originally posted by: dfnj2015
This is NOT a fact but an opinion.
I think the problem with Muslims is not the religion but too many people being radicalized because they are living in poverty. And they are living in
poverty as a direct result of US bombings. The US dropped 28,000 bombs on five predominately Muslim countries in 2016. What is the purpose of the
You remind me of somebody who reads a novel that is filled with a strong plot, interesting characters, fantastic imagery, amazing plot twists and a
comprehensive vocabulary. It also contains two spelling errors and the ending is anti-climactic. When asked about the book by a friend who is
interested in reading it, you tell them "Meh, pretty good but it does have some spelling errors and the ending is boring."
In other words, you have focused on an error that in the context of the whole thread is so minor compared to everything else that it seems you were
actively trying to find something wrong as soon as you realised the thread itself might be making some sense. This made you so uncomfortable that you
began to start reading from the beginning with a far more critical eye and began focusing on anything that could be used as evidence that the overall
argument of the thread had problems.
If this was a widespread problem, then you would have a point. But I think either you might be genuine and are lazy, or more likely you are what I
described above because your only complaint seems to be found by reading the conclusion which is at the end of a very long thread. If you felt the
conclusion itself was wrong, why not address the actual calculation itself or point out how reaching that calculation was very unlikely to be
accurate? It really does seem like your argument is a "you don't understand the difference between an opinion and a fact" when if you read through the
whole thread properly, you would realise that I clearly do know the difference and never intentionally tried to imply the reader should forget it
either only while reading this particular thread.
* * * * *
The "Most Muslim radicals are the product of their environment caused mainly by Western policies" argument is not only misleading, but it is actually
a rather weak argument.
It is misleading because it assumes that the vast majority of Islamic extremists would cease to exist if the West stopped interfering in Muslim
countries. This is not true. There would certainly be a large reduction of Islamic extremists attacking the West, but the problems in the Muslim world
would not disappear and Muslims would still be murdering Muslims due to disagreements in beliefs or whether other Muslim countries are allied with
Western countries. This has happened in the past, it is happening now and will happen in the future even if the West does change its foreign
What makes your argument weak is that many of the most significant terrorist attacks have involved people who were well educated and who most were
either of average wealth or very wealthy. Material possessions, the accumulation of knowledge paled in comparison to their core religious beliefs. In
addition, look at the number of Western non-Muslims that have converted to Islam and flown half-way across the world to fight against the armies of
their own native countries. It is rare, but is is not extremely rare. And it is probably most indicative of how dangerous an unhealthy passionate
belief in Islam can be for anybody in the world. What kind of belief system can cause such an astronomical shift in values, priorities and loyalties
in such a short period of time for this type of thing to not happen once or twice, but 20-50 times?
As I said in another thread, if I were able to ensure the immediate stop of bombing of any Muslim country from right this moment on and promised not
to do so again unless it was to ensure the survival of the West (which would have to be supported at the very least by the UN), and in return I asked
for Islamic radicals to stop attacking Western countries, I would make that deal right now, no questions asked.
Unfortunately, even if both sides held to their word, Muslims would still be killing other Muslims for stupid reasons, women in Muslim countries would
still be subjugated, homosexuals would still be prosecuted and killed, Sharia would still function and make life suck for most of the population, and
worst of all, this could never change. It would be a perpetual cycle and would never be challenged by those being oppressed.
So what do we do? How do we fix this situation?
edit on 6/4/2017 by Dark Ghost because: (no reason given)