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originally posted by: Mikehawk
a reply to: Dark Ghost
Israel, is a terrorist state.
The USA supports many terrorists so their undying support for Israel is not surprising. The dual citizenship within the US government who are loyal to Israel first is quite surprising and most Americans are unaware of these "allocations" within our government, nor are they aware of the Israeli lobbyists who dictate American policy.
The US doesn't support Israel.
We are controlled by Israel...
hile there is no obligation to do so, I think it is beneficial for the US to support Israel to a degree that is reasonable as long as Israel's actions are not harming US interests in the process. As of present, the US needs to be actively less biased in favour of Israel and more in favour of reason and justice. In its current form, US support of Israel is very harmful to the US and will continue to be until the US can openly assert some pressure on Israel without fearing public opinion.
originally posted by: the2ofusr1
Israel is a can of worms even when looked at biblically alone. Now throw them into a secular world and it then becomes impossible to coherently define them .Add the dimensions of money ,religion ,and military it then takes you to places far far from common sense . If the US can wage wars based on its National interests and be justified then does that not open the door for Israel to do the same .
Israel has become like the tree in the garden .Best to leave it alone and let God handle it .He has already said that He would make Jerusalem a cup of trembling to the Nations .This goes very very deep and is being played out on all levels weather seen or unseen .
We can all get a vague understanding of the many "isms" we have to educate ourselves with to try to understand whats up ...Zionism is not your standard "ism" . My cryptic attempt was only done to reduce to the bare bones a subject that has volumes of work one can reference and at the end of the day will be left shaking your head in disbelief .
Although a bit cryptic. I think you said it best!
originally posted by: Shamrock6
Well it's all pretty subjective, even in your "objective" conclusions.
Who decides if what Israel does or doesn't do furthers or hinders American interests? You? Me? Or policy makers?
And you haven't even really touched (much) on why the US supports Israel, which runs the gamut of financial influence to military strength in the region to using Israel to counteract other countries, including Russia, doing stuff in the region. Just sorta glossed over that aspect of the relationship.
Far from being some great mystery as to why the big brother US is so benevolent to tiny little Israel, the reasons are ridiculously broad and deep.
As for your solution/suggestion that it would be better for everybody if people "over there" just got along and didn't want each other dead...I mean...duh?
originally posted by: burdman30ott6
There are a number of tangential issues the OP didn't get into surrounding US/Israel relations. For instance, 3/4ths of the annual aid the US provides to Israel is mandated by treaty to be spent on US manufactured goods and services. To my knowledge, there is no other nation on Earth that the US provides "aid" to that has a guaranteed 75% ROI right off the top.
The USSR sided with and armed Egypt and Syria during the (Egyptian aggression) Yom Kippur War. Nixon had little choice except to do the same for Israel, considering the status of the world at-large as a proxy war sandbox for a game between the US and Soviets. This marked a dramatic shift in US policy away from middle eastern nuetrality and acknowledging Israel's right to statehood, to siding with Israel and actively defending her statehood.
The following decade saw US friendly leadership fall in Iran, replaced with Islamic extremism, frequent combat initiated by Lebanon, and a slowly maturing relationship between the US and Egypt. It behooved the US to maintain a high degree of support for Israel because, frankly, when the Shah fell Israel was our only trustworthy ally in the region who also held any sort of military muscle and strategic location against further incursions by Soviet backed warlords. (Not to say the US was innocent in this... *cough* Saddam Hussein *cough*)
There was also the fact that the main "loser" in the US' backing of Israel was Palestine, then controled by the Palestinian Liberation Organization, which was considered a terrorist organization until the early 90s, when their first intifada marking the height of violence in the region came to an end.
The real reason the United States is so heavily invested in this relationship is because such a partnership increases U.S. political influence, enhances its military capability and helps stimulate its defense sector. Yet, for Israel, it makes them militarily, politically and economically dependent on a foreign power. Almost three-fourths of the more than $3 billion in aid has to be spent on U.S. goods and services; moreover, under the new agreement, Israel will eventually have to spend all the aid with U.S. contractors. This means spending money purchasing defense equipment abroad, which also debilitates Israel's defense sector and its ability to make its own weapons.
In another concession that was controversial in Israel’s defense industry, Netanyahu agreed to phase out a special arrangement that for decades has allowed Israel to spend 26 percent of U.S. aid on defense research, development and procurement. No other country receiving U.S. funding is allowed to do so. But Israel was granted that exception in the 1980s so it could build up its nascent defense infrastructure. With Israel’s defense industry now thriving, the Obama administration wanted U.S. aid directed to American companies providing goods and services.