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Donald Trump has just directly accused Obama of wiretapping Trump residence.

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posted on Mar, 6 2017 @ 01:43 PM
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originally posted by: Sillyolme
a reply to: neo96

Yes i mean that man. The one Flynn told not to worry about sanctions placed by Obama as punishment for meddling in our elections because the next president would remove them. Yup that's the guy I meant alright.


More horse dung.





posted on Mar, 6 2017 @ 01:44 PM
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originally posted by: UKTruth

originally posted by: Indigo5

originally posted by: Xcathdra
a reply to: RomeByFire

Still waiting on the Russia - Trump evidence Democrats keep claiming exists all the while Tapper says there are none.


Give a couple months..Not that liberals will like a President Pence much, but that's the plan. It's why Pence has been hiding as much as possible to distance himself from Orange Menace.

In the CIA-NSA-FBI Trifecta investigation, Comey was the hold out and blocking public disclosure...But with Trump publicly calling Comey a liar this weekend, I imagine the investigation will pick up speed.


Hiding, lol.
Funny that, he was just recently on the Michael Savage show lauding your President...



A call-in show with Michael who? Yes...Pence is hiding...



posted on Mar, 6 2017 @ 01:44 PM
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originally posted by: butcherguy
a reply to: Olivine

The FISA court requires the President to request the warrant, through the Attorney General.


This is complete bollocks.

The FISA court was brought about in 1978 to expressly deny the president the ability to authorize secret spying on Americans they deemed foreign agents. link
Secondly, The majority of FISA requests are from the NSA, which the AG has zero authority over.



posted on Mar, 6 2017 @ 01:45 PM
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a reply to: mOjOm
I guess you missed the Snowden revelations?
FISA let the do exactly that.
There have also been lists in this thread of US citizens that have been tapped and hacked by the government, including journalists.
They do it.... all legal.



posted on Mar, 6 2017 @ 01:45 PM
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originally posted by: knowledgehunter0986
So...

Can somebody sum up these 170 pages for me?


Just a big Democrat endless loop of zilch.




posted on Mar, 6 2017 @ 01:46 PM
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a reply to: Xcathdra

Oh, my gosh, this thread just grow 20 pages since this morning!!!!!!!!!!

Amazing.

Yes, Xcathdra, nothing to show for, nothing, but darn they don't want to hear about wiretapping Americans under the Obama former administration for political gains, manipulation and political favors.

Comey is in hot waters and they all know that

Is going to be investigations.



posted on Mar, 6 2017 @ 01:47 PM
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a reply to: butcherguy

Well, then that makes Trump chances in some way slightly better I guess.

Now he just has to prove it and it's all good for him.

Until he can however, he's really put himself in a tough spot by making accusations of alleged Facts that he has yet to prove.



posted on Mar, 6 2017 @ 01:48 PM
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a reply to: butcherguy

Yes people hail for Snowden and now people seem to have forgotten his warnings.

What that tells you.

To put the cherry on the top all the 6 spying agencies need to do is just said that they do not spied on Americans and that will be the end of any investigation, a government beside the president, unless Trump now have the power to declassified information but that will put the agencies in the spot light



posted on Mar, 6 2017 @ 01:48 PM
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a reply to: Xcathdra




At what point to we move from investigation to fishing expedition?


It's been a fishing expedition from day one.

Or entrapment.



posted on Mar, 6 2017 @ 01:49 PM
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"In other news China continues it's military buildup and NK fires missiles at Japan....."

I just cannot believe so many of you who hate Trump are ok with wiretapping private citizens but freak out about a travel ban....




posted on Mar, 6 2017 @ 01:49 PM
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a reply to: Indigo5

Thank you for the back up, Indigo.

I am floored at the...how to I graciously word this....misinformation being spouted.



posted on Mar, 6 2017 @ 01:50 PM
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a reply to: Grambler

Depends on how u define "IS".



posted on Mar, 6 2017 @ 01:50 PM
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a reply to: marg6043




Oh, my gosh, this thread just grow 20 pages since this morning!!!!!!!!!!


172 pages of a frenzied attempt to shut down a tweet.




Is going to be investigations.


They lost.



posted on Mar, 6 2017 @ 01:51 PM
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originally posted by: matafuchs


I just cannot believe so many of you who hate Trump are ok with wiretapping private citizens but freak out about a travel ban....



They're okay with it...as long as Obama maintains plausible deniability.



posted on Mar, 6 2017 @ 01:52 PM
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originally posted by: Grambler

originally posted by: Gryphon66
a reply to: Xcathdra

Wrong again.

The Americans who were surveiled were involved in criminal investigations.




His statement was not wrong. He said american journalists were surveilled, rather or not it was a criminal investigation is irrelevant.

So when Obamas spokesman said this to prove they didn't surveill trump; "As part of that practice, neither President Obama nor any White House official ever ordered surveillance on any U.S. citizen. Any suggestion otherwise is simply false."

We know he is lying because the surveilled journalists like James Rosen. Notice his claim doesn't mention criminal investigations, it says they never did it period.


An interesting coincidence about Rosen is his ties to a very similar scenario that he authored a book on: Watergate..




In 2008, Rosen's book, The Strong Man: John Mitchell and the Secrets of Watergate was published by Doubleday; it was a biography of Richard Nixon's Attorney General John N. Mitchell, and his involvement in the Watergate scandal. Rosen had spent 17 years researching and writing The Strong Man; the project was initially based on a grant Rosen had received from William F. Buckley Jr., soon after graduating from journalism school, to write the book.
Rosen edited A Torch Kept Lit: Great Lives of the Twentieth Century published in 2016 from the writings of William Buckley. The book includes Rose's introducion and prefaces for each of 52 eulogies or obituaries that follow. His son Christopher Buckley has suggested that the volume, published eight years after Buckley's death, might be the greatest of his 60 some books.


And even more interesting is Andrew Napolitano's quote regarding his investigation:




On May 17, 2013, the Washington Post reported the United States Department of Justice had monitored Rosen's activities by tracking his visits to the State Department, through phone traces, timing of calls and his personal emails.
To obtain the warrants, the Justice Department labeled Rosen a "criminal co-conspirator" with Stephen Jin-Woo Kim.Attorney General Eric Holder personally signed off on the search warrant of Rosen, who was labeled a "flight-risk" to keep from being informed of the ongoing surveillance. The Justice Department's "aggressive investigative methods" have caused various analysts to express concern their "investigative methods of classified leaks by government officials are having a chilling effect on news organizations' ability to play a watchdog role". Fox News contributor, Judge Andrew Napolitano, commented: "This is the first time that the federal government has moved to this level of taking ordinary, reasonable, traditional, lawful reporter skills and claiming they constitute criminal behavior."



Very coincidental to me



posted on Mar, 6 2017 @ 01:52 PM
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originally posted by: Olivine
a reply to: Indigo5

Thank you for the back up, Indigo.

I am floored at the...how to I graciously word this....misinformation being spouted.




originally posted by: Indigo5

originally posted by: butcherguy
a reply to: Indigo5

The actual law has been cited numerous times in this thread.
You are wrong.


Where does it say a President HAS TO sign off on a FISA Warrant? Like you claimed.

50 U.S. Code § 1804 - Applications for court orders

(a) Submission by Federal officer; approval of Attorney General; contentsEach application for an order approving electronic surveillance under this subchapter shall be made by a Federal officer in writing upon oath or affirmation to a judge having jurisdiction under section 1803 of this title. Each application shall require the approval of the Attorney General based upon his finding that it satisfies the criteria and requirements of such application as set forth in this subchapter. It shall include—
(1) the identity of the Federal officer making the application;
(2) the identity, if known, or a description of the specific target of the electronic surveillance;
(3) a statement of the facts and circumstances relied upon by the applicant to justify his belief that—
(A) the target of the electronic surveillance is a foreign power or an agent of a foreign power; and
(B) each of the facilities or places at which the electronic surveillance is directed is being used, or is about to be used, by a foreign power or an agent of a foreign power;
(4) a statement of the proposed minimization procedures;
(5) a description of the nature of the information sought and the type of communications or activities to be subjected to the surveillance;
(6) a certification or certifications by the Assistant to the President for National Security Affairs, an executive branch official or officials designated by the President from among those executive officers employed in the area of national security or defense and appointed by the President with the advice and consent of the Senate, or the Deputy Director of the Federal Bureau of Investigation, if designated by the President as a certifying official—




originally posted by: Indigo5
Where does it say a FISA warrant can target American Citizens?

50 U.S. Code § 1805 - Issuance of order

FISA warrants are valid for 90 days or the length established by a judge, whichever is less
edit on 6-3-2017 by Xcathdra because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 6 2017 @ 01:54 PM
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originally posted by: Olivine

originally posted by: butcherguy
a reply to: Olivine

The FISA court requires the President to request the warrant, through the Attorney General.


This is complete bollocks.

The FISA court was brought about in 1978 to expressly deny the president the ability to authorize secret spying on Americans they deemed foreign agents. link
Secondly, The majority of FISA requests are from the NSA, which the AG has zero authority over.

I went to your link.
I did not see the law there.
It has been posted in this thread though.
Here is a snippet:

Notwithstanding any other law, the President, through the Attorney General, may authorize electronic surveillance without a court order under this title to acquire foreign intelligence information for periods of up to one year if the Attorney General certifies in writing under oath that—
(A) the electronic surveillance is solely directed at—
(i) the acquisition of the contents of communications transmitted by means of communications used exclusively between or among foreign powers, as defined in section 101(a)(1), (2), or (3); or
(ii) the acquisition of technical intelligence, other than the spoken communications of individuals, from property or premises under the open and exclusive control of a foreign power, as defined in section 101(a)(1), (2), or (3);
(B) there is no substantial likelihood that the surveillance will acquire the contents of any communication to which a United States person is a party;


wikisource



posted on Mar, 6 2017 @ 01:55 PM
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originally posted by: mOjOm
a reply to: Grambler

Ok, well if they did something illegal then.

Not sure how the court issuing a Warrant would be illegal, but if that can be proven to be true fine.

If they did anything illegal then charge them for it and prove it.

But if it was legal and Trump can't prove his claim then he's lying.

One or the other of those outcomes will be the conclusion to this. That's what I'm waiting for. I don't care which one it is as long as it's over with.


I am with you.

But I think this goes beyond a question of legality.

The FISA courts had only rejected 12 out of 33,000 warrant requests. This means they were effectively a rubber stamp.

So even if they did give legal access to a wiretap based off of a belief Trump was in cahoots with Russians, this raises a lot of ethical questions.

For example, there was pretty good evidence that Hillary was in cahoots with the Saudias while she knew they were giving weapins to Isis. Should her political opponents been allowed to get a Fisa warrant to surveill her.

In fact, do to the fact thaat the Fisa courts rubberstamp almost any application, all it would take would be for a sitting political power to claim they had reason to believe that their opponent was working with (insert bad actor) and they could the legally be spied on.

Say Elizbeth Warren runs against Trump in 2020. Would you be ok with Trump getting a Fisa warrant to tap her because she haad met with people in Hamas or the Muslim Brotherhood, and the leaking what they found to the press? Of course not. This would be the nail in the coffin of our elections as we know it.

But that is what people are defending here; the potential that Obama or someone in his admin surveilled a political opponent, then passed an EO saying they could share the info will all agencies, then leaked info to the press.

If this is true, the legality of it is a seperate matter, but it ethically should be shouted down.



posted on Mar, 6 2017 @ 01:56 PM
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originally posted by: neo96
a reply to: marg6043




Oh, my gosh, this thread just grow 20 pages since this morning!!!!!!!!!!


172 pages of a frenzied attempt to shut down a tweet.




Is going to be investigations.


They lost.



I think the RNC and the Republicans in general owe you an immense debt of gratitude for your contribution....

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by abstaining from Politics.
edit on 6-3-2017 by alphabetaone because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 6 2017 @ 01:58 PM
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a reply to: mOjOm




But if there was a FISA warrant then Obama or his Admin still did nothing illegal.

Other than use the us ic against a political opponent during a potus campaign...............




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