raised and schooled to have a good command of English. I began to learn Spanish in 4th grade (I was 8 years old), and kept on with it (50 years now!). Learning Spanish taught me more about English, and how to "decode" the other related languages as well.

In grad school it was imperative that one was able to use the internet, to write coherent papers in an academic style, and to get the point across succinctly and in a way that non-academics and unrelated disciplinarians (academics in other fields) can read with ease.

The only "shame" is that some people can't be bothered to learn the proper language. And no amount of "shaming" us is going to change the fact that an inarticulate person will not get ahead unless they are a rapper or living in a community that speaks nothing but.

Being able to switch back and forth depending on setting and company is a critical skill to have in this world. Period.

Thanks, though, for communicating your thoughts on the matter. You are a good, and effective writer.

a reply to: Spider879

I AM and have been ...can't do math.
SKIN is a dead issue as of the 70s we still screw up ,but WE DON'T WANT to.
THAT is the difference...well THAT and most of whites know who their fathers are on each coast.
I don't, I was adopted in secret, but my SKIN is nothing but an organ ,my MIND is too busy to waste time on race,I have Jihadists to track.

originally posted by: sapien82
a reply to: BuzzyWigs

I have to agree from a teaching perspective if that school is willing to allow it then let the childrens grades and intelligence speak for itself , see how their grading is compared to other school in the same state etc then parents can decide whether they want there kids to goto learn there!

if it turns out they getter better grades etc then its further evidence to suppor the teaching of ebonics for minority students in classes along side English etc

let the evidence speak for itself

The problem with kids "graduating" with improper English (saying 'it don't' instead of 'it doesn't' - which is typical for rural folks, for example; or 'they be boutsta go home'- typical for local ebonics kids I worked with) and not knowing proper English to be able to speak it when they are in public is that it is (in my opinion) the fault OF THE TEACHERS.

I have learned to assume that their teachers are speaking incorrect English while teaching "English." crazyewok is right, and I will agree with their point. If a kid never goes to public schools and all they ever hear is ebonics or poor English or southern slang or cajun, then it is not the kid's fault. But if they go to a regular public school they need to come out of it with correct English.

Want to speak Spanglish at home? Or ebonics? FINE. At work or at school or in a public setting you can't utter general English sufficiently? NOT FINE. In fact, I have a colleague who speaks the 'ebonics' of the urban core, even though she is white and working in an area that doesn't have a lot of that.....I could get all snooty and think she's stupid, but I don't. I know she's choosing to speak that way because that's how her neighborhood people speak. She chooses not to speak general English. So, whatever. It's her choice, but it does reflect on her character. Just saying.

a reply to: BuzzyWigs

Hi BuzzyWIgs and TruMcCarthy , I realized my post seemed generalized about the ancestors of self Identified White folks, it wasn't meant to be, the fact Is I did not make that clear is my responsibility, and for that my apologies , to BuzzyWigs I was responding in an American context about reparations ( a hot button subject) which had nothing to do with the conversation we were having thus far.

To TruthCarthy, I did not mean to impugn your ancestor who fought the good fight, I have nothing but respect for those with character and willingness to place it on the line for others.

To those whose ancestors did treat others with not just slavery but a special kind of cruelty I say this ...the sins of the father should not be visited on the sons,. you are only responsible for what you do.

However to those of you who like to wallow in a false sense of moral superiority along with denials, just because an ancestor was able to dehumanized others through a system of chattel , then screw U.

originally posted by: paraphi
Life is just so f'ing difficult for some people. It really makes you wonder how the human race has managed to cope all this time.

The new generation is useless. If they cannot or won't learn English in an English speaking country, then they will never get the jobs that require fluency in English. Is that the reality they are avoiding?

In Scotland we have local languages like Doric and Old Scots. There are people who have only spoken these languages all their lives and left school at sixteen to find work and start a family.

Funny how this turned into a race war. It was originally about helping students to learn by using ebonics. What it turned in to is truly disgusting. This isnt a black or white issue this is either you think disadvantaged students should get help or not.

originally posted by: dragonridr
Funny how this turned into a race war. It was originally about helping students to learn by using ebonics. What it turned in to is truly disgusting. This isnt a black or white issue this is either you think disadvantaged students should get help or not.

Well some entitled white hating # turned up....