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Breaking: Trump forced to apologize for UK wiretap comments.

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posted on Mar, 17 2017 @ 04:29 PM
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a reply to: grainofsand

Boy I'd hate to be your spouse if this is your regular argument style. No words no matter how plainly spoken mean exactly what they say. That's two separate statements you've attached this theory to.

And the spinning ...my dear you're a regular dradle.




posted on Mar, 17 2017 @ 04:29 PM
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originally posted by: carewemust
Trump forced to apologize? Sounds like this thread has a fake title.


Lot's of fakery today. Nice to have it all debunked on the same day though.



posted on Mar, 17 2017 @ 04:31 PM
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a reply to: Sillyolme

They did spy and they were asked to.




posted on Mar, 17 2017 @ 04:33 PM
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originally posted by: Gryphon66

originally posted by: UKTruth

originally posted by: Stormdancer777

originally posted by: UKTruth

originally posted by: Stormdancer777
handshakegate

nypost.com...

ewwww he looks pi$$ed


Oh, doesn't look like much, some reporter wanted a picture of a handshake. I am not sure either of them actually heard it.
Give CNN a few minutes though and the US and Germany will be on the brink of war. After they got caught on the fake apologygate, they'll need a new crisis.


Yup and Trump knows it.

He really can't stand the press.


It's been a bad day for CNN.. Hannitygate and Apologygate, both highlighted as fake news. Maybe they will take a deep breath and settle down till tomorrow. Three humiliations in one day might be too much even for them. At least Rachel Maddow will be breathing a sigh of relief that some focus has been taken off her humiliation.


Yes, I'm sure CNN is reading your assessment here and quaking ... LOL.

Seriously though ... I've been following this all day as well. To my knowledge, the same article has been under discussion from CNN (that has been updated to reflect Spicer's direct quote).

I don't believe the essential wording has changed substantially throughout the day:



Earlier in the day, however, a senior administration official told CNN that Spicer and national security adviser H.R. McMaster offered what amounted to an apology to the British government for Spicer's comments on Thursday, when he cited a Fox News report that said British intelligence helped wiretap Trump Tower during the 2016 campaign.


CNN

The phrase "what amounted to an apology" has been consistently used (at least in my recollection.)

Now, however, we know that, unless Mr. Spicer is off on his own, Mr. Trump has directed that the official line is now "no apology, we were only passing along news."

Which is fine, when the President of the United States "passes along news" that has no basis, no evidence, and has been officially denied by the parties concerned ... AND the party concerned happens to be our oldest and closest ally in the world ... what does that say about this Administration?

I guess Trump summed it all up this afternoon "Go ask Fox News." Apparently, Fox is now the official mouthpiece of the White House.



I would have SOME sympathy with the 'amounted to an apology' position if CNN did not also headline at one point today with "I am Sorry" as a headline.
There were several outlets, the Financial Times, for example, who just told the story as it was with the facts only. That is the Whitehouse promised not to repeat Nepolitano's claims.



posted on Mar, 17 2017 @ 04:34 PM
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a reply to: grainofsand

No once again it calls the claim utter nonsense. That's pretty definitive.

Play with your words all you want.
The rest of us will sick with what they did say. Not what they didn't say.
But ill give you this. You're tenacious. Like a pit bull.



posted on Mar, 17 2017 @ 04:40 PM
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a reply to: UKTruth

That's not what I said and you know it. Plus, I have less concern over seeing the repetitive "fake news" tossed about than you apparently understand.

What we know is that there were conversations among many levels of the US and UK Administrations as the day has progressed.

What we know is that the official statements from the UK have called such claims as were made by Fox and REPEATED VERBATIM by the White House RIDICULOUS.

You're intricately focusing on the word "apology" as you always do in these scenarios ... you don't think there was (what qualifies in your rhetoric as) an apology (or actually as was reported "what amounted to an apology") so there wasn't one.

By your own definitions here, however ... the Trump White House made an internationally-sensitive declaration that Fake News was true.

Which is worse, overall, do you think?
edit on 17-3-2017 by Gryphon66 because: Spelling



posted on Mar, 17 2017 @ 04:43 PM
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a reply to: UKTruth

Well, then it's obvious that we're down to personal opinion on the matter.

You see what CNN did today as the ever-present "fake news."

I see what happened as going with sources and watching the story change and evolve as the day went on.

I don't disagree that their headline was mistaken and misleading IF someone didn't read the article in full ... but ... clickbait exists, and the news is a business.



posted on Mar, 17 2017 @ 04:48 PM
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originally posted by: introvert
Perhaps I missed it, but can anyone link to the "formal apology"?


No. Nobody can because there wasn't one. Just more fake stories from "journalists".



posted on Mar, 17 2017 @ 04:48 PM
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originally posted by: Sillyolme
a reply to: grainofsand

Boy I'd hate to be your spouse if this is your regular argument style. No words no matter how plainly spoken mean exactly what they say. That's two separate statements you've attached this theory to.

And the spinning ...my dear you're a regular dradle.


Yep, GCHQ have stated they were not asked to spy on Trump.
They have not stated they did not spy on him with US approval.
Massive difference.



posted on Mar, 17 2017 @ 04:52 PM
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originally posted by: Gryphon66
a reply to: UKTruth

That's not what I said and you know it. Plus, I have less concern over seeing the repetitive "fake news" tossed about than you apparently understand.

What we know is that there were conversations among many levels of the US and UK Administrations as the day has progressed.

What we know is that the official statements from the UK have called such claims as were made by Fox and REPEATED VERBATIM by the White House RIDICULOUS.

You're intricately focusing on the word "apology" as you always do in these scenarios ... you don't think there was an apology (or actually as was reported "what amounted to an apology") so there wasn't one.

By your own definitions here, however ... the Trump White House made an internationally-sensitive declaration that Fake News was true.

Which is worse, overall, do you think?


There is more than one argument there. I will try and unpick it as I see it and you can let me know if I answered.

There never was any evidence for an apology (it's not about what I think), and the word apology was in fact pushed by the media in an attempt to belittle the Trump administration - I even saw one newspaper call it a 'grovelling apology'. Neither party; The Whitehouse or the UK Govt mentioned an apology. Now the Whitehouse has made it's only statement, and said they did not apologise. There is also no official apology to even look at from earlier in the day.

There were conversations clearly, as we have the outcome of those conversations quoted by Theresa May's spokesman (name quoted earlier). He said that McMaster had "given assurances" that the US would not repeat Nepolitano's allegations. That is the story in relation to the calls earlier.

As for the statement from GCHQ on Neoplitano's claims, I am in agreement that they were definitive and made clear that they deny the allegations completely.

I don't think that Spicer claimed all the articles he cited were true (I would have to check back). He read them all and did indicate he thought they showed evidence of something going on. Probably unwise. Will he do it again - I doubt it.


edit on 17/3/2017 by UKTruth because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 17 2017 @ 04:54 PM
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originally posted by: grainofsand

originally posted by: Sillyolme
a reply to: grainofsand

Boy I'd hate to be your spouse if this is your regular argument style. No words no matter how plainly spoken mean exactly what they say. That's two separate statements you've attached this theory to.

And the spinning ...my dear you're a regular dradle.


Yep, GCHQ have stated they were not asked to spy on Trump.
They have not stated they did not spy on him with US approval.
Massive difference.


It's likely they already were and were just asked to hand over the material. A better question to them would be have you given any information gathered by surveillance operations on US citizens to any US administrative member in the last year, including but not limited to Trump.



posted on Mar, 17 2017 @ 04:54 PM
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a reply to: grainofsand

But if the original claim from Fox is that GCHQ was asked by Obama then it all falls flat with the denial.

Not that I believe them.

You and Krazy were arguing two different things I think.



posted on Mar, 17 2017 @ 04:56 PM
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originally posted by: grainofsand
a reply to: joshysway

Meh, It still wouldn't surprise me if the UK did actually do it. Before Trump got elected the whole British establishment was snagging him off, their contemp was clear.
Now he's leader of the most powerful nation in the world they predictably suck up to him.
GCHQ would never admit it would they lol


No, the British Establishment, like most of Britain, still think he's a dick.

Last we heard, Trump's state visit will happen when Parliament is in recess and will be low key. Hardly sucking up. More like polite sidetracking.

Theresa May made a big show of cosying up to him in public because she has fewer international friends than he has. She needs all the help she can get. But she thinks he's a dick.



posted on Mar, 17 2017 @ 04:56 PM
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originally posted by: grainofsand

originally posted by: Sillyolme
a reply to: grainofsand

Boy I'd hate to be your spouse if this is your regular argument style. No words no matter how plainly spoken mean exactly what they say. That's two separate statements you've attached this theory to.

And the spinning ...my dear you're a regular dradle.


Yep, GCHQ have stated they were not asked to spy on Trump.
They have not stated they did not spy on him with US approval.
Massive difference.


Napolitano's claim, repeated verbatim by the White House, was that Obama had asked GCHQ to accomplish the "wiretapping."

So the response of GCHQ makes perfect sense. You're demanding that they should have responded to what's in your own head in the matter ... which is ... to quote the UK "rubbish."


edit on 17-3-2017 by Gryphon66 because: Noted



posted on Mar, 17 2017 @ 04:57 PM
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originally posted by: Hazardous1408
a reply to: grainofsand

But if the original claim from Fox is that GCHQ was asked by Obama then it all falls flat with the denial.

Not that I believe them.

You and Krazy were arguing two different things I think.


Just saw your post after I pointed out the same thing basically.

Great minds or some such rot ... LOL



posted on Mar, 17 2017 @ 05:01 PM
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Lots of inference and supposition but no evidence, the same kind of intellectual gymnastics that we saw when Bush and Blair were looking for WMDs in Iraq.

Verb sap to our American friends: GCHQ, like the rest of British intelligence and like the Queen, don't equivocate. If they want to fudge. they simply do not comment. They let the speculation burn itself out. They certainly don't take to Twitter or let a spokesman improvise in front of the world's media.

If GCHQ says they did it, or didn't do it, take it at face value.

Like Iraqi WMDs, this is a potentially huge story that isn't happening. The snowflakes will, of course, make whatever semantic and cognitive adjustments are need to protect their fragile world view, but it just ain't happening.



edit on 17-3-2017 by Whodathunkdatcheese because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 17 2017 @ 05:05 PM
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originally posted by: Whodathunkdatcheese

originally posted by: grainofsand
a reply to: joshysway

Meh, It still wouldn't surprise me if the UK did actually do it. Before Trump got elected the whole British establishment was snagging him off, their contemp was clear.
Now he's leader of the most powerful nation in the world they predictably suck up to him.
GCHQ would never admit it would they lol


No, the British Establishment, like most of Britain, still think he's a dick.

Last we heard, Trump's state visit will happen when Parliament is in recess and will be low key. Hardly sucking up. More like polite sidetracking.

Theresa May made a big show of cosying up to him in public because she has fewer international friends than he has. She needs all the help she can get. But she thinks he's a dick.



More Brits are for the Trump state visit than against according to yougov polling.
49% vs 36%.
www.express.co.uk...



posted on Mar, 17 2017 @ 05:05 PM
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a reply to: Sillyolme

Yes, GCHQ have confirmed that they were not asked by US intelligence to spy on Trump.
That was all the official diplomatic statement asserted.
Please do quote another official statement asserting otherwise.
No "unnamed" sources of course lol



posted on Mar, 17 2017 @ 05:05 PM
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a reply to: Whodathunkdatcheese


If GCHQ says they did it, or didn't do it, take it at face value.


Not even if you paid me.



posted on Mar, 17 2017 @ 05:06 PM
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Nepolitano is going to talk about this again tonight on Fox. Very interesting to see if he back tracks or doubles down...



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