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Chemtrails on their way to be exposed for what...and who they are.

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posted on May, 4 2017 @ 11:26 PM
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originally posted by: 3danimator2014

originally posted by: Area201
a reply to: D8Tee

So you didn't watch the first link he provided where the guy collects the vapor in a jar, gets it analyzed and results with Barium in excessive unsafe amounts? So the guy has to get into his own private plane and follow the military plane, hoping he won't get shot down to get to the source and prove it?

I don't see how is this benefiting the population or national security. It's looking like creating business for some chem companies or part of a specific military budget. I'm being very simplistic here in accusations I know. I think there is a guy or a group that is suing the government to get to the bottom of what's going on. I'll need to look into that and post here later.




How are you not understanding this? There are untold numbers of sources of pollution on the ground? Its impossible to know that any sample came from 35k feet up. Why don't you get this?

Also, in the 25 years I've lived in London, there have been a handful of days where the city has woken up to find a fine brown powder covering the cars and other surfaces in the street. Know what that powder is? Sand blown in from the Sahara desert. It was so fine, the wind blew it for thousands of miles.

And that was from the GROUND. Aerosol particles sprayed at 35k feet would travel for much much MUCH longer and farther and would certainty never I'm a million years just float straight down to the people below the planes flight path.

You can argue all you want, but these are facts that cannot be disputed I'm afraid.


How are you not understanding that we are trying to find out what is going on exactly and just because we don't know for sure or can find out conclusively right away we should make no inquiry or look into it? Oh look, the planes appear to be spraying something into our skies again. Lets just ignore something is happening and don't ask questions. we have no way of knowing anything. Nothing to see here. /s How are you not getting that?
edit on 4-5-2017 by Area201 because: (no reason given)




posted on May, 5 2017 @ 12:43 AM
link   

originally posted by: Area201

originally posted by: 3danimator2014

originally posted by: Area201
a reply to: D8Tee

So you didn't watch the first link he provided where the guy collects the vapor in a jar, gets it analyzed and results with Barium in excessive unsafe amounts? So the guy has to get into his own private plane and follow the military plane, hoping he won't get shot down to get to the source and prove it?

I don't see how is this benefiting the population or national security. It's looking like creating business for some chem companies or part of a specific military budget. I'm being very simplistic here in accusations I know. I think there is a guy or a group that is suing the government to get to the bottom of what's going on. I'll need to look into that and post here later.




How are you not understanding this? There are untold numbers of sources of pollution on the ground? Its impossible to know that any sample came from 35k feet up. Why don't you get this?

Also, in the 25 years I've lived in London, there have been a handful of days where the city has woken up to find a fine brown powder covering the cars and other surfaces in the street. Know what that powder is? Sand blown in from the Sahara desert. It was so fine, the wind blew it for thousands of miles.

And that was from the GROUND. Aerosol particles sprayed at 35k feet would travel for much much MUCH longer and farther and would certainty never I'm a million years just float straight down to the people below the planes flight path.

You can argue all you want, but these are facts that cannot be disputed I'm afraid.


How are you not understanding that we are trying to find out what is going on exactly and just because we don't know for sure or can find out conclusively right away we should make no inquiry or look into it? Oh look, the planes appear to be spraying something into our skies again. Lets just ignore something is happening and don't ask questions. we have no way of knowing anything. Nothing to see here. /s How are you not getting that?


They dont appear to be spraying anything to me. But then i understand basic weather and contrail formation.



posted on May, 5 2017 @ 09:31 AM
link   

originally posted by: Area201

originally posted by: 3danimator2014

originally posted by: Area201
a reply to: D8Tee

So you didn't watch the first link he provided where the guy collects the vapor in a jar, gets it analyzed and results with Barium in excessive unsafe amounts? So the guy has to get into his own private plane and follow the military plane, hoping he won't get shot down to get to the source and prove it?

I don't see how is this benefiting the population or national security. It's looking like creating business for some chem companies or part of a specific military budget. I'm being very simplistic here in accusations I know. I think there is a guy or a group that is suing the government to get to the bottom of what's going on. I'll need to look into that and post here later.




How are you not understanding this? There are untold numbers of sources of pollution on the ground? Its impossible to know that any sample came from 35k feet up. Why don't you get this?

Also, in the 25 years I've lived in London, there have been a handful of days where the city has woken up to find a fine brown powder covering the cars and other surfaces in the street. Know what that powder is? Sand blown in from the Sahara desert. It was so fine, the wind blew it for thousands of miles.

And that was from the GROUND. Aerosol particles sprayed at 35k feet would travel for much much MUCH longer and farther and would certainty never I'm a million years just float straight down to the people below the planes flight path.

You can argue all you want, but these are facts that cannot be disputed I'm afraid.


How are you not understanding that we are trying to find out what is going on exactly and just because we don't know for sure or can find out conclusively right away we should make no inquiry or look into it? Oh look, the planes appear to be spraying something into our skies again. Lets just ignore something is happening and don't ask questions. we have no way of knowing anything. Nothing to see here. /s How are you not getting that?


nothing wrong with looking for the truth. It how we should all be doing things. But, you have to be willing to let go of the sincere wish to have airplanes be the bad guy here. You need to be objective and look seriously into the claims made, and the answers given.

If you look into weather, clouds, condensation, engine design, and contrails, and you digest the information offered and ask for clarification on things you don't get, yet you still think that you can look at a line in the sky and claim it's anything other than a contrail, then you still don't get it.

Sure they could be doing all sorts of horrible things to us all, but they aren't doing it with contrails. The amount of time being spent by ass loads of people looking into "chemtrails" is amazingly stupid and a huge waste of time. Pollution is a real problem. If you really care about the planet, if you really care about what "they" are doing to you, look into pollution and where the sources are. Look into what happens when crop runnoffs make their way to the rivers, then the oceans. That alone should occupy most for the rest of their lives. But you really do have to try to learn the parts the chemtrailers are trying hard to get you to ignore. (science)



posted on May, 7 2017 @ 04:32 PM
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a reply to: Area201


Trying to find out the truth of what is going on? How? By asking a guy in a 7/11 and by swallowing as much chemtrail guff as you can get hold of?

Any research or learning about weather or aviation? Nope. Any searching for ground based sources of pollution? Nope. People like you just make me laugh. Chemtrails, lol. Sorry, but I gave up patiently explaining the reality of chemtrails on these boards years ago. I am utterly gobsmacked that this garbage is still even going.

edit on 7-5-2017 by waynos because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 10 2017 @ 10:53 AM
link   

originally posted by: Area201

originally posted by: 3danimator2014

originally posted by: Area201
a reply to: D8Tee

So you didn't watch the first link he provided where the guy collects the vapor in a jar, gets it analyzed and results with Barium in excessive unsafe amounts? So the guy has to get into his own private plane and follow the military plane, hoping he won't get shot down to get to the source and prove it?

I don't see how is this benefiting the population or national security. It's looking like creating business for some chem companies or part of a specific military budget. I'm being very simplistic here in accusations I know. I think there is a guy or a group that is suing the government to get to the bottom of what's going on. I'll need to look into that and post here later.




How are you not understanding this? There are untold numbers of sources of pollution on the ground? Its impossible to know that any sample came from 35k feet up. Why don't you get this?

Also, in the 25 years I've lived in London, there have been a handful of days where the city has woken up to find a fine brown powder covering the cars and other surfaces in the street. Know what that powder is? Sand blown in from the Sahara desert. It was so fine, the wind blew it for thousands of miles.

And that was from the GROUND. Aerosol particles sprayed at 35k feet would travel for much much MUCH longer and farther and would certainty never I'm a million years just float straight down to the people below the planes flight path.

You can argue all you want, but these are facts that cannot be disputed I'm afraid.


How are you not understanding that we are trying to find out what is going on exactly and just because we don't know for sure or can find out conclusively right away we should make no inquiry or look into it? Oh look, the planes appear to be spraying something into our skies again. Lets just ignore something is happening and don't ask questions. we have no way of knowing anything. Nothing to see here. /s How are you not getting that?


Yes -- ask questions, but don't ignore the answers because you don't like them.

When an investigation shows that what people call "chemtrails" have no good solid evidence of existing...AND every characteristic of these trails that the chemtrail believers say "they can't be contrails becuase _______" ends up being a real charactistic of contrails, then at some point the questions being asked seem to be answered.

However, just because those answers don't agree with some people's pre-conceived notions (i.e., their biases) about the existence of chemtrails, that does not mean that the answers are not valid.


As for your point about stuff taking a while to fall from the sky to the ground: I agree that it may take a while. However, how does that prove that some contrails are really chemtrails? Please explain the specific evidence that those puffy white trails in the sky that are produced by some high-flying planes are not normal contrails, but are intentionally and secretly sprayed chemicals.


edit on 10/5/2017 by Soylent Green Is People because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 16 2017 @ 01:20 AM
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originally posted by: waynos
a reply to: Area201


Trying to find out the truth of what is going on? How? By asking a guy in a 7/11 and by swallowing as much chemtrail guff as you can get hold of?

Any research or learning about weather or aviation? Nope. Any searching for ground based sources of pollution? Nope. People like you just make me laugh. Chemtrails, lol. Sorry, but I gave up patiently explaining the reality of chemtrails on these boards years ago. I am utterly gobsmacked that this garbage is still even going.


Lets see how to respond to your condescending reply. First of all I had no interest in this subject until the day I came across suspicious contrails in my area with my own eyes last year. I happened to be going into a 7-11 so I asked someone what he thinks about them. That's not doing any research, it was just an introduction to the subject first hand.

Okay so what do I do next, I rent out a plane and go catch the contrails up in the upper stratosphere along with my camera crew and independent witness to analyze. No, I don't have a private plane and those resources. So I go online and check out some of the debates on this forum, found here. I check out some other forum that may show both sides to get an understanding and get an overview of the topic and challenges to getting some conclusive answer.

What I see is the debunkers pressing for, besides the basic "these are all contrails, you're an idiot" arguments, is for real testing. The visual element is irrelevant, all that seems to count for them is, the chemtrail people need to go up and get samples from the trails and analyze. No discussion about what we are looking at is going to get us the answer we seek. Okay. So I google if people have tried this on their own, and I found someone did in Europe and made a documentary Overcast about this venture. I rented it out and watched it.

The result were mixed, as there was an unexpected issue. There was an issue that seemed to block a proper test - the pilot was not given permission to go up to the elevation to get the samples. Okay so he lands and calls in and get permission ahead of time, and tell them when he's doing it. So he does that and gets to the elevation needed on the next flight. The results come back and the first sample had highly abnormal amount of aerosoles, than should be found in just water vapor or contrails. The second one didn't have the levels and seemed normal. So it was inconclusive, but the problem with this test is that it wasn't a random sampling, as they had to inform the authorities, which could theoretically be a heads up to those spraying. While this is really conspiracy minded, it nevertheless introduces a factor in the process that may result in false results. So basically this particular investigator in those circumstances was unable to get fair and honest samples from the trails to test.

However, a German scientist (working under Saubamer Himmel) did rain water analysis which showed that there exist borium and aluminum that is nano sized. He says that "many laboratories in the U.S. get letters not to test for aluminum anymore." So it makes it harder to even get a lab to check it. He claims, in the documentary, that these nano sized particles were to small to measure by ordinary lab methods, and they were not able to check for them until they came up with some "apparesus" blood cleaning method, all the pollutants in the blood they are filtered out. "When nano sized particles are filtered out they form lumps and they can be shown with ordinary methods. What we found the results of 200 patients from the U.S. is that the aluminum content, total physical stress from the metal, are 100 times larger than all the other metals." (44th min in documentary)

Then I watched a youtube video in which a whistleblower, Kristen Meghan, gave her testimony. I have't researched any counter claims to debunk her, but you can watch yourself, sounds very credible as someone who worked on the inside.



Finally, even if chemtrails aren't real, this articleclearly explains how geoengineering is a science that can be used to cool the planet and other purposes. It would make sense to use this method in order to help counter global warming (theoretically speaking).

From a logistical perspective:

1. It's real. Geoengineering – making large-scale changes to the environment – is no longer fringe science.

2. How it works. Aerosols reflect solar radiation back into space, lowering Earth surface temperatures. They can also provide "seeds" around which water droplets coalesce to form clouds, thus further increasing the planet's reflectivity. The particles are fairly long-lived in the stratosphere, a stable region of the atmosphere that begins five to six miles up. This makes the idea of aerosols' use as a worldwide planet-cooler fairly attractive.

3. If global warming (theoretically) is real this is one way to counter it. (ignoring the drawbacks - which there are many - and yes we know -as do many respected scientists- global man made warming is in fact real, though that is another directly related issue). So it would makes sense to do this counter measure of polluting the atmosphere with aerosols after man made fossil fuel burning increases RATE of warming not usual with regular cycles).

People like you disgust me.



edit on 16-5-2017 by Area201 because: no #s given

edit on 16-5-2017 by Area201 because: no #s given

edit on 16-5-2017 by Area201 because: no #s given

edit on 16-5-2017 by Area201 because: no #s given

edit on 16-5-2017 by Area201 because: no #s given



posted on May, 16 2017 @ 02:42 AM
link   

originally posted by: Area201

originally posted by: waynos
a reply to: Area201


Trying to find out the truth of what is going on? How? By asking a guy in a 7/11 and by swallowing as much chemtrail guff as you can get hold of?

Any research or learning about weather or aviation? Nope. Any searching for ground based sources of pollution? Nope. People like you just make me laugh. Chemtrails, lol. Sorry, but I gave up patiently explaining the reality of chemtrails on these boards years ago. I am utterly gobsmacked that this garbage is still even going.


go catch the contrails up in the upper stratosphere



1. It's real. Geoengineering – making large-scale changes to the environment – is no longer fringe science.

2. How it works. Aerosols reflect solar radiation back into space, lowering Earth surface temperatures. They can also provide "seeds" around which water droplets coalesce to form clouds, thus further increasing the planet's reflectivity. The particles are fairly long-lived in the stratosphere, a stable region of the atmosphere that begins five to six miles up. This makes the idea of aerosols' use as a worldwide planet-cooler fairly attractive.

3. If global warming (theoretically) is real this is one way to counter it. (ignoring the drawbacks - which there are many - and yes we know -as do many respected scientists- global man made warming is in fact real, though that is another directly related issue). So it would makes sense to do this counter measure of polluting the atmosphere with aerosols after man made fossil fuel burning increases RATE of warming not usual with regular cycles).

People like you disgust me.




Contrails aren't in the upper stratosphere, they're in the upper troposphere around 35,000ft

Geoengineering would take place in the mid-stratosphere around 80,000



posted on May, 16 2017 @ 08:00 AM
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a reply to: Area201

Geoengineering is real (or at least a real idea that can conceivably be implemented), but those puffy white trails that we see often being caused by jets flying at certain altitudes are still just contrails and not signs of geoengineering.

I mean, there are geoengineering ideas that include seeding the oceans with certain materials. However, if I see a ship leaving a visible wake behind it, that does not mean they are involved with geoengineering (granted, a wake may only be a very broad analogy to contrails, but the analogy is still valid).


edit on 16/5/2017 by Soylent Green Is People because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 16 2017 @ 08:58 AM
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So, the aluminum that you claim is being released, does it stay in the atmosphere to reflect sunlight, or does it fall to the ground?

It sounds like your postulating that the materials being released are intended to make clouds. Is that right?

Or does the material itself reflect sunlight to cool the planet?



posted on May, 16 2017 @ 10:02 AM
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a reply to: Area201

Kristen Meghan has nothing to do with chemtrails. She said so herself. She was whistleblowing about chemicals used on the base, on the aircraft that were there. She also went on to say that she knew nothing about chemtrails until she started reading about them online.



posted on Jul, 1 2017 @ 11:22 PM
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a reply to: Zaphod58

Your statement is factually incorrect. It's pointless any further discussion.



posted on Jul, 1 2017 @ 11:40 PM
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a reply to: Area201

Try doing some research for a change.


My whistleblowing is not related to chemtrails, it is related to industrial ground activities that overexposed the workers and they didn't want it reported, and since I took the samples, they wanted to demonize me in case I spoke out.

It is going through what I did as a whistleblower than led to my activism. Chemtrails and the TSA are my biggest topics I am linked to.

www.metabunk.org...


The title is inaccurate, I've been trying to get the info out. I am not an engineer, but I worked in Bioenvironmental Engineering. I am an Industrial Hygienist and Environmental Specialist.

I did talk about chemtrails and seeing the materials on system, but as an AF whistleblower, I blew the whistle on an attempt to cover up carcinogenic overexposures; this was from industrial sanding operations, not chemtrails.

I just wanted to clear that up.

Peace, Love, and Liberty,

Kristen Meghan

www.thethinkingatheist.com...

Wait, let me guess, this is just someone pretending to be her, right?



posted on Jul, 2 2017 @ 04:13 PM
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a reply to: Area201


People like you disgust me.


Yeah, thanks for that. When people actually KNOW their subject and are able to see straight through the bull, it must be a real pain in the arse when you have a lie to peddle.

I went back to answer some of the points you raised, but it's ALL rubbish. Kirsten Meghan??

Higher than expected "Aerosoles" (sic) in water vapour? Why would one expect to find *any* aerosols in water vapour, specifically? clearly a sentence constructed by someone with no clue how "aerosols" and "water vapour" fit into the debate.

The whole thing reads like it was written by someone who picked up a few keywords, without understanding them or their context, and decided to look clever by using them. I don't know they are your words or if you are quoting someone.

You complain that my response was condescending. This is not personal, my condescension was directed at what you wrote, not you as a person. This is another common thing among chemtrail believers who seem emotionally attached to what they write and take disagreement as a personal attack. Still, not my problem, but don't feel hurt by it. I attack the argument, because the argument is stupid. In all other respects you may be an exceptional human being, I am able to draw that distinction.

What's more, NONE of it is about contrails, or why contrails are, or may be, chemtrails. It uses the old "geoengineering" umbrella without attempting to explain the link. You may well think that any talk of releasing anything into any part of the atmosphere is directly analogous to the chemtrail/contrail argument. But there is a huge chasm there that you haven't bridged AT ALL. Geoengineering is many things, chemtrails are hogwash.

edit on 2-7-2017 by waynos because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 2 2017 @ 04:37 PM
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I am still waiting for someone to tell me where they are hiding this fleet of planes that is doing the spraying... cause I can guarantee its not happening from any aircraft with a normal job, the weight has to be accounted for on the weight and balance sheet so the crew can make certain they do not crash on take off or landing.

There are a couple of scientific planes that were used for cloud seeding... but to do chem trails to the extent that people are claiming would take an entire fleet of planes... so where are they...who are the air crews... who are the maintainers?



posted on Jul, 2 2017 @ 04:38 PM
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originally posted by: Rob48
a reply to: cavtrooper7

Contrails are not "water vapour", because water vapour is invisible. That's one of the big misconceptions that confuses people.


What do you think clouds are? And what's that stuff that's coming out of my kettle every time I use it?

More seriously, here is a paper (PDF) on chemtrails and their military applications, written by a doctoral student and complete with respectable sources and references so you can check what he's saying for yourself.

(The publication is Lobster magazine, a good source for this sort of thing - I am not the author and have no financial interest in Lobster magazine).

Doctoral students are not immune to believing cranky things, of course, but overall I think this is the best presentation available of the case for taking chemtrails seriously.



posted on Jul, 2 2017 @ 04:42 PM
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a reply to: audubon

Christ I hate that paper so much. They always cite the Air Force 2025 paper, without checking the background of it. It was a theoretical paper, written for the Air Force, using fictional representations.


2025 is a study designed to comply with a directive from the chief of staff of the Air Force to examine the
concepts, capabilities, and technologies the United States will require to remain the dominant air and space
force in the future. Presented on 17 June 1996, this report was produced in the Department of Defense school
environment of academic freedom and in the interest of advancing concepts related to national defense. The
views expressed in this report are those of the authors and do not reflect the official policy or position of the
United States Air Force, Department of Defense, or the United States government.
This report contains fictional representations of future situations/scenarios. Any similarities to real people or
events, other than those specifically cited, are unintentional and are for purposes of illustration only.
This publication has been reviewed by security and policy review authorities, is unclassified, and is cleared
for public release.

csat.au.af.mil...



posted on Jul, 2 2017 @ 04:47 PM
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a reply to: audubon

Clouds are ice crystals or water droplets, which is why you see them as opaque. Not vapour.

Likewise, the visible portion of the steam that comes out of your kettle is tiny water droplets.

Water vapour is an invisible gas.

The 2025 document was a student paper, not an Air Force document in the way people think. Don't take my word for that, read ITS OWN introduction page.
edit on 2-7-2017 by waynos because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 2 2017 @ 04:53 PM
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a reply to: waynos

As the next line in my post indicated, I wasn't being entirely serious. 'Steam' is used interchangeably with 'wet steam' by most people, thus the confusion, because everyone knows that 'steam' is not invisible in everyday experience.



posted on Jul, 2 2017 @ 04:56 PM
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a reply to: Zaphod58

The mention of the 2025 sci-fi paper is immediately followed by this sentence:


The programme is actually operational, and is referred to in other, unclassified US Air Force papers discussed below.



posted on Jul, 2 2017 @ 04:58 PM
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a reply to: audubon


Yeah, that's cool, but it's hard enough to get believers to understand your point sometimes without using vague and interchangeable terms. These are exactly the sort of points they use to argue against contrails, so clarity can be important.



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