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Ami Horowitz: What’s wrong with socialism?

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posted on Mar, 22 2017 @ 06:23 PM
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In the following video Ami Horowitz asks Americans who lean to the left "what is wrong about socialism"? I am certain you all know the answer to that. But then Horowitz went on to ask Venezuelans "what's wrong with socialism"?

To those interested on the truth about what socialism, or democratic socialism actually does to a country and it's people, watch this video.




‘This Is Only a Nightmare’: Venezuelans Have Sobering Advice for Americans Who Support Democratic Socialism

By Jenni Fink

Senator Bernie Sanders (I-VT) gained large support during the 2016 presidential election. The self-proclaimed Democratic Socialist campaigned heavily on big government programs like free college and universal health care.

In documentarian Ami Horowitz's latest short film, he contrasted Americans' view of socialism with Venezuelans' reality of socialism.
...
“The depth of poverty and hunger and extreme violence was shocking to me. I have travelled to dangerous places before, Pakistan, Gaza, Jenin, yet this was something different.”
...


ijr.com...


edit on 22-3-2017 by ElectricUniverse because: shorten excerpt.

edit on 22-3-2017 by ElectricUniverse because: correct comment.




posted on Mar, 22 2017 @ 06:36 PM
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a reply to: ElectricUniverse

Looks like a progressive utopia: Socialism, predominantly new world Spanish culture... violence, poverty, slums... all held together by corruption with no way out for the little people.


edit on 22-3-2017 by IgnoranceIsntBlisss because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 22 2017 @ 06:46 PM
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originally posted by: IgnoranceIsntBlisss

Looks like a progressive utopia: Socialism, predominantly new world Spanish culture... violence, poverty, slums... all held together by corruption with no way out for the little people.



The middle class becoming part of the low class meanwhile the elitists within the socialist government get richer.
edit on 22-3-2017 by ElectricUniverse because: correct comment.



posted on Mar, 22 2017 @ 07:05 PM
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a reply to: ElectricUniverse

I'm tired of countries who borrow too much money from corrupt banking systems who then go broke blaming the failure on socialism.

Socialism has nothing to do with poor financial decisions and corrupt banking.

Venezuela's failures have nothing to do with the political system. It's failure have everything to do with mismanagement and corruption.

The only my reason American Capitalism hasn't lead to the same downfall is we keep raising the debt ceiling, and the lenders keep letting us.

How do you think we are supposed to pay back 20 trillion dollars? Capitalism is not working for the same reason Socialism isn't working.

Mismanagement and corruption by elitists has lead to the downfall of every "ism".


edit on 22-3-2017 by Isurrender73 because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 22 2017 @ 07:22 PM
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a reply to: ElectricUniverse

at least half of every CIVILIZATION in the history of mankind has been socialist..

State paid police, military, fire dept, interstate system and every single other time tax dollars are spent to the benefit of all....


There is literally no civilization that has tried an all capitalism system..

Zero..

None..

That said does a 100% socialism system work??

It did in ancient times, but on a modern national scale.. it hasn't really yet..

As another caviat the capitalist side of things tend to sanction the hell out of any country they consider as anti capitalism. So I'm not sure the test cases have been 100% fair...

I think it is the same as with Napoleon..

You either let one of 3 groups of people run your country..

Monarchies you let the aristocracy rule..

Capitalism you let the merchant class rule.

Communism/socialism you let the peasants rule, which ends up being the military since the peasants fight your wars.

All have their pros and cons. And all scare the hell out of each other as whatever ruling class is in power is scared to death one of the other classes will oust them.



posted on Mar, 22 2017 @ 07:25 PM
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a reply to: Isurrender73

I think you also have to factor in all the sanctions..

Would communist Russia have succeeded financially if the west had not refused trade??



posted on Mar, 22 2017 @ 07:41 PM
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originally posted by: JoshuaCox
a reply to: Isurrender73

I think you also have to factor in all the sanctions..

Would communist Russia have succeeded financially if the west had not refused trade??





Communist Russia didn't succeed financially. It collapsed economically.

And even without the West trading with it, it was large enough that it had access to all it needed to be self-sufficient. it's failures were entirely due to its own mismanagement and ineptness of the command economy system.



posted on Mar, 22 2017 @ 07:44 PM
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a reply to: JoshuaCox

Keep making claims Joshua... No matter how many times you try, you can't change the fact that "in ancient times" there was no socialism... To survive tribes had to trade. Trading is part of capitalism, and trading means people owned things. Having a communal system doesn't equal to socialism, just like being in a society doesn't equal to being socialist...



posted on Mar, 22 2017 @ 07:47 PM
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originally posted by: JoshuaCox
a reply to: Isurrender73

I think you also have to factor in all the sanctions..

Would communist Russia have succeeded financially if the west had not refused trade??


wow...so you want to blame the west for the U.S.S.R. oppression, murder and imprisonment of millions of people?... The same old and false excuse...



posted on Mar, 22 2017 @ 07:55 PM
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a reply to: JoshuaCox

Social programs and providing for the general welfare of citizens is not socialism. Socialism is an economic system in which the state owns a monopoly on the means of production. Socialist countries are not ruled by the peasants, they are ruled by a technocratic aristocracy; planned economies, stifling of innovation, starvation/elimination of those who do not agree or contribute to the system.

Seeing how you lumped communism/socialism together shows your lack of understanding. Socialism is the theoretical transitional system towards communism, which communism is a 'stateless state' where there is no class, therefore no definition of peasantry or nobility; everybody just does their job without being told, all their needs are provided for, and unicorns crap candy coated rainbows out their @ss.



posted on Mar, 22 2017 @ 09:01 PM
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originally posted by: ElectricUniverse

originally posted by: JoshuaCox
a reply to: Isurrender73

I think you also have to factor in all the sanctions..

Would communist Russia have succeeded financially if the west had not refused trade??


wow...so you want to blame the west for the U.S.S.R. oppression, murder and imprisonment of millions of people?... The same old and false excuse...


I'm not blaming anyone for anything..

Just never hear that factored in as a variable.

Why do you think all democracies and communists are specifically at odds???

Why can't they all just do their own things??

Because it is all bout which class presently has the reins of society..

When napoleon had his revolution all the aristocracy flipped. Afraid their peasants would do the same...

Same here..

The merchant class of America is afraid the peasants will take over.

Communist countries do the same..

There it is the peasants scared of a big buisness take over.


Same ole story since at least Athens and Sparta... prob way older than that.



posted on Mar, 22 2017 @ 09:12 PM
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originally posted by: ElectricUniverse
a reply to: JoshuaCox

Keep making claims Joshua... No matter how many times you try, you can't change the fact that "in ancient times" there was no socialism... To survive tribes had to trade. Trading is part of capitalism, and trading means people owned things. Having a communal system doesn't equal to socialism, just like being in a society doesn't equal to being socialist...



Oh no Sparta was as socialistic as it gets and stomped a democratic capitalistic Athens almost ONLY because of demogages using democracy against itself..

All the Native American type tribal cultures and hunter gather tribes we have had even up to modern times didn't have money and everyone one worked for the good of the tribe.

Now does that work on a global economy the most efficiently.. prob not..which is why most incorporated some form of capitalism.

That said there are some needed fields that do not work "for profit".

Police, fire, healthcare , electricity , water , inferstructure.. the military..

Some things you don't even want for profit..

Private police, fire and militaries would be a disaster..

Our health care system in the US is screwed because we allow insurance companies to middle man the whole thing without actually doing any healthcare..

All the other BS works just fine for profit.

But for the things you can't afford to get wrong , you don't want people making the profitable decision..



posted on Mar, 22 2017 @ 11:05 PM
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a reply to: ElectricUniverse




To those interested on the truth about what socialism, or democratic socialism actually does to a country and it's people, watch this video.


Looking at Skandinavia would be considered cheating, I reckon?

Mum, Mum! Look!
I hacked his game with a sane comment, what's wrong with the interwebz today?




posted on Mar, 22 2017 @ 11:15 PM
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originally posted by: PublicOpinion
a reply to: ElectricUniverse




To those interested on the truth about what socialism, or democratic socialism actually does to a country and it's people, watch this video.


Looking at Skandinavia would be considered cheating, I reckon?

Mum, Mum! Look!
I hacked his game with a sane comment, what's wrong with the interwebz today?




I'm pretty sure the video is of corrupt dictaors... I'm doubting it includes Switzerland, Sweden and all the other Nordic countries that have by far beaten america at almost every measurable field..


Except militarily .. we own the whole world 2 times over militarily.



posted on Mar, 22 2017 @ 11:56 PM
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a reply to: JoshuaCox


Seriously, you have claimed these same things in the past and even though real history has been shown to you, you keep wanting to believe the fairy tale you made up...


...
Among the Aztecs and their neighbors (notably the Maya), cacao beans served as a prized beverage and a form of money. Among the different types of money, including large cotton cloaks and thin copper axes, cacao beans had the lowest value... rather like small change.
...

www.mexicolore.co.uk...

Aztec Economy Trade and Currency



...
Wampum
Facts, definition and information about the History of Clothing and regalia of Native American Indians and their Wampum. Wampum are the small cylindrical beads made from quahog or whelk shells. Both shells produce white beads, but only parts of the quahog produce purple beads. Wampum was used as Native American jewelry, for recording special events or as a form of currency by the Northeast Woodland tribes and the tribes of the Great Lakes.
...

www.warpaths2peacepipes.com...


By Carlos L. Rodriguez, Craig S. Galbraith,
and Curt H. Stiles

In the past, most if not all North American indigenous peoples had a strong belief in individual property rights and ownership. Frederick Hodge (1910) noted that individual private ownership was “the norm” for North American tribes.

Likewise, Julian Steward (1938, 253) asserted that among Native Americans communal property was limited, and Frances Densmore (1939) concluded that the Makah tribe in the Pacifc Northwest had property rights similar to Europeans.’ These early twentieth-century historians and anthropologists had the advantage of actually interviewing tribal members who had lived in pre-reservation Indian society.
...

www.warpaths2peacepipes.com...

Anyways... Care to point out any lies that Venezuelans are saying about socialism in the video?



posted on Mar, 23 2017 @ 12:03 AM
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a reply to: ElectricUniverse

Sounds like crony-capitalism.

You know that is what it is but I guess that capitalism being just a few steps from that keeps you from calling it what it really is.


edit on 23-3-2017 by daskakik because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 23 2017 @ 12:31 AM
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What is not wrong with it? What does "socialism" have to offer us? Us, who would just assume be, anti-"social"? Let me geuss? I'd have to wear a gold star and move somewhere for my own/families "safety", only to be moved later for "social/societies" safety. OP, I'd love to take you on a fishing trip. Somewhere, deep. Why would you even put this ignorant question out there? You must be some college kid, looking for "political science" answers.. Seeking a "arts degree ".I'm just going to assume you ain't a history major. What a FUBAR thing to post/ask.



posted on Mar, 23 2017 @ 12:37 AM
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originally posted by: murphy22
What a FUBAR thing to post/ask.

So you didn't even bother reading past the title?

Too bad, makes your post pretty FUBAR itself.



posted on Mar, 23 2017 @ 12:47 AM
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Say what you want about socialism but capitalism isn't perfect either. Particularly when a very small minority hoard all the wealth. The average person has no clue as to how the upper class actually lives. Their lifestyle is beyond what you could possible comprehend. While you eat your cheeseburgers form McDonalds or whatever they're eating $10,000 an ounce caviar. I'm not jealous of their lifestyle I just think some of their wealth should be spread out among people of all economic groups. When you compare 1950's America to today's America you would see that back then the wealth was more evenly distributed. The rich also paid a more proportionate amount of taxes.

My grandparents had no higher then a 8th grade education. They were born in the 1920's. They retired in the 1980's with 3 homes and enough money to live out their day comfortably. Over the past 40 years I've watched everything they fought and worked for get systematically destroyed by the rich. Opportunity existed for everyone in America back then. They say America is the land of opportunity. For many of US that saying is as dead as the American dream. I know people breaking their backs 7 days a week and by the time their old enough to die there won't be enough for them to be buried.

edit on 23-3-2017 by wantsome because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 23 2017 @ 12:49 AM
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a reply to: murphy22

Humm, where did I say anything positive about socialism?... i posted that question because it is the question Horowitz asked left leaning Americans, who believe in the fairy tale of socialism, and then Horowitz asks the same question to the Venezuelan people who are truly experiencing socialism.

Socialism is not the fairy tale that many people who have never lived it claim.



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