BBC Reporting China Fears US-North Korea Conflict Any Moment...

a reply to: elysiumfire

No, I disagree.

It's a type of elaborate ruse of sorts, but one that isn't unprepared to follow through or the bluff doesn't work.

He has to be persuaded via negotiation to make a deal, his nukes and ICBM and medium range tests, in return for a lifting away of sanctions and engagement with the international community.

He could save face because this would revitalize the North Korean nation and the people would think of him as a genius for going head-to-head with the USA and its allies.

If he so much as launched his missiles, it would be just total death and destruction.

You don't want that.

No one really likes doom porn, do they?

AnkhMorpork:

No one really likes doom porn, do they?

I'm not one for doom porn either, in fact any porn, to be honest. You cannot allow a dictator like Jong-un to determine the criteria of negotiation.

The terms are that he ceases and desists from any further missile tests, and to completely abandon his nuclear programme. You know as well as I that he will not be complying. The carrier fleet that is now off the coast of the NK peninsula, and the other 3 carrier fleets being sent there are not bluffs to act as a deterrent to Jong-un. They are strike forces and they will hit him if he conducts further missile tests.

You cannot negotiate while under threat. You are entitled to your opinion, but I believe you are reading things wrong...probably out of wishful thinking.

a reply to: elysiumfire

And what you are saying is precisely what he Kim Jong un must be led to believe, or it won't work.

But if the shooting starts, then he's apt to decide to go out in flames.

I don't think you have any idea of the firepower that NK can unleash, particularly on South Korea and US forces stationed there.

Then if there was a conventional war, then it would involve untold loss of life on both sides.

That must be averted at all cost.

I like that McMaster repeated used the phrase "short of armed conflict" while describing the situation as coming to a head.

Total strength and will on the part of the Trump Administration will bring him to the table, I have no doubt. I'm sure he values his own life, if not that of the welfare of the Korean people.

He will get a deal and China will broker it.

There will be no war. (touch wood)

China is the lynchpin because without China, the North Korean dictator's regime will fall, being so heavily dependant on trade with China to sustain itself.

In much the same way, ISIS can't be defeated in Syria and safe zones established on the ground and in the air, without Russia's blessing, and Iranian restraint.

The Trump policy and strategy is to recognize that these are all parts of one giant puzzle, at the heart of which is also an Israeli-Palestinian peace agreement.

It's all inter-related and at it's heard are a set of sanctions and the prospect of the lifting away of those sanctions amid the formation of a new global trade framework that will somehow strike a balance amid all these competing interests whereby peace, of the lasting kind is the recipe for a lasting and sustained global prosperity.

Trump and his administration understand this and what's at stake, but it's one puzzle, one weave one tapestry with many moving parts and threads and puzzle pieces to be assembled.

It's more of a 6 month kind of thing than anything imminent, but it's also imperative to keep up the pressure in pursuit of the beginning of the solution, which cannot be put off indefinitely.

Present moment sense of urgency has to be sustained throughout and this is what differentiates Trump administration policy from that of his predecessors who thought you can kick the ball or the can down field and somehow put off the inevitable with a hope and a prayer for something to happen in the future, a future that never comes.

AnkhMorpork:

I don't think you have any idea of the fire-power that NK can unleash, particularly on South Korea and US forces stationed there.

I think it quite arrogant and conceited of you that you assume greater knowledge than I of North Korea's military assets. I am well aware of the known capabilities of North Korea. They have 3 types of missile that we know actually function, and a fourth that they are working on. It is the fourth type of missile - the Taepong 2, which is causing US military chiefs real concern as it is an ICBM (intercontinental Ballistic Missile) capable of reaching most of the mainland US. If North Korea get this missile functioning and are able to fit multiple nuclear warheads to it, it will change the ball game completely.

US military chiefs have stated that North Korea cannot be allowed to have such a missile, hence all the heightening of tensions regarding that country. Basically, what you have with the North Korea situation is very similar to the Cuban Missile crisis. North Korea, like the Russians back in 1962 in Cuba, are racing to have nuclear-armed assets made ready and capable of reaching mainland US. Clearly, this is an intolerable situation for everyone, especially so when those assets are controlled by a megalomaniac dictator such as Kim Jong-un, who will clearly use those assets at the slightest provocation.

One can understand the reasons why Kim Jong-un seeks such assets, because the Cuban Missile crisis came about due to American aggression towards Cuba during the Bay of Pigs fiasco. Russia sought to provide Cuba with defensive capabilities against American aggression, and started placing medium and long-range nuclear missiles in Cuba.

For Kennedy and US military chiefs, this was intolerable, and they took the world to within a whiskers length of nuclear war to have them removed. The situation is very similar here with North Korea.

Then if there was a conventional war, then it would involve untold loss of life on both sides. That must be averted at all cost.

No. Not at all cost. By all means, seek a diplomatic solution, and involve whoever you need to bring about a peaceful solution, but at the moment, North Korea seeks no such compromise. Kim Jong-un believes North Korea should have nuclear-capabilities, and on achieving them, will no longer be able to be treat like a little kid on the playground.

Remember, appeasement does not work. If Kim Jong-un sees his threats succeed in reducing sanctions and other penalties against him, he will constantly use them to get what he wants. If war is what it takes to rein him in, then so be it. That's the non-wanted situation we are all in, but we all have a responsibility to face it head on. To cower and turn our back on it would be the greatest act of irresponsibility ever committed.

From a western point of view, our regret is that we do not have a Kennedy leading us from the front, we have a 'reactive' president who is not capable of displaying true political statesmanship, and will be lead by the hawks in his administration.

a reply to: elysiumfire

I was moreso referring to the number of missiles that can be launched.

What ought to concern him is the US capability to take him out, personally, while knowing who can take over in his stead without releasing them.

An actual war with NK however, not that it couldn't be "won", is out of the question because of the amount of people who would be killed in the process.

I'm sorry, but I just loath it when people call for war without an awareness of the implications.

I agree however that he cannot be permitted to continue on this path.

The stick is his death, the carrot, his stability and security and the revitalization of his country and its place in the world.

May 4, 2017

Kim Jong is biting the hand that feeds him. He's now criticizing CHINA...North Korea's closest (only?) ally.

""North Korean state media warned Thursday Beijing was crossing a "red line" in its relationship with Pyongyang, in a rare criticism of its closest ally.

A commentary in the state-run newspaper Rodong Sinmun vowed North Korea would not give up its nuclear program. It accused China of "dancing to the tune of the US" and providing Washington excuses to deploy more military assets to the Korean Peninsula.""

Source: Not Sayin.

Kim's last missile launch was on it's way to Russia before exploding. Now he's verbally biting the hand that feeds him. The guy must tired of living.

a reply to: elysiumfire

Why has China has amassed 175,000 troops along its border with North Korea?

Perhaps to ensure it does not get flooded with refugees from any impending NK disruption as may have been gathered by intelligence.

Perhaps China has heard about George Soros and intends to cut him off at the pass.

Sunday, July 30, 2017

As of today, China is betting/assuming that President Trump will not make a pre-emptive strike on North Korea.

""China is betting that U.S. President Donald Trump won’t make good on his threats of a military strike against North Korea, with Beijing continuing to provide a lifeline to Kim Jong Un’s regime.

Secretary of State Rex Tillerson singled out China and Russia as “economic enablers” of North Korea after Kim on Friday test-fired an intercontinental ballistic missile for the second time in a matter of weeks. While Tillerson said the U.S. wants a peaceful resolution to the tensions, the top American general called his South Korean counterpart after the launch to discuss a potential military response.

China on Saturday condemned the latest test while calling for restraint from all parties, a muted reaction to Pyongyang’s progress on an ICBM capable of hitting the U.S. mainland. Despite Kim’s provocations, analysts said Beijing still sees the collapse of his regime as a more immediate strategic threat, and doubts Trump would pull the trigger given the risk of a war with North Korea that could kill millions.""

Source: www.msn.com...

No nukes. Well just hit em with the 511 again. Brighten up their day.

Nk nuclear options will be the first thing we annihilate.

Also north korea gets sudden fog banks that roll in every now and then...how convenient.

Yes im talking in code.

a reply to: WeAreAWAKE

I suspect Trump has told them that and thought they had a deal. His last message was to China he's basically told them handle it or I will

That's what this tweet was about


.they do NOTHING for us with North Korea, just talk. We will no longer allow this to continue. China could easily solve this problem!

6:35 PM - Jul 29, 2017