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Fox News Schooled By Nebraska Farmer on Keystone XL Pipeline

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posted on Apr, 24 2017 @ 07:37 PM
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a reply to: BuzzyWigs

...and the fact that Iowa and Nebraska are the country's two largest ethanol growing states, and the Keystone pipeline has been used as a launching pad for the House and Senate to kill federal ethanol mandates has NOTHING to do with this Nebraska farmer's criticism of the pipeline and tar sands usage?

Please... the dude doesn't want to lose his federal ethanol subsidy. His comment on "destroying communities and livlihoods" is especially cute. Bobody has produced anything rational or defensible showing how a GD pipeline, functioning as designed, is going to in any way damage American communities or livlihoods (unless, of course, he's puckering and salty over those precious ethanol subsidies, that is
)




posted on Apr, 24 2017 @ 07:41 PM
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originally posted by: BuzzyWigs

originally posted by: sine.nomine
Ok, first of all... Nebraskan here.. born and raised eastern Nebraska. Definitely flat. Flat as a Denny's stack. Not the issue. The whole Nebraskans blocking the pipeline issue has to do with water. Specifically the ogallala aquifer. 90% of irrigated crops in the midwest are from that water source. That doesn't take into account water for livestock for the best beef in the world. This is a pipeline by foreigners for foreigners that threatens the very livelihood of the nation. Nebraskans have every right to be skeptical and pissed about this proposal.

This pipeline will cross through this prescious water source, threatening our way of life.


Thank you.
Nebraska is a place I would never agree to live,


What do you have against Nebraska?
You seem to derail your own threads with stupid things.
Kansas does not have mountains.



posted on Apr, 24 2017 @ 07:44 PM
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a reply to: essentialtremors



We can produce our own natural gas now using cow dung and landfills.
Sure we can produce it, but how much can we produce? A drop in the bucket compared to our energy needs.

BTW, cows are supposedly contributing to the problem, Leanardo says to save the planet we should be eating more chicken in his latest hit piece, Before The Flood.



posted on Apr, 24 2017 @ 08:12 PM
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originally posted by: D8Tee
a reply to: essentialtremors



We can produce our own natural gas now using cow dung and landfills.
Sure we can produce it, but how much can we produce? A drop in the bucket compared to our energy needs.

BTW, cows are supposedly contributing to the problem, Leanardo says to save the planet we should be eating more chicken in his latest hit piece, Before The Flood.


Not sure how your replay got directed at me, as that's a quote from Buzzy mate.

But I will say that there truly are a plethora of great options out there to slowly take over for some of fossil fuels responsibilities. And we should start exploring and debating the merits and downfalls (which is really where we're at right now), but to just stop oil production and refinement full stop and expect a rapid change is absolute folly.



posted on Apr, 24 2017 @ 09:03 PM
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a reply to: BuzzyWigs

Well, they appeared to me to have shifted for the better. Sorry if my compliment bothered you.

Here's a tip on clean energy: everyone wants it! Even the CEO of Exxon-Mobil wants clean energy (although he probably doesn't want to lose his income to get it). That has never been an issue. The issue is that no one wants to lose their energy supply... and that includes you, based on those gas lines. But a lot of binary thinkers have watched too many episodes of Captain Planet and think there's big bad boogeyman out to destroy nature at all costs.

That's why you see people pushing back against regulations. Some are good, like sulfur content restrictions on gasoline and smog restrictions on industrial plants. Others are questionable, like recent particulate restrictions on diesel trucks. Others are just flat-out useless or detrimental to energy production, like requiring multi-million-dollar environmental surveys or regulating carbon dioxide (which is not a pollutant). Those in the latter group need to go, and those in the questionable group need to be adjusted. The purpose is to keep the planet ecologically healthy, not to punish people for producing/using energy.

BTW, that color comes from microbes living in the soil and eating the gas. The repairmen was probably right; soil is not poisonous if things still grow in it, by definition.

TheRedneck



posted on Apr, 24 2017 @ 09:33 PM
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a reply to: TheRedneck

Do you now what the price tag is on the Fukishima cleanup?



posted on Apr, 24 2017 @ 10:11 PM
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a reply to: D8Tee

Actually no. I wasn't aware one could really put a price on that disaster. I know the Pacific is receiving large amounts of radiation and will continue to do so for thousands of years.

TheRedneck



posted on Apr, 24 2017 @ 10:16 PM
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a reply to: TheRedneck

Tepco just doubled their estimate to 188 billion.

Nuclear is proving to be a costly industry, shoulda stuck with fossils.



posted on Apr, 24 2017 @ 10:57 PM
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a reply to: D8Tee

Tepco is underestimating as usual.

But don't judge all nuclear power by that comedy of errors... there was so much wrong with that plant, from basic design to flawed specifications, to underestimating, to poor storage of spent fuel, to outright blundering, to errors in addressing issues... comparing it to the US program under the NRC is like comparing the Keystone Kops to the Secret Service.

TheRedneck



posted on Apr, 24 2017 @ 11:11 PM
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a reply to: TheRedneck

It was a boiling water reactor, lots of the same design in the USA I would think.

There will be more accidents, it's just a matter of time.

Thing is, as bad as oil spills are, they are nothing compared to nuclear disasters.

Westinghouse just filed for bankruptcy due to their comedy of errors in building the latest nuke plants in the USA.

Link

Westinghouse Electric Co, a unit of Japanese conglomerate Toshiba Corp, filed for bankruptcy on Wednesday, hit by billions of dollars of cost overruns at four nuclear reactors under construction in the U.S. Southeast.




posted on Apr, 25 2017 @ 07:21 AM
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a reply to: D8Tee

True. I believe (hope) the newer plants are all PWR. The one I worked on in the early 80s was.

The cost overruns are due to the NRC... those boys make the IRS look like wussies. In the case of nuclear energy, that's a very good thing, but companies have to understand their status quo of cutting costs will not work. That's where the cost overruns came from: expectation of cost cutting that was shot down by the NRC. The same thing stalled construction on the plant I worked at.

Yes, accidents can be disastrous... but properly built there are no accidents.

TheRedneck



posted on Apr, 25 2017 @ 07:43 AM
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a reply to: c2oden

sigh

ok, let me try to be clearer. I don't live here by choice. I live here due to family obligations. I did live in the mountains, and when I got married we came back here because my husband had to attend KU. Our families were both here. We got pregnant, and then we stayed to raise our kids. They are now grown.

I have spent the last 30 years raising my kids and rehabbing an old house in order to sell it and get out of here. I live 1/2 mile from the Missouri river. Look at a map. That wiggly border on the Northeast corner? That's the river. I live 1/2 mile south of that river about three miles from Missouri. Mk?
Just barely inside the state. In that tiny box, the smallest county. This is where the Hopewell and Kansa tribes lived. We are on top of their old stomping grounds and ancient villages and campsites and there is a Huron cemetery beside our public library. All along the river are remains of First Tribe villages. The missionaries came here and forced tribe kids into their culture.
Have you seen "The Last of The Mohicans"? With Daniel Day Lewis? THAT is what it looks like where I live.
Seen "Dances with Wolves" with Kevin Kostner? Yeah. That's central/west Kansas. No thanks.


Now, since I don't see how any of that has anything to do with the point made in the OP I am done discussing it. I have been to Nebraska many many times. I have in-laws there. It is in my view flat and boring unless you are in Lincoln. Last time I was there was at Christmas time in Albion. The place is as bleak as a movie set for The Road in winter, and it smells like cows and regret. The people are not "happy" types. They are uber-conservative small-town one-motel towns except for Lincoln. Omaha is less desolate also. The people in Lincoln and Omaha are not who spoke to this lady.

But we need Nebraska and Iowa (another place that's a so much nope, just like Western Kansas, Oklahoma, or most of Texas.) They grow corn and pigs and cattle. Western Kansas grows wheat and cattle. Period. I'm not a farmer.

My extended family's lives are all the evidence I need to know I will not live there. Ever. Not willingly. Where I live is right at the Missouri River. It is like Appalachia here. Go west for an hour, and you are approaching planet Dune. The high plains go on and on until you get to Denver. Some people like the flat, treeless big skies of prairies, the incessant wind, the smell of feedlots and acres and acres of nothing but corn or wheat. The Flint Hills lie between Topeka and go to Manhattan-ish. They are very low rolling hills with few trees, and beyond that is the high prairie. There is a giant wind-farm in the western prairie that stretches for twenty-five miles, and that's a good start.

Where I live we don't get our water from the Aquifer. We get it from the river, and we are not in any danger of "drought" or drying up here. Out there, they are very vulnerable to drought and must irrigate. To do that they use the Aquifer, and it is sorely depleted. To have it vulnerable to poisoning is a firm "no."


edit on 4/25/2017 by BuzzyWigs because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 25 2017 @ 10:37 AM
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a reply to: BuzzyWigs


Some people like the flat, treeless big skies of prairies

It's heaven :-)

But, not everyone's cup of tea

From your earlier post:


We can produce our own natural gas now using cow dung and landfills. We don't need to continue fracking. We don't need to continue drilling for oil, either. People who care about the planet, ESPECIALLY people who live in the midwest farm country know this. Wind and solar are cheaper, cleaner, better, and already advanced enough to eliminate fracking.

Absolutely. No matter where we live - we have got to start using our brains and find better ways. Adapt or die

In America’s Heartland, Discussing Climate Change Without Saying ‘Climate Change’

To adapt, he has embraced an environmentally conscious way of farming that guards against soil erosion and conserves precious water. He can talk for hours about carbon sequestration — the trapping of global-warming-causing gases in plant life and in the soil — or the science of the beneficial microbes that enrich his land.

In short, he is a climate change realist. Just don’t expect him to utter the words “climate change.”

“If politicians want to exhaust themselves debating the climate, that’s their choice,” Mr. Palen said, walking through fields of freshly planted winter wheat. “I have a farm to run.”

Here in north-central Kansas, America’s breadbasket and conservative heartland, the economic realities of agriculture make climate change a critical business issue. At the same time, politics and social pressure make frank discussion complicated. This is wheat country, and Donald J. Trump country, and though the weather is acting up, the conservative orthodoxy maintains that the science isn’t settled.

The thing about this subject that fascinates me is how much one side of this argument is relying on a hunches, doubt and ego driven politics, while other people are just busy working on the reality. Fact of the matter is, out of necessity and reason - jobs will be created. There is some serious money to be made - all of it going towards a better future
edit on 4/25/2017 by Spiramirabilis because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 25 2017 @ 06:22 PM
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a reply to: Spiramirabilis


“If politicians want to exhaust themselves debating the climate, that’s their choice,” Mr. Palen said, walking through fields of freshly planted winter wheat. “I have a farm to run.”


Dam strait!
Exactly!!

Most of those folks don't really give a seed about politics anyway, they just want to have their farms, make a living, and get on with it. (Just a PSA: for any readers who are unaware, the Great Depression was the result of dust-bowl drought coupled with nonexistent soil management or crop/livestock rotation.)

I could on and on about that topic. For days. When you live here, and have any interest in the outdoors at all, you learn this stuff. You learn how to raise chickens and corn. How to rotate pastures. How to use a goat as a lawn treatment company. How to collect horse dung and use it to enrich clays and poor soils. How to tell the difference between peat and clay, black dirt and sandy loose dirt. What will grow where.

We just do. Here, we have extremes of weather conditions. When I visited England (Penrith) the B&B owners asked us what the weather was like here. I said, "Well, in the summer it gets so hot that people die. And then, in the winter, it gets so cold that people die."

You can't live here and not know this stuff unless you are completely "citified." And yes, we have those people, too. A lot of them. In their suburban McNeighborhoods, they can't have woodburning fireplaces, or outdoor campfires. No fireworks. No large dogs. No outdoor burning. No putting on a small porch without a "permit."

I wouldn't live there any more than I would live in Malaise, Nebraska.


But that is the way the world works.

My family is capable of survival, and familiar with outdoor facts and tips and tricks. Many are, sadly, not.



posted on Apr, 25 2017 @ 06:47 PM
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a reply to: BuzzyWigs


(Just a PSA: for any readers who are unaware, the Great Depression was the result of dust-bowl drought coupled with nonexistent soil management or crop/livestock rotation.)
Here's a PSA for you: the Great Depression was a worldwide economic depression, it was not the result of drought and poor farming practices.



posted on Apr, 25 2017 @ 06:50 PM
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a reply to: burdman30ott6

What is it that you are wanting? Can you please describe your vision for solving the very real problems interfering with baseline farming that are happening now?



posted on Apr, 25 2017 @ 06:56 PM
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a reply to: D8Tee
.......wow.....



*shame on me* Thanks! You are right. I misspoke. (It happens...) The Dust Bowl occurred DURING the Great Depression, after the banks/stock market crash. You are correct. Nevertheless the drought and dust storms would have been survived using better farming practices.

Because the crops failed, the depression was worse. The families had no crops to sell. It was horrible.



About The Great Depression


edit on 4/25/2017 by BuzzyWigs because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 25 2017 @ 07:34 PM
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a reply to: BuzzyWigs

Was the drought caused by man made climate change back then?

If it happens again, and it will, you know man made climate change is going to get the blame....



posted on Apr, 25 2017 @ 07:42 PM
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a reply to: D8Tee


Was the drought caused by man made climate change back then?

Was the weather change caused by men? We don't know. It was only 30 years into the industrial era.

The drought was a natural cycling of the climate. Doesn't really matter if it was caused by the industrial emissions or not. We don't know.

The point is that the farmers were not prepared for it, and the region was decimated. The settlers came in and this continent was never again to be the same.
We can only speculate, but there is no way to prove that industrialization and fossil fuels were NOT exacerbating an already volatile climate event.



If it happens again, and it will, you know man made climate change is going to get the blame....


All the more reason that we should invest in learning how to mitigate that risk.
We have not been "neutral" contributors to the Earth's climate. And in any case, we know what is happening now! It doesn't make any difference at this point which came first, but it is abundantly clear that there is a problem.

There are ways we can HELP the climate in order for our specie to survive. Or we can fail, and go the way of the dinosaurs or mastadons.



posted on Apr, 25 2017 @ 07:49 PM
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a reply to: BuzzyWigs

I live in Nebraska.
South central Omaha.
I work along the Missouri River.
I can see it from my office.
I own a farm in eastern Iowa.
I work in a business that gives me insight and info that you may not have.
Please stop being so condescending.



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