Alien Sky: The Lightning Scarred Planet, Mars (Full Documentary)

a reply to: MasterAtArms

The fact that I have to give you an answer is hilarious. You actually don't know what force I am talking about?

originally posted by: Triggernometry
a reply to: MasterAtArms

The fact that I have to give you an answer is hilarious. You actually don't know what force I am talking about?

Why don't you tell me why you aren't being repelled off the face of the earth first with your density repelling law?

Two can play at the no-answer game you know. And I do know what physical law you are trying to refer to.

If you say so!

So, why aren't you repelled off the face of the denser earth with your density repelling law?

a reply to: MasterAtArms

Can you push your finger through gold foil? Gold had a higher density than your finger

Can you push your finger through it without pushing it away first? I can also ask you why gravity is not strong enough to break a thick rope but is strong enough to break a thin thread with the same weight on it. There obviously is a ratio.

a reply to: MasterAtArms

Not sure, I can speculate but I don't need to prove a completely working alternative model, to point out the flaws in the current one. But I will try to work towards it.

Let's first acknowledge the existence of the force that makes high density matter repel lower density matter and call it by its name.

Anyone?

originally posted by: Triggernometry
Why can't I push my finger through a table? What is causing the upward, almost buoyant like force that keeps my finger from sinking into the table?

A pressure gradient?

Or the fact that the particles that make up the table repel the particles that make up my finger, because the table has a higher density?

This is not even speculation, this is a proven fact. Can anyone tell me the name of this repelling force.

Anyone?

a reply to: MasterAtArms

At this point, I would be pretty sure that other FE / EU believers reading this thread would be laughing so hard at your ideas because they are so complete nonsense

The principle I am talking about is not an idea. It is a proven science fact.

Are you saying there is not an identified force that makes high density matter repel lower density matter?

Because that would be an actual joke.

a reply to: Triggernometry

The principle I am talking about is not an idea. It is a proven science fact.

What principle? How atom electron shells slightly repel because of electromagnetic forces UNLESS either enough energy is imparted to break the nuclear bonds between those atoms, or there is an exchange of electrons within the two atomic shells that causes an interaction?

Electromagnet repulsion between atom electron shells does not mean matter can not bond and be consistently repelled away for a huge amount of distance (relative to the atom size) in the manner you think it can.

Gravity is a completely different type of effect.

Let's first acknowledge the existence of the force that makes high density matter repel lower density matter and call it by its name

The force you are imagining here would act utterly in opposition to gravity

Under your idea, how would something like, say, a Carbon Dioxide molecule exist? Carbon being heavier (denser) than the two oxygen atoms it is bound with

a reply to: MasterAtArms

The force you are imagining here would act utterly in opposition to gravity

What imagined force? Electromagnetism is the force that makes high density matter repel low density matter. This is science fact.

If this is in opposition to gravity, which is a hypothetical force, then maybe that should tell you something.

a reply to: MasterAtArms

It is a fact that the force that prevents me from sticking my finger through higher density matter, is caused by electromagnetism.

Why is it any different with air and water, or helium and air. It is the same force that prevents lower density matter from sinking into higher density matter.

a reply to: Triggernometry

high density matter repel low density matter.

Why isn't the earth broken up into its constituent components ? How do molecules containing different "density" atoms bind?

a reply to: MasterAtArms

Are you now arguing against a fact established by the mainstream science you subscribe to? Don't ask me.

Explain the difference between my finger not sinking into the denser table, proven to be caused by electromagnetism, and air not sinking in water, or helium not sinking in air.

originally posted by: Triggernometry
a reply to: MasterAtArms
Electromagnetism is the force that makes high density matter repel low density matter. This is science fact.

First I heard of such definition. Are you making stuff up as you go along? Electromagnetism solely has to do with electric charges (same ones repelling and opposite ones attracting) and the motion of charged particles in a magnetic field. No word about matter density I've ever seen in any article about EM force.

Your finger doesn't go through a table because the table's electrons repel your finger's electrons (and your finger doesn't apply enough force to break the molecular bonds in the table top).

Air bubble doesn't sink in water but goes up because, as you have been told, it is lighter than the volume of water it displaces. Because that displaced water is heavier, it will try to sink down below the bubble, thus pushing it up. Same mechanism for helium baloon in the heavier air, and neither of those have anything to do with repelling (or attracting)force of Electromagnetism. In fact, if you could get enough static charge on the surface of the helium ballonn, it would stick to a surface that has the opposite charge and not go anywhere (despite the heavier air pushing it up).

~~~

P.S. I realise there might be a flaw with this explanation, as a helium balloon attached to the ground with a string, and in a room with (hypothetically speaking) completely still air, will still experience an upward force. So, what's pulling (or pushing) it up, against the force of gravity? Perhaps worth asking in the Science & Physics forum...

~~~

P.P.S. Ah, found this very good explanation at physics.stackexchange.com...

Any fluid in a gravitational field possesses a pressure gradient, (which if the gas/liquid is in equilibrium) counterbalances the effect of gravity. Gravity acting on such a fluid creates this pressure, which is referred to a hydrostatic pressure. To make a long story short, the external pressure (of the air) is greater at the bottom of your ballon than at the top. So the net external pressure on the ballon is imbalanced, providing a net upward force equal to the weight of the displaced air.

a reply to: wildespace

Yep!

The other problem is: He's trying to compare the macro world to the quantum world.

Rules for EM based upon electron repulsion work differently on a sub atomic level than they do in the macroscale.

a reply to: MasterAtArms

How do molecules containing different "density" atoms bind?

Electromagnetism......

a reply to: wildespace

First I heard of such definition. Are you making stuff up as you go along? Electromagnetism solely has to do with electric charges (same ones repelling and opposite ones attracting) and the motion of charged particles in a magnetic field. No word about matter density I've ever seen in any article about EM force.

Can you push your finger though a table or not? If not, is this caused by repelling particles or not? If so, are the particles that are denser repelling the particles that are less dense?

If so, how is electromagnetism not the reason that low density objects don't sink into higher density objects?

No word about matter density I've ever seen in any article about EM force.

That should tell you something. But you can think for yourself right?

a reply to: TerminalVelocity

The other problem is: He's trying to compare the macro world to the quantum world.

Or the problem is that science thinks they are seperate, because they got their model all screwed up.

a reply to: wildespace

Air bubble doesn't sink in water but goes up because, as you have been told, it is lighter than the volume of water it displaces. Because that displaced water is heavier, it will try to sink down below the bubble, thus pushing it up. Same mechanism for helium baloon in the heavier air, and neither of those have anything to do with repelling (or attracting)force of Electromagnetism. In fact, if you could get enough static charge on the surface of the helium ballonn, it would stick to a surface that has the opposite charge and not go anywhere (despite the heavier air pushing it up).

I already showed that this requires an upstream of the medium itself which is not what happens.

Again, show me the difference between my finger not sinking into a table, and air not sinking into water, or helium not sinking into air.

Is my finger not sinking into the table because of a pressure gradient?

originally posted by: Triggernometry
a reply to: wildespace

First I heard of such definition. Are you making stuff up as you go along? Electromagnetism solely has to do with electric charges (same ones repelling and opposite ones attracting) and the motion of charged particles in a magnetic field. No word about matter density I've ever seen in any article about EM force.

Can you push your finger though a table or not? If not, is this caused by repelling particles or not? If so, are the particles that are denser repelling the particles that are less dense?

If so, how is electromagnetism not the reason that low density objects don't sink into higher density objects?

No word about matter density I've ever seen in any article about EM force.

That should tell you something. But you can think for yourself right?

You can place a brick on top of a piece of aerogel (which has extremely low density) and the aerogel will stop the brick from going through it. It's really not about relative density but about structural strength.


A 2.5 kg brick is supported on top of a piece of aerogel weighing only 2 grams.

You seem to have an overly simplified way of reasoning. According to you, since a table repells your finger, it must be the same mechanism by which air repells helium balloon? But why is the balloon repelled upwards? Might it have to do with such concepts as weight and (gasp!) gravity?

See my answer in the previous post as to why exactly the helium balloon is pushed upwards.