Christian "Evolution"

[q]Maybe you can show me that life in the water
What version of the bible do you use?[/q]



GENESIS....it starts where it says .."the spirit of GOD lived upon the water..."...KJV version...i dont need to twist it ..its there..lol


[edit on 14-2-2005 by BaastetNoir]

Originally posted by BaastetNoir

[q]Maybe you can show me that life in the water
What version of the bible do you use?[/q]



GENESIS....it starts where it says .."the spirit of GOD lived upon the water..."...KJV version...i dont need to twist it ..its there..lol


[edit on 14-2-2005 by BaastetNoir]

God is not a germ that evolved into trees and men.
I dont think that is the KJV you have there
I dont see that version at all

Gen 1:2

(ASV) And the earth was waste and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep: and the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters

(CEV) The earth was barren, with no form of life; it was under a roaring ocean covered with darkness. But the Spirit of God was moving over the water.

(ESV) The earth was without form and void, and darkness was over the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God was hovering over the face of the waters.

(GB) And the earth was without forme and void, and darkenesse was vpon the deepe, and the Spirit of God mooued vpon the waters.

(HNV) Now the earth was formless and empty. Darkness was on the surface of the deep. God's Spirit was hovering over the surface of the waters.

(KJVR) And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters.

(MSG) Earth was a soup of nothingness, a bottomless emptiness, an inky blackness. God's Spirit brooded like a bird above the watery abyss.

(SVD) وَكَانَتِ الارْضُ خَرِبَةً وَخَالِيَةً وَعَلَى وَجْهِ الْغَمْرِ ظُلْمَةٌ وَرُوحُ اللهِ يَرِفُّ عَلَى وَجْهِ الْمِيَاهِ.

Nope. No life on earth at that time.
Only God above the earth

Baas,

I want to point something out to you. It is not often that I find someone capable of thinking for themselves. Though I do not believe the bible describes evolution, I do believe that christians can, and will someday embrace evolution. They will someday embrace science. Sir Isaac Newton, Nicolas Copernicus, Johannes Kepler and others like them payed a heavy price to prove simple things like, the world was round, even as family members and friends were murdered as a result by christians during the crusades. The same process is active now. Give it a generation, and I am positive most ignorant people will be over themselves by then. The pope told catholics to embrace it. Most do not right now. They will. Once this younger generation that is in school now learns of science, people that choose to be stupid will decline heavily in numbers.

It is only a matter of time before people accept reality.

GEN:1:2 (KJV)

"... And the spirit of God moved upon the face of the water."

and i did not say GOD was a worm or evolved from anything...

Originally posted by Seapeople
Baas,

I want to point something out to you. It is not often that I find someone capable of thinking for themselves. Though I do not believe the bible describes evolution, I do believe that christians can, and will someday embrace evolution. They will someday embrace science. Sir Isaac Newton, Nicolas Copernicus, Johannes Kepler and others like them payed a heavy price to prove simple things like, the world was round, even as family members and friends were murdered as a result by christians during the crusades. The same process is active now. Give it a generation, and I am positive most ignorant people will be over themselves by then. The pope told catholics to embrace it. Most do not right now. They will. Once this younger generation that is in school now learns of science, people that choose to be stupid will decline heavily in numbers.

It is only a matter of time before people accept reality.

its called Fear ... fear makes ppl keep thei heads in the bucket ..in some cases FEAR of FAITH makes atheist denying the existance of GOD.... and in the case of believers its FEAR of facing things behind the Gospel/...

but thats just me ranting...

It doesnt take anything except a bit of reading comprehension to see there is no evolution in the bible.

It shows God creating everything , as is, by speaking..

No evolution in sight.
There is no such thing as 'christian evolution'

The idea of the GAP theory was born around the turn of the century when evolution started becoming more popular. So called christians, in the style of the RCC, comprimised Gods Word, with mans ideas.
Its nothing different that the idolitry of the OT.
Do a NT search on the phrase 'Lord Lord' and see what will happen to those self proclaimed 'christian evolutionists'

Its not a matter of evolution in the bible. It doesnt take an idiot to figure out there couldn't have been a great flood that covered all the mountians either. It doesn't take a brain surgeon to figure out that jesus must have died on the cross 3 times because there are three accounts telling three different stories, including significant changes like his last words. What were Jesus's last words? Why don't you take a look at mathew, mark, luke, and johns thoughts on it. See if you can get them to agree.

Does anyone else in here find it difficult to believe that a person who was as significant as jesus, didn't have people paying enough attention to him to get his LAST WORDS correct. If your parent, or significant other, or any important person in your life died. Even if they were there everyday of your life, what do you think the significance of their last words as they died would be to you? I can guarantee you one thing. You would not forget, or jumble them...ever.

and when I asked the three people who were there and saw the thread , "What was seapeoples last post about?", they answered

Person 1: He talked about how stupid evolution is

Person 2: He talked about the great flood from the day of noah, and how there were no mountains like we have today and that they are the result of the shifting plates crashing to a stop. i took a few liberties with your words to answer two things at once

Person 3: He talked about Jesus' last words from the point of view of three different people. He didnt understand that if All 4 gospels were going to be carbon copies, then God would have only given us one.

Thanks guys.

---------
If you want to see more examples of this kind of thing, read Daniel, Ezekiel, Isaiah, Jeremiah, Revelation.

Are you accusing me of saying those things? Tell me, where did I say evolution was stupid? Where did I say that mountains could not have been the same as they are today during the flood of noah?

If you are saying this, then once again, you are lying.

Originally posted by jake1997
and when I asked the three people who were there and saw the thread , "What was seapeoples last post about?", they answered

Jake were they drunk? You had to ASK three people for opinions. Is that how many people you need to come to a conclusion?

Person 1: He talked about how stupid evolution is

Jake may I ask you a question? Please dont be offended! ARE YOU HOOKED ON PHONICS? Anyone who has the ability to read( Maybe you should ask a 4th LITERATE friend of yours) can tell you that Seapeople said no such thing...

Person 2: He talked about the great flood from the day of noah, and how there were no mountains like we have today and that they are the result of the shifting plates crashing to a stop. i took a few liberties with your words to answer two things at once

Again in order to learn one must possess a good ability to read PROPERLY!
Seapeople...funny...did you mention any shrinkage of mountains?

Person 3: He talked about Jesus' last words from the point of view of three different people. He didnt understand that if All 4 gospels were going to be carbon copies, then God would have only given us one.

Do you know what a carbon copy looks like?
Here let me give you an ex.
First sheet: Here's a line on one sheet
Second sheet: The other sheet is not true.
Third sheet: The second sheet could be true or false.
Um yea as you can tell ( You dont even NEED to read) that those are not CARBON COPIES.

Jake, I didn't really feel like addressing this with you, but since someone else kindly stood up to defend me, I feel the need to.

In regards to your "carbon copy" revelation. I would like to say, that I agree with you. If there is a god, he wouldn't by any means put 4 carbon copy gospels in the bible. However, there is some serious, serious flaws to your logic once again. I am not sure if I have the time to hit each one, but I will try.

First off, a point needs to be made. Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John mark the only large scale duplications of any persons life in the bible. There are a couple places that provide somewhat of a good check to stories, but these four clearly are the most significant.

The first point I would like to make deals with significant differences between the four gospels and there effect on the bible as a whole. The last words of Jesus are just a few contradicting elements in the 4 gospels. Take the four gospels and try to tell me, using all four, what happened the day jesus rose from the dead. Was there an angel at his tomb? Was the large stone moved away? Tell me, using all four, where exactly Jesus ascended into heaven from. Did he whither a fig tree? Did he wither that tree instantly, or did it take a while? There are significant contradictions in these gospels. Regarding to location, and time. These are not translation errors. To be certain, the new testament is far more recent than anything in the old testament, therefore our ability to translate it will be significantly increased. If we can't even get the most recent issues from the bible to cooberate each other to a literal level, how are we supposed to literally take items of question from the old testament?

The second point I would like to make is directly related to his last words. First and foremost, I would like to say that my mother died from cancer. I didn't realize how much I would miss her until she was gone...though I had an idea. She said to me, before she lost consciousness for the last time, "thank you for everything, mike". That was the last thing, to the letter, that she said to me. Ironically, I wish she knew how thankful I really was and rightfully should be for everything she had done for me. It brings tears to my eyes at how selfless she was at the end. None the less, I WILL NEVER, EVER forget those words. There isnt a chance in hell that I will forget them unless I get a degenerative brain disease. Do you really mean to tell me, that these gospel writers disagree on those words? The most significant words in his life? I find it hard to make the assumption, that these specific words would be able to vary. Any other words can be forgiveable in my oppinion. Just not these.

The third point I want to address is the very significance of his last words themselves. "It is finished", "Father, into thy hands I commend my spirit", and "father, why have you forsaken me". It is finished...yep..it is. That sounds fine to me. Into thy hands I commend my spirit. I wont get into the issue that you believe Jesus was god, and yet he talked to god. But, that statement is all well and good as well barring that issue. However, "Father, why have you forsaken me?", now that is quite alarming, don't you think?

According to Meriam Webster's dictionary:

Forsaken: to renounce or turn away from entirely; abandon.

My god, my god, why have you abandoned me??! My god, my god, why have you renounced me and turned away from me completely?!?! Either way you look at it, something is wrong. Why on earth would God have "forsaken" jesus? You don't see a problem with this statement?

Well, there is more. I may or may not get to it depending on the mindless response I get for bringing these issues to light.

seapeople,

Thats the thing. Thats what its all about.
Jesus Christ took upon himself the sin of the world. If we die in our sin, we cannot be with God. Sin separates us from God. So when Jesus was sentenced, condemned, he was indeed separated from God.
He was given credit, by God, for every mans sin , and thus separated from God.

Oh, I just realized something important I missed.

Didn't jesus know ahead of time he was to die, and then rise again? Why on earth would he then say. "It is finished"?

Seapeople- i dont come here anymore but i drop by from time to time to see whats shakin, and it looks like the same old same old! but i got a thought for you...the other day i was walking and i thought about your statement about jesus last words on the cross. i have an answer! JESUS LAST WORDS WERE NOT ON THE CROSS! HE CONQURED DEATH ON THE CROSS, AND SET THE CAPTIVES FREE, HE LIVES AND MOVES AND SPEAKS NOW!!! so i say that he did not have any "last words" he is the WORD and he is speaking now..as to the time line you have questions about ,read it again! write it out, they all go together perfectly...you look only for gaps to fill the gap that eats at you...

creation, love and choice
rejection,taste,deception,knowledge,departure,and the cross looms
life happens,the messiah comes,he lives,he feels,he comes to his own
blind people, dead teaching, religion..the cross looms
the cross, the lamb,the scapegoat,the curtain is torn in two, reconciliation
he was the life! he took the fall! he is the god! he is the lamb, he is the father, he is the son, and he is the spirit......dementions... small capacitys to reason and yet we wage war on our maker! but the nations rage in vain!
the fear of the lord is the beginning of wisdom....without it..ting...ting...ting...ting..bouncing off the hollow caverns of a lonely mind...dead man walking..............my thoughts....

Ok, just for Ninki, I will rephrase the question....

What were jesus' last wors on the cross before everyone thought he was dead and buried him in a tomb?

I want to add something.

I wonder if anyone in here will know what I am talking about. Ever notive the terrifyingly odd terminology christians use while describing a person.

He is the Lamb, He is the word, he is the savior, he is yada yada yada....

How about other terminolgy. "Worship, saved.....i hate that one, born again.

it would be very odd indeed if we were decribing just a person...but it is with these words we try to decribe the most high god.... you hate the truth because it uncovers you, you like the dark because it does not expose you.

I kinda think its more like a strange cult and its secret passwords.

Originally posted by ninki
it would be very odd indeed if we were decribing just a person...but it is with these words we try to decribe the most high god.... you hate the truth because it uncovers you, you like the dark because it does not expose you.