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Trump is right. The US should not be militarily involved in Ukraine.

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posted on Mar, 21 2017 @ 11:28 PM
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originally posted by: reldra

originally posted by: allsee4eye
a reply to: reldra

Ukraine is not a NATO country. Bulgaria is. Croatia is. Slovakia is. Slovenia is. Czech is. Poland is. Lithuania is. Latvia is. Estonia is. Romania is. Belarus is not. Ukraine is not. Russia is not. It is to America's advantage if Ukraine and Russia fight a war with each other.


Ukraine is our ally. We help them. Period.


I would love to know when...EVER the USA has helped Ukraine....




posted on Mar, 21 2017 @ 11:28 PM
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originally posted by: ParasuvO

originally posted by: reldra

originally posted by: allsee4eye
a reply to: reldra

Ukraine is not a NATO country. Bulgaria is. Croatia is. Slovakia is. Slovenia is. Czech is. Poland is. Lithuania is. Latvia is. Estonia is. Romania is. Belarus is not. Ukraine is not. Russia is not. It is to America's advantage if Ukraine and Russia fight a war with each other.


Ukraine is our ally. We help them. Period.


I would love to know when...EVER the USA has helped Ukraine....


Via sanctions against Russia. I see you are joining late...

And there were most probably other actions unknown within Crimea and Ukraine, I would guess. Stopping short of war, as Russia has engaged in as well.
edit on 21-3-2017 by reldra because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 21 2017 @ 11:29 PM
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a reply to: reldra

It helps to know the history of the situation that the left has been HAMMERING RUSSIA and now Pres Trump with since he was elected last November...

Overthrowing the elected govt of Ukraine in one of SOROS color revolution movement is very KEY to understanding the current situation...

Context is key....



posted on Mar, 21 2017 @ 11:32 PM
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originally posted by: reldra

originally posted by: CriticalStinker
a reply to: reldra

So there's no way that the citizens feeling the deterioration of Ukraine didn't want to fall under Russia's umbrella?


Most of them did not. Russia paid for a lot of propaganda saying they did. Russia is deteriorating swiftly. Some very near the border may have wanted it. but in general, they did not.


Again..proof?

I know people from GERMANY who travel there for work regularly...they laugh and scoff at ALL the liars on these topics.



posted on Mar, 21 2017 @ 11:36 PM
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a reply to: ParasuvO

What is it that I agree with exactly? Because I have many beliefs and opinions that cross party lines. I'm against political extremism in general, doesn't mean I go around labeling people whom I disagree with enemies though. That's for people full of hate and anger, neither of which I choose to get caught up in.



posted on Mar, 21 2017 @ 11:40 PM
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a reply to: allsee4eye

I think this is why trump took the deal for dropping the DNC counter intelligence on hillary.

He wasn't trading anything Americans care about at all...

Never know, not arming Ukraine Might even avert a war..

But as an American what trump likely did was treasonous...



posted on Mar, 21 2017 @ 11:45 PM
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originally posted by: JacKatMtn
a reply to: reldra

It helps to know the history of the situation that the left has been HAMMERING RUSSIA and now Pres Trump with since he was elected last November...

Overthrowing the elected govt of Ukraine in one of SOROS color revolution movement is very KEY to understanding the current situation...

Context is key....



Exactly..

And in the middle of trump getting hammered he :

fired 2 people once the press found out their Russian ties,

appointed a Turkish agent his military advisor

had multiple administration officials lie about shady Russian meetings

had his advisor promis to lower sanction on FBI tape

and changed the GOP platform to refuse military aid to Ukraine...

Right in the middle of rampant rumors of Russian collusion....

But I'm sure it is all just random coincidence..



posted on Mar, 21 2017 @ 11:47 PM
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originally posted by: JacKatMtn
a reply to: reldra

It helps to know the history of the situation that the left has been HAMMERING RUSSIA and now Pres Trump with since he was elected last November...

Overthrowing the elected govt of Ukraine in one of SOROS color revolution movement is very KEY to understanding the current situation...

Context is key....


I have been here. Reading it all.

I cannot say I know what Soros does on a day to day basis, neither can you.

I do know Russia IS our adversary. Problems with Russia started before Trump. They were messing around with our military. Obama tried really hard to 'reset' with them. To the point that he was caught on hot mic saying that. The American people really wanted a reset of relations. I had taken Russian in college, had always wanted to visit. But then Russia started messing up. Imprisoning journalists and Girl Bands of all things, besides buzzing US ships in the Black Sea and elsewhere. I think the military stuff was more important to the US government. But Russia became annoying in general.

Then, they crossed some lines and Obama kicked their ambassadors and staff. That takes a good reason, not 'I feel like kicking out Russian embassy type people today.'

Russia has crossed many lines and it appears they did so with (possibly dumb) Trump staffers and advisers and...at a lower percent chance, though still possible...Trump himself. If you hadn't noticed, Trump is not the sharpest knife in the drawer.

Yes, Russia is being HAMMERED. They need to be. They attempted (though it appears not successful physically) to meddle with the election.

Looking at 4 Chan and Facebook, one would come to the conclusion that they made great inroads there. Any idiot will believe a meme. They thought Trump to be most vulnerable to pressure and so they pushed Trump and heavily pushed against Clinton. Not because they thought Clinton would start a war, they are not that benevolent. They just believed she would be tougher on them.

And here we are. We have people on ATS wearing Pepe garb and people calling CNN fake news even if the news is straight from the AP wire and any nice social thing is seen as PC and bad.. Happy?


edit on 21-3-2017 by reldra because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 21 2017 @ 11:51 PM
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Indeed. The useful idiots on this board have been completely brainwashed by Putin's puppet Trump to believe that we should disregard Ukraine.

The funniest thing about the chicken hawks on this board is that 2 years ago, they would have agreed to back Ukraine. Now that Putin is in power of their minds, they somehow forgot that.



originally posted by: reldra
a reply to: allsee4eye
Ukraine is our ally. Crimea was taken by force. Of course we should be involved.

Why not, because Russia, our adversary doesn't like it? Then we might as well drop all help to our allies.

Don't even try to say 'Crimea wanted to go'. It didn't.



posted on Mar, 21 2017 @ 11:55 PM
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originally posted by: SeekingAlpha
Indeed. The useful idiots on this board have been completely brainwashed by Putin's puppet Trump to believe that we should disregard Ukraine.

The funniest thing about the chicken hawks on this board is that 2 years ago, they would have agreed to back Ukraine. Now that Putin is in power of their minds, they somehow forgot that.



originally posted by: reldra
a reply to: allsee4eye
Ukraine is our ally. Crimea was taken by force. Of course we should be involved.

Why not, because Russia, our adversary doesn't like it? Then we might as well drop all help to our allies.

Don't even try to say 'Crimea wanted to go'. It didn't.


That part I got. The Republicans would have backed Ukraine. Leave the rest, because I plan a thread on it. The ending is a little blurry, but I do remember Obama pushing to help. I just want to make a good thread, though one that is true and is sourced.



posted on Mar, 22 2017 @ 12:46 AM
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a reply to: 3daysgone

The USA and Russia most likely won't go to war with each other.
edit on 22-3-2017 by Maplestory777 because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 22 2017 @ 12:47 AM
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a reply to: crazyewok


Just a little war then? Maybe ask putin to play fair and not shoot back? LOL 


So what you saying?

Are you a fan of Neville Chamberlain?

I doubt it, I've read enough of your posts to assume that you feel he was a pussy?

Ya know? All that pandering to Hitler malarkey.

And no I'm not comparing Federal Russia to Nazi Germany but I do find it comical that we should do nothing because big scary Russia has nuclear weapons.

They might have backed down if we bolstered the Ukrainians a little more.

Now we have the Baltic states in uproar and fear, a "civil" war that see's no sign of conclusion and Westerners incapable of wanting an end to it all.

You know what?

I could write all day about this but at the end of the day only one thing stands true, that proverbial line on the ground so to speak... When enough is enough.

Chamberlain failed, what was once in someone else's back yard swiftly came to ours anyways. Right now we have a crisis in Europe and it isn't over yet.

Wtf did we even fight the Nazis for anyways?

Wait don't answer that because you'll come to the same conclusion I did... That we cannot let any potential adversary piss on the sovereignty of our friends, allies and family.

Russia is in the wrong, Russia is a bully.



posted on Mar, 22 2017 @ 02:19 AM
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originally posted by: RAY1990
a reply to: crazyewok


Just a little war then? Maybe ask putin to play fair and not shoot back? LOL 



Wtf did we even fight the Nazis for anyways?

Wait don't answer that because you'll come to the same conclusion I did... That we cannot let any potential adversary piss on the sovereignty of our friends, allies and family.

Russia is in the wrong, Russia is a bully.


You are correct. Russia is the bully. They might be comical, but they have more firepower than North Korea. Putin tries to leverage on that. But he will never pass a certain point. The point that starves his people.

People forget Russia is not an ally of the US. I certainly don't want a war, but the pro Russia stuff has got to stop. It's insane.



posted on Mar, 22 2017 @ 02:48 AM
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a reply to: reldra

I agree.

Many claim Putin plays chess while we all play checkers. Going by that theory it would be illogical that he would declare all out war due to let's say a bolstered presence in the Baltic states and logistical and hardware support to the Ukraine.

I've never gotten the "Putin is greater than sliced bread" approach some have. He does have his own ideas of Russia, it hasn't been exactly inclusive of all Russians. That being said I don't consider him a madman and I know he has done a lot for Russia.

I won't claim to know Putin but I can imagine he could be somewhat disappointed by how the West has handled Ukraine. Sanctions were not enough... Clearly.

Tough situations call for a tough resolve.



posted on Mar, 22 2017 @ 07:02 AM
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a reply to: ParasuvO

Russia's own Human Rights Council stated that only about 30% of Crimea's population voted in the referendum. Of those only about 50% voted in favor of the referendum.

Since then Putin has been trying to get anyone who voted against the referendum off the peninsula. Once Russia annexed Crimea they declared that everyone there was now a Russian citizen. If they did not want to be a Russian citizen they had two weeks to submit the proper paperwork. At which point if they wished to remain living in Crimea they had to have a permit of permanent residence. Among other ridiculous requirements to qualify for this permit a person had to submit a full psych evaluation.



posted on Mar, 22 2017 @ 07:45 AM
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a reply to: allsee4eye



The war in Ukraine was a coordinated effort on the part of rogue elements of certain alphabet agencies in the USA along with Soros and his fanatics and other deep state players that started with the coup. The USA is partially responsible for creating this mess. This is one piece of the puzzle in their plan of global destabilization through regional conflicts to attempt to achieve one world order. I hope Trump is able to extricate us from this situation and ultimately have good peaceful relations with Russia.



posted on Mar, 22 2017 @ 01:00 PM
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Yeah, Crimea = Russia. It has been historically, it is now and it will be forever more.

You lost. Deal with it.



posted on Mar, 22 2017 @ 01:51 PM
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originally posted by: reldra
a reply to: crazyewok
I disagree.



Typical libtard. You cant debate so you bolt hahaha



posted on Mar, 22 2017 @ 01:59 PM
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originally posted by: RAY1990

So what you saying?

I dont fancy Nuclear war because we ALL #ING DIE! NO ONE #ING WINS! Is that too difficult to comprehend?


originally posted by: RAY1990

Are you a fan of Neville Chamberlain?

Actually yes.

It is all well to critize him in hindsight but Chamberlain made the descion on what he had at the time. UK was not ready for war, nor war france and the USA was not intrested. He tried (rightfully) the diplomatic approach. Least in 1939 when was broke out the UK could say war truely was the last resort and it was a "just" war.


originally posted by: RAY1990
I doubt it, I've read enough of your posts to assume that you feel he was a pussy?

Ya know? All that pandering to Hitler malarkey.

Again nope. If the UK had started a war with Germany ealier it would have ended in a giant mess and riots across the streets of the UK.

originally posted by: RAY1990
And no I'm not comparing Federal Russia to Nazi Germany but I do find it comical that we should do nothing because big scary Russia has nuclear weapons.

Because Nuclear weapons are #ing scary!

I dont know about you but I dont own a nuclear bunker.

I have a life to live and I dont fancy being vaporised or living in a post nuclear apocalypse.


That is the diffrence between 1939 and now. A war no means NO ONE WINS. There would be no victors. So what is the point in fighting a war that no one can win?



posted on Mar, 22 2017 @ 02:02 PM
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a reply to: RAY1990


Not wanting to start World war Holy # we all die is not the same as liking or supporting Putin. It callled not being sucidal.

I dont like Putin and think he is a giant dick.

I just prefer living and breathing.
edit on 22-3-2017 by crazyewok because: (no reason given)



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