"Communism for Kids":Published by MIT Press

a reply to: ElectricUniverse
The wonders of CAPITALISM work well too don't they.

Mass unemployment.
The great number of homeless.
Unaffordable health call through ruthless medical institutions
Jobs shipped overseas.
Imperialistic government attacking everything that moves.
The police state.
Indoctrination of children through allegiance to the flag. etc.
Failure to care for veterans.
Corrupt financial systems.
Police stealing more than criminals.
SWAT team murdering innocent people.
Forced vaccinations.
Arrested for protesting.

Just to list a few problems.

Sound like you're living in a fairy tale if you think the wests systems of government is so wonderful.

Have a look at your own backyard before complaining about neighbours.

a reply to: acrux

"The wonders of CAPITALISM work well too don't they."

"Mass unemployment."

Not really, most people looking for a job find a job.

"The great number of homeless."

Brought on largely in part from the socialist policy of 'war on poverty'.

"Unaffordable health call through ruthless medical institutions"

Brought on by the socialist controls and regulations eliminating competition, even before Obamacare.
In fact, the health sectors that have been unmarred by the socialist scourge (lasik, lypo, plastic surgery) have seen prices drastically decrease over the years.

"Jobs shipped overseas."

This is mostly due to the Global Liberal Order's push for globalization, using wage slaves in third world countries to avoid the massive socialist taxation system at home.

"Imperialistic government attacking everything that moves."

Quite an embellishment, but as long as the things that are moving are commies, I have no qualms with it.

"The police state."

Indicative of fledgling socialist systems.

"Indoctrination of children through allegiance to the flag. etc."

You must not be an American.

"Failure to care for veterans."

What kind of system are we talking about here?

"Corrupt financial systems."

Could you point out any type of system, financial or not, that isn't corrupt?

"Police stealing more than criminals."

Do you have any statistics to back up those claims? Didn't think so.

"SWAT team murdering innocent people."

Yeah ok, by the millions I'm sure. Derp.

"Forced vaccinations."

We're still talking about capitalism here?

"Arrested for protesting."

Because everyone has the right to burn down their neighborhoods and loot with impunity.

I'll go out on a limb here and guess you're a citizen of Derpastan, the only socialist utopia to exist in the world.

You can't be communist without an entire 'community' behind you. As that is almost impossible [because we are all individuals with different ideas], the community has to be either forced or brainwashed into it.
I guess not everyone wants to be a capitalist either but at least they are free to pursue whatever they like [as long as they don't bother anyone else]. Something impossible under a communist regime.

a reply to: ElectricUniverse

There's not much point in discussing a topic with people that become completely unhinged by it. You grew up in Cuba and have a very emotional reaction to the words Castro insisted on using. You either refuse or are incapable of absorbing the hundreds of times I've said or other Socialists on this site have said that we don't advocate what Castro et al insisted on calling Communism. You call us Statists and Nazi's while clearly most of us are anti-state and admonish us as utopian while peddling utopian capitalism. However, I wasn't replying to you or the thread but to a question asked directly to me.

a reply to: acrux

Most of those failures are results from Socialist enforcement policies.

a reply to: ElectricUniverse

Socialism/Communism is inevitable because.........they never give up.

originally posted by: TonyS
a reply to: ElectricUniverse

Socialism/Communism is inevitable because.........they never give up.

It's inevitable because of the pace of technological advancement, unless you'd like to put laws in place to prevent automation for the greater good... which would make you a Communist.

originally posted by: acrux
a reply to: ElectricUniverse
The wonders of CAPITALISM work well too don't they.

Mass unemployment.
The great number of homeless.
Unaffordable health call through ruthless medical institutions
Jobs shipped overseas.
Imperialistic government attacking everything that moves.
The police state.
Indoctrination of children through allegiance to the flag. etc.
Failure to care for veterans.
Corrupt financial systems.
Police stealing more than criminals.
SWAT team murdering innocent people.
Forced vaccinations.
Arrested for protesting.

Just to list a few problems.

Sound like you're living in a fairy tale if you think the wests systems of government is so wonderful.

Have a look at your own backyard before complaining about neighbours.

You do realize that every example you just pointed out was a system built by capitalists but ruined by socialism and crony-capitalism?
Mass unemployment?
Product of the lefts welfare state votes for free **** mentality.
Jobs shipped over seas?
NAFTA and GATT alone destroyed hundreds of thousands of jobs. Both constructs of the Clinton administration.
The police state?
Again the liberals have ruby ridge and WACO under their belts.
Indoctrination of children through allegiance to the flag. etc.
Are you kidding me!
Well when the flag stands for freedom and a nation that to this day is a beacon of humanity around the globe...
Then I would say yes allegiance to that flag is a good thing.
Better than having allegiance to a toxic ideology that puts groups ahead of the individual...
Failure to care for veterans?
Never heard a conservative call a vet a "baby killer". So clear where that problem is coming from....

I could probably do this with you all day with you.
But sadly I have to get back to being a productive member of my community...

originally posted by: JAY1980
You do realize that every example you just pointed out was a system built by capitalists but ruined by socialism and crony-capitalism?

It wasn't ruined, it was crony-capitalist from the start.

a reply to: Kali74

Here is the problem, socialists like yourself will continue to claim nomatter how many "socialists" nations keep trying to impose socialism that only fail, time and again, that "none of those nations is socialist". When in fact socialism has been tried, and is being tried to this day and keeps failing. I doubt you have even read the writings of Marx and Engels, because that's the form of socialism that always takes over.

Do you know why socialism keeps failing, and will continue to create just dictatorships? Because that ideology you think is so perfect tries to push for a collective mind hive. But each one of us is an individual. We are all different, and when a political/economic system aims to destroy all sense of individualism, it tries to destroy human nature and our human soul. Which is why eventually large portions of the population in socialist regimes turn against socialism, and socialist doctrine states those people have to be "taken care of" by imprisonment, or death.

The inability of socialists to admit how many times your ideology fails, and keeps failing and instead of the "wonderful utopia" that only exists in the minds of "socialists" what takes over is just another socialist dictatorial regime. But socialists "will continue to claim that's not socialism". You have no sense of responsibility for the failure of your ideals. That's just like left-wing policies have gotten rid of "personal responsibility" and have given criminals someone else to blame for the crimes criminals decide to commit.

originally posted by: ElectricUniverse
Do you know why socialism keeps failing, and will continue to create just dictatorships? Because that ideology you think is so perfect tries to push for a collective mind hive. But each one of us is an individual. We are all different, and when a political/economic system aims to destroy all sense of individualism, it tries to destroy human nature and our human soul.

Does the ideology do that or is it the people who end up being crony-capitalist, as usual?

Does everyone dress the same in cuba? I know that Venezuelans have not lost their rights to be individuals. Uniforms exist everywhere so they don't really count.

I think your emotional baggage pushes you to be rather hyperbolic.

originally posted by: daskakik

Does the ideology do that or is it the people who end up being crony-capitalist, as usual?

wow...so of course unless you daskakik is in command of the socialist forces people will continue to fail in socialism huh?... Is that it daskakik?...

originally posted by: daskakik
Does everyone dress the same in cuba? I know that Venezuelans have not lost their rights to be individuals. Uniforms exist everywhere so they don't really count.

What are you talking about?... political oponents to the socialist/communist regime in Venezuela, and in Cuba, and other true socialist/communist regimes get sent to prison.

If you think that it just started under "Maduro" you haven't been paying attention... Chavez, when he was alive, before the recall referendum made threats from the start that Venezuelans who would vote against him would be in lists that would be made public... Despite his threats over 5 millions Venezuelans voted to recall Chavez and get him to resign. Chavez used the Tascón list to go after not only government employees who dared vote against Chavez, but even regular citizens who were in the list were targets of the socialist leader.

People in that list lost their jobs, or/and were harassed by the socialist regime of Chavez, and Chavez himself used the list as an example of what would happen to political opponents to the socialist regime Chavez set up.

The Tascón list was/is a list of more than 5 million Venezuelans that voted to get Chavez to resign, and Chavez, and his socialist thugs went after people in that list to set an example.

The Price of Political Opposition: Evidence from
Venezuela’s
Maisanta
†
By
Chang-Tai Hsieh, Edward Miguel, Daniel Ortega,
and Francisco Rodriguez*
In 2004, the Hugo Chávez regime in Venezuela distributed the list of several million voters who had attempted to remove him from office throughout the government bureaucracy, allegedly to identify and punish these voters. We match the list of petition signers distributed by the government to household survey respondents to measure the economic effects of being identified as a Chávez political opponent.
We find that voters who were identified as Chávez opponents experienced a 5 percent drop in earnings and a 1.3 percentage point drop in
employment rates after the voter list was released.
(JEL D72, O17)
...

faculty.chicagobooth.edu...

originally posted by: daskakik
I think your emotional baggage pushes you to be rather hyperbolic.

Stop talking so much BS, you are simply ignoring facts that you don't want to accept, alongside other "socialists". What the socialist government of Chavez did, and has been doing was/is made public from day one. From closing down private radio and television stations for being critical of the "socialist regime". To imprisonment of political opponents and even the use of force by shooting at demonstrators.

The Price of Political Opposition: Evidence from Venezuela’s Maisanta

There are threads in these forums where other ATS members and myself posted videos, and other evidence supporting the fact that Chavez's socialist regime, was/is just another fascist socialist dictatorship.

Your claim that Venezuelans have not lost their rights is nothing but a lie.

originally posted by: ElectricUniverse
wow...so of course unless you daskakik is in command of the socialist forces people will continue to fail in socialism huh?... Is that it daskakik?...

I'm not a socialist. I don't want to be in command.

What are you talking about?... political oponents to the socialist/communist regime in Venezuela, and in Cuba, and other true socialist/communist regimes get sent to prison.

I'm talking about people being individuals. You said that socialism is "a political/economic system aims to destroy all sense of individualism."

Stop talking so much BS, you are simply ignoring facts that you don't want to accept, alongside other "socialists".

It isn't BS and what haven't I accepted?

Venezuelans can still be individuals in many ways so, they have not lost that right. That is what I specifically talking about, your incessant need to exaggerate.

Is it fair for me to post a military drill team and claim that people in the US have lost their individuality?

Hands off my toys! commies!

originally posted by: daskakik

I'm not a socialist. I don't want to be in command.

Really?.. You are one of those claiming that "socialism" can work, despite the fact that it has been tried time after time and failed. You then claimed that "it is people who make socialism fail because they turn into "crony-capitalists"... So you seem to be implying that for socialism to work "as you daskakik" envision it, you have to be in command... Otherwise I guess your argument will always be that "people end up being crony-capitalists", as if there weren't socialists and communists in western nations who make a lot of money and as if socialist regimes "never" turned dictatorial...

originally posted by: daskakik
I'm talking about people being individuals. You said that socialism is "a political/economic system aims to destroy all sense of individualism."

And it does, the collective precedes individualism always... Or are you completely ignorant of that fact as well?...

In all socialist/communist regimes anything that is considered "counter-revolutionary" is suppressed, and oppressed. People get sent to prison, or are even executed, and this has happened, and happens in the U.S.S.R., Cuba, China, North Korea, Venezuela etc.

As for people being able to be individuals in Venezuela... Really? is that why political opponents, and even bloggers have been imprisoned as well as human rights activists, and people can't be critical of the socialist government?... You do know that Chavez implemented a law in which no one can be critical of the socialist policies, right?...

Censorship in Venezuela
...
Resource drains and media buyouts

Both President Chávez and President Maduro would pressure media organizations until they failed by preventing them from acquiring necessary resources. The Venezuelan government would manipulate foreign exchange rates for media organizations so that they could no longer import their resources or fine them heavily. The government would then use a front company to give the troubled organization a "generous" offer to purchase the company. Following the buyout, the front company would promise that the staff would not change but would slowly release them and change their coverage to be in favor of the Venezuelan government.[9]

Soon after Nicolas Maduro became President of Venezuela, El Universal, Globovisión and Últimas Noticias, three of some of the largest Venezuelan media organizations, were sold to owners that were sympathetic to the Venezuelan government.[10][11][12][13] Shortly after, employees of the affected media organizations began to resign, some supposedly due to censorship enforced by the new owners of the organizations.[14][15]
...
Law
In December 2010, the government of Venezuela approved a law named "Social Responsibility in Radio, Television and Electronic Media" (Ley de Responsabilidad Social en Radio, Televisión y Medios Electrónicos). The law is intended to exercise control over content that could "entice felonies", "create social distress", or "question the legitimate constituted authority". The law indicates that the website's owners will be responsible for any information and contents published, and that they will have to create mechanisms that could restrict without delay the distribution of content that could go against the aforementioned restrictions. The fines for individuals who break the law will be of the 10% of the person's last year's income.[citation needed] The law was received with criticism from the opposition on the grounds that it is a violation of freedom of speech protections stipulated in the Venezuelan constitution, and that it encourages censorship and self-censorship.
...

Censorship in Venezuela

originally posted by: daskakik
It isn't BS and what haven't I accepted?

Venezuelans can still be individuals in many ways so, they have not lost that right. That is what I specifically talking about, your incessant need to exaggerate.

LOL...so now I am exaggerating...Really?... Obviously you are completely ignorant or delusional of the realities people have to face in Venezuela...

March 5, 2013 5:24PM EST
Venezuela: Chávez’s Authoritarian Legacy

Dramatic Concentration of Power and Open Disregard for Basic Human Rights

(New York) – Hugo Chávez’s presidency (1999-2013) was characterized by a dramatic concentration of power and open disregard for basic human rights guarantees.

After enacting a new constitution with ample human rights protections in 1999 – and surviving a short-lived coup d’état in 2002 – Chávez and his followers moved to concentrate power. They seized control of the Supreme Court and undercut the ability of journalists, human rights defenders, and other Venezuelans to exercise fundamental rights.

By his second full term in office, the concentration of power and erosion of human rights protections had given the government free rein to intimidate, censor, and prosecute Venezuelans who criticized the president or thwarted his political agenda. In recent years, the president and his followers used these powers in a wide range of prominent cases, whose damaging impact was felt by entire sectors of Venezuelan society.

Many Venezuelans continued to criticize the government. But the prospect of reprisals – in the form of arbitrary or abusive state action – forced journalists and human rights defenders to weigh the consequences of disseminating information and opinions critical of the government, and undercut the ability of judges to adjudicate politically sensitive cases.
...

www.hrw.org...

Or are you now going to claim Human Rights Watch, and every person in Venezuela who points out the realities they are living are exaggerating as well?...

originally posted by: daskakik
Is it fair for me to post a military drill team and claim that people in the US have lost their individuality?

A military drill team doesn't control the U.S. government... Now who is exaggerating?...

originally posted by: ElectricUniverse
Really?.. You are one of those claiming that "socialism" can work...

No, I'm not. Find a single post where I have said that?

The rest does not apply.

And it does, the collective precedes individualism always... Or are you completely ignorant of that fact as well?...

All countries, even capitalist one ask the individual to sacrifice for the greater good of the nation.

As for people being able to be individuals in Venezuela... Really? is that why political opponents have been imprisoned as well as human rights activists, and people can't be critical of the socialist government?... You do know that Chavez implemented a law in which no one can be critical of the socialist policies, right?...

Those are very specific things that don't form the whole of individualism. You seem to have a problem wrapping your head around that.

LOL...so now I am exaggerating...Really?... Obviously you are completely ignorant or delusional of the realities people have to face in Venezuela...

The exaggeration is you claim that it is to "destroy all sense of individualism". Yes, it is an exaggeration.

A military drill team doesn't control the U.S. government... Now who is exaggerating?...

Of course not and neither do children in school uniforms nor do they imply the individualism of the rest of the population. That was my point, thank you.

a reply to: GodEmperor

Did i say nations like the U.S. have no problems?... BTW, yes, there is unemployment in the U.S., but do you know what the unemployment has been in Spain since the socialists took over? 18%-20% for citizens of Spain, and 30% for immigrants.

Full socialist regimes like Cuba, Venezuela, North Korea, etc, people go hungry, all jobs are controlled by the socialist regimes and if you are critical of the government at the least you lose your job, which means you can't get a job.

Unfortunately there are homeless persons in the U.S., but it is worse in socialist/communist regimes.

originally posted by: daskakik

originally posted by: ElectricUniverse
LOL... It's that why 80,000 tons + of food were rotting in socialist government warehouses while people were going hungry in Venezuela?...

Why else?

Because socialism enforces "rationing". That's the real reason, and not the made up BS you claim.

Cuba, Venezuela, China, U.S.S.R., North Korea, etc all implemented "food rationing" alongside rationing of every product. When a government controls all means of production, that government controls it all, and under socialism rationing is always implemented.


Remembering life in Romania under communist rule

Do you want to know why there is "rationing" under socialism? Because the state controls all prices so businesses cannot compete, and many either close shop or become "nationalized". Then, since "capitalism is so evil" businesses have to either follow the rules, or get shut down. Following the rules in socialism means food manufacturers can't make a profit on their products and have to sell their products cheaper than what they bought the product for, which is why most businesses close down or get nationalized.

Then there is also the fact that many "socialist regimes" use "rationing" to help spread socialism/communism to other parts of the world.

Meanwhile New Yorkers were being given free gas by fidel castro, Cubans were going hungry. But, it serves them a purpose, because people living outside of "socialist/communist" regimes don't see the realities of socialism, and only see what socialist/communist dictators like fidel castro want them to believe. It is a form of propaganda to get people around the world to think "socialism is great"...

Great and powerful civilizations follow the same cycle as rich and powerful people. After they've reached their pinnacle and have gone gray, they turn into philanthropists. Soon after, they are being taken advantage of - and then they're dead.

a reply to: ElectricUniverse

Maybe you'll understand it better this way, "No # Sherlock" or maybe "Well, duh".

Even when I agree with you you have to argue.