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Can Trump return Crimea to Ukraine?

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posted on Apr, 25 2017 @ 02:27 AM
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a reply to: allsee4eye

One Year After Russia Annexed Crimea, Locals Prefer Moscow To Kiev


The U.S and European Union may want to save Crimeans from themselves. But the Crimeans are happy right where they are.

One year after the annexation of the Ukrainian peninsula in the Black Sea, poll after poll shows that the locals there -- be they Ukrainians, ethnic Russians or Tatars are mostly all in agreement: life with Russia is better than life with Ukraine.

Little has changed over the last 12 months. Despite huge efforts on the part of Kiev, Brussels, Washington and the Organization for Security and Cooperation in Europe, the bulk of humanity living on the Black Sea peninsula believe the referendum to secede from Ukraine was legit. At some point, the West will have to recognize Crimea's right to self rule.




posted on Apr, 25 2017 @ 02:30 AM
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a reply to: theultimatebelgianjoke

Polls.
Fake news.



posted on Apr, 25 2017 @ 02:38 AM
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a reply to: Phage

That's why they voted, it is not a poll, it is a referendum.
How many anti-Russian demonstration did ever take place in Crimea ?
Showing how much Crimeans would be willing to go with Ukraine rather than Russia.

None, zero, nada, ...


I haven't trusted polls since I read that 62% of women had affairs during their lunch hour. I've never met a woman in my life who would give up lunch for sex.

Erma Bombeck



posted on Apr, 25 2017 @ 02:44 AM
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a reply to: theultimatebelgianjoke




How many anti-Russian demonstration did ever take place in Crimea ?

Is that a trick question?



posted on Apr, 25 2017 @ 02:56 AM
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a reply to: Phage

Just an embarassing one for some ...



posted on Apr, 25 2017 @ 03:01 AM
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originally posted by: allsee4eye
I think there is a way. But it would be costly. Currently, there are 2.5 million Russian citizens in Crimea. What Trump can do is drop all sanctions and pay each of them 1 million dollars to move to the Russian mainland. That would come out to 2.5 trillion dollars. Expensive but doable. What do you think?


What difference does it make to the US. Why dont they keep thise noses out of other peoples busienss?

The US has troops stationed right on the Russian border yet they screem threats when a Russian warship sails within a few miles of the US coast.

bout time the US minded their own dam busienss is it that they take the view that everyone else in world should take oders from them?



posted on Apr, 25 2017 @ 03:03 AM
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a reply to: Azureblue
Damn right!
Who does Trump think he is? The president of the world?



posted on Apr, 25 2017 @ 03:39 AM
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originally posted by: Phage
a reply to: Azureblue
Damn right!
Who does Trump think he is? The president of the world?



Paul Wolfowitz, the neoconservative who was Deputy Secretary of Defense under the Bush regime, declared:

“Our first objective is to prevent the re-emergence of a new rival, either on the territory of the former Soviet Union or elsewhere, that poses a threat on the order of that posed formerly by the Soviet Union. This is a dominant consideration underlying the new regional defense strategy and requires that we endeavor to prevent any hostile power from dominating a region whose resources would, under consolidated control, be sufficient to generate global power.” - Paul Craig Roberts.



posted on Apr, 25 2017 @ 03:40 AM
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a reply to: Azureblue

Like, for instance, in lieu of the USSR, say...the Kremlin?



posted on Apr, 25 2017 @ 06:19 AM
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a reply to: theultimatebelgianjoke

Do you know what also happened during that year? Anyone that opposed the referendum was more or less forced off the peninsula. Anyone that wished to remain a Ukrainian citizen had two weeks to declare their intent and apply for a permit of permanent residence which included, among other things, a full psych exam.

And let's not forget that the referendum was not as clear cut as the Kremlin reported. According to Russia's own Human Rights Council only about 30% of eligible voters voted in the referendum and of these only 50% voted in favor.



posted on Apr, 25 2017 @ 06:27 AM
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Come to think of it, the day after the US pays 2.5 trillion dollars to have Russia pull troops out of Crimea, the next day Russian troops enter Crimea again and take it over. Losing 2.5 trillion for nothing is a bad plan.
edit on 25-4-2017 by allsee4eye because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 25 2017 @ 06:35 AM
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a reply to: Xcalibur254

If that's the BS you wish to believe, I won't even try to argue.
Every Crimean inhabitant I talked to had a completely opposite point of view.
Where did you get yours ? Let me guess : MSM ?

They won't tell you the following :

- Crimeans are sick and tired of living in the artificial, dysfunctional state that is Ukraine.
- 97% of Crimean people are Russian-speakers.
- Russian speakers were targeted by Ukraine under their 23 years rule.
- Russia has invested in Crimea while Ukraine choose to divert Crimean ressources for the profit of Ukraine.
- Crimean industry will get a very substantially larger market for its goods and services despite embargo.
- There has been no bloodshed in Crimea unlike the rest of Ukraine.
- Ukraine nationalists are far-right neo-nazi thugs.
- Ukrainian president Porochenko's popularity is at an all time low in Ukraine (lower than Yanukovich before he was ousted).



posted on Apr, 25 2017 @ 06:58 AM
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a reply to: theultimatebelgianjoke

On top of that, Ukrainians never gave Crimean Tatars regional language rights for their language whereas Russians did. So who's the bad guys? Ukrainians or Russians? You be the judge.



posted on Apr, 25 2017 @ 07:37 AM
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originally posted by: allsee4eye
a reply to: theultimatebelgianjoke

On top of that, Ukrainians never gave Crimean Tatars regional language rights for their language whereas Russians did. So who's the bad guys? Ukrainians or Russians? You be the judge.


Having armed troops take over a part of another country will make a country the bad guy in the eyes of the international community. As far as what to do simple wait. Russia is breaking promises to them as we speak. They were told all these investments would spur the economy. Well Russia cant afford it so eventually the people will just demand a change probably to independence.



posted on Apr, 25 2017 @ 08:19 AM
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a reply to: theultimatebelgianjoke


- Crimeans are sick and tired of living in the artificial, dysfunctional state that is Ukraine.

I'm not even sure what this means. How is Ukraine and artificial state?


- 97% of Crimean people are Russian-speakers.

Thanks to the Russification policies of Stalin that saw the native Tatars forcibly removed.


- Russian speakers were targeted by Ukraine under their 23 years rule.

This sounds like the justification Russia gave the UN for the annexation. Funny how they have yet to provide proof for the claim desoite being asked numerous times.


- Russia has invested in Crimea while Ukraine choose to divert Crimean ressources for the profit of Ukraine.

Why wouldn't Ukraine use the resources found in Crimea for the benefit of the whole country? That would be like saying that only Siberia is allowed to use the oil found there.

Also, it sounds like Russia is having issues keeping their promises about investing in Crimea. I mean they're struggling to keep their people fed at this point with how terrible their economy is.


- Crimean industry will get a very substantially larger market for its goods and services despite embargo.

They would have also had a substantially larger market if Putin didn't throw a hissy fit when Ukraine sought closer economic ties with the EU.


- There has been no bloodshed in Crimea unlike the rest of Ukraine.

That's because it was annexed at the barrel of a gun and then Putin threatened the use of nukes if anyone tried to stop him. Also, didn't someone mention in thread that two people did die?


- Ukraine nationalists are far-right neo-nazi thugs.

Your point being? Nationalists and neo-nazis go hand in hand no matter what country you're in. At least they don't really have any power in Ukraine. The State Duma in Russia has something like 50 members from far right nationalist parties.


- Ukrainian president Porochenko's popularity is at an all time low in Ukraine (lower than Yanukovich before he was ousted).

That tends to happen when your country is in a prolonged civil war with no end in sight. That said I'm sure it would be even lower if he decided to capitulate.



posted on Apr, 25 2017 @ 08:21 AM
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a reply to: allsee4eye

Considering the Russians forced the Tatars out of Crimea I'm going to go with them. Ukraine even recognizes the event as genocide.



posted on Apr, 25 2017 @ 08:30 AM
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a reply to: Xcalibur254

What legitimacy has the US to impose anything on Ukraine, Russia or Crimea ?



posted on Apr, 25 2017 @ 08:42 AM
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a reply to: theultimatebelgianjoke

Where did I ever agree with the OP's premise. I think at this point it's going to be pretty much impossible for Crimea to ever be returned to Ukraine. That said, Russia should definitely be required to provide some kind of compensation to Ukraine. And I think a good place to start would be stop backing the rebels and provide funds to help rebuild Ukraine.



posted on Apr, 25 2017 @ 08:50 AM
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a reply to: Xcalibur254

As often, "You are responsible of your own posts" ...
I'm just aking a question about the US legitimacy in eastern europe.

So the Russian should pay, while being under embargo ...
How about Soros ? Shouldn't he be paying as well for the f-ups he sponsored ?



posted on Apr, 25 2017 @ 09:40 AM
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a reply to: theultimatebelgianjoke

I think the US has overstepped their bounds in a lot of places. I'm actually surprised with how hands off they have been in Ukraine.

That said, if the US decided to get involved I would say this is one of the few cases where their intervention is justified since the Ukrainian government has asked for their help.

And obviously if Russia paid compensation to Ukraine for Crimea it would mean removing the sanctions.



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