It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.

Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.

Thank you.

 

Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.

 

What Color Is Your Robe?

page: 2
2
<< 1   >>

log in

join
share:

posted on Feb, 26 2017 @ 08:59 PM
link   
In the Bible, the Robe is always symbolism for the body. In Buddhism, it's the Buddha Body. In both instances, the new body we receive is always parallel to our compassion and love for others. In the Bible, the White robe is given to the Saints after Christ wears it. His robe is woven from the suffering of the saints, which is symbolic of sin as wool of a lamb in the wilderness. In essence, it's simulation of a bio-mechanical suit worn by the true non-corporal essence. Hebrews 9 gives it away:

Hebrews 9

23 It was necessary, then, for the copies of the heavenly things to be purified with these sacrifices, but the heavenly things themselves with better sacrifices than these. 24 For Christ did not enter a sanctuary made with human hands that was only a copy of the true one; he entered heaven itself, now to appear for us in God’s presence.




posted on Feb, 26 2017 @ 09:22 PM
link   
a reply to: 3NL1GHT3N3D1

If that's the case, then the interpretation is in the eye of the beholder. Like Alt-facts. May we objectively seek the subjective truth.
edit on 26-2-2017 by BELIEVERpriest because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 26 2017 @ 11:34 PM
link   
a reply to: newnature1


1 John 1:9 - “sins” is a Double Metonymy, a figure of speech that replaces the name of a thing with the name of something else with which it is closely associated. A Figure of speech relates to the form in which the words are used. It consists in the fact that a word or words are used out of their ordinary sense, or place, or manner, for the purpose of attracting our attention to what is thus said. A Figure of speech is a designed and legitimate departure from the laws of language, in order to emphasize what is said.


There is no reason to assume that confession of sin is any form of metonymy. John's first epistle was addressed to believers in Christ, so there would be no reason to attempt conversion of those who've already believed. That fact alone rules out the possibility that John used confession of sin as a figure of speech.

The fact is, that all believers in the Church Age are royal priests in Christ (Rev 1:6). We each represent ourselves individually before God as priests, and it is part of our priestly function to confess our known sins to God on a regular basis. If we neglect this function, or simply refuse to acknowledge it, then we are trying to have a dishonest relationship with God.

A believer who will not consistently confess his/her sins to God is not filled with the Holy Spirit, is not abiding in Christ, is causing damage to their own soul, and as a result, staining their robes. If this degeneration continues, then end will be sin unto death.



posted on Feb, 26 2017 @ 11:46 PM
link   
a reply to: Raggedyman



I would disagree respectfully
Blaspheming the Spirit in knowing the works of God and denying they are from God


Blaspheming the Spirit can also be falsely claiming that one is filled with the Spirit, when one is actually in a state of carnality. So it is very easy for any believer to blaspheme the Holy Spirit on a daily basis, if they don't use 1John 1:9.

If we say that our works are done in the Spirit, when we are really in a state of carnality, then it is blasphemy against the Spirit. Since we are all still sinners, we all still have to confess our sins. If we stop confessing our sins they will not be forgiven in this age or the next, as we are blaspheming the Spirit by defiling His dwelling with our sins. The debt of our sins are forgiven and paid for by Christ, but we are still accountable for keeping an honest relationship with God.



1John 1:
5And this is the message we have heard from Him and announce to you, that God is light, and in Him there is no darkness at all. 6If we say that we have fellowship with Him and yet walk in the darkness, we lie and do not practice the truth; 7but if we walk in the light as He Himself is in the light, we have fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus His Son cleanses us from all sin. 8If we say that we have no sin, we are deceiving ourselves, and the truth is not in us. 9If we confess our sins, He is faithful and righteous to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. 10If we say that we have not sinned, we make Him a liar, and His word is not in us.


Those believers who refuse to use 1John 1:9 will have stains on the robes of their souls, and will spend the duration of the Millennial kingdom in the darkness outside. This is only fitting, because their degenerated souls will not be fit to rule under Christ.
edit on 26-2-2017 by BELIEVERpriest because: added scriptural citation



posted on Feb, 27 2017 @ 09:02 AM
link   

originally posted by: Raggedyman

originally posted by: newnature1

originally posted by: Raggedyman

originally posted by: BELIEVERpriest
a reply to: Raggedyman


Try to see salvation as threefold.

Salvation of the spirit is initial faith in Christ. It is irrevocable.

Salvation of the soul is the daily washing of the robes with the water of the Word, and the Blood of Christ. It is a restoration of the soul's mentality. Consistent use of 1John1:9 + daily learning and living on Bible is required for this.

Salvation of the Body is the resurrection.


Irrevocable, meaning that you can't lose it
I think we can rule that out

There is only one unforgivable sin, blaspheming the Spirit, to blaspheme the Spirit you must know the Spirit.

Thanks newnatur, I am confused by the black robe and why we Christians are wearing it, we through Christ are already as white as snow spiritually, clothed in Christ Gal 3.27

I didn't even consider in the flesh and backsliding, just hit a nerve after listening to a minister recently saying we as Christians are wicked. The devil is wicked, Spiritually through Jesus we are not, in flesh we are. What counts, how Jesus sees us.

It's almost like saying a person is evil and has no value, let's set the bar as low as possible when to the opposite in scripture we see Jesus set the bar so high that Christians have to strive to achieve the goal of love


Is Paul telling us in Romans 6:14 that as believers, we’ll never again have the propensity to sin, or sin shall not have dominion over you because now you are capable of beating it? Is Paul telling you that you are now capable of never committing another sin as long as you live because sin shall not have dominion over you? Is Paul saying it is possible for a believer to live a sinless life? All believers, we’re all alike in this respect, we all continue to struggle with that issue of sins in our lives. Not only do we continue to have the propensity to sin, we do in fact do those things that come short of the glory of God far more often than any of us would like. Sin shall not have dominion over us because we’re not living under the law program, we’re living under grace. The victory has already been won and who won it? Jesus won it. Sin shall not have dominion over us because believers are not under the law, but under grace.


I hope you are not thinking I am saying Christians don't sin, that's not what I am saying.
What I am saying, spiritually in Christ we are free of the stains of sin, sinless


The law pointed to sin and then required death for the sinner. Can the law now stake a further claim against the one who has already satisfied that claim? Will the law ever again have a future claim where Jesus is concerned? Or did Jesus satisfy that claim once and for all. Of course he did! And you are joined to him; being joined to him meaning: fully identified with his satisfying the law’s claim. It only stands to reason that once a person is joined to the one who has satisfied the law’s requirement for sins, and is now standing only in the Savior’s perfect righteousness, that believer’s sinfulness can never be used as proof of that believer’s lack of righteousness. Paul moves us away from the realm of condition and he takes us straight into the realm of identity. The law can make no demand on the world of the lawlessness because Jesus met the law’s demands for the world of sinners for which he died. Today, the law can only serve the purpose of proving people’s need for a righteousness that no person is capable of gaining through performance.



posted on Feb, 27 2017 @ 09:06 AM
link   

originally posted by: 3NL1GHT3N3D1
a reply to: newnature1

I don't know what Paul meant in that particular verse but I do know what John meant in this one:


1 John 2
5 But if anyone obeys his word, love for God is truly made complete in them. This is how we know we are in him: 6 Whoever claims to live in him must live as Jesus did.


How did Jesus live? Without sin. Why would John tell us to live a sinless life if it is impossible to do? He says that the way we know we are "in him" is by living as he did which was sinless.


1 John 3
9 No one who is born of God will continue to sin, because God's seed remains in them; they cannot go on sinning, because they have been born of God.


He goes on to double down on this in the very next chapter by saying that those who are "born again" cannot go on sinning because God's seed is in them.

How can Christianity claim to be "of God" when it teaches people that sin is unavoidable seeing as how John tells us otherwise? The doctrine of the church seems to contradict the words of John (and possibly Paul as well).


What does Paul mean by the phrase “in the flesh” in Romans 7:5? What first comes to your mind when you think of someone being in the flesh? Now our minds are tied to that concept of rule-keeping for righteousness, we grew up with it. Most think of a person who is living in sin. I would venture to guess that most people would picture a Christian here who has slipped back into a worldly lifestyle thus, that backslidden church-goer would be considered to be “in the flesh.” Is that the picture that came across your mind? That’s the view most people have in their minds of the expression “in the flesh.” It’s sinning! But, that isn’t the case at all here. That’s not what Paul has in mind. You are not in the flesh if you are a saved person. You need to understand that as you read through Chapter 7 and Chapter 8 of Romans, “to be in the flesh” means to be in a law-husband relationship; to be in a conditional performance relationship. You’re in a new creation relationship with God. You’re alive because of your identity, not at all because of your practice. You’re in an alive-identity with the Savior because God has deposited his power from on high inside you and because you’ve trusted solely in what Jesus accomplished for you, not on what you could accomplish for the Savior, but you cannot be in a relationship with both at the same time. God no longer views you in a fleshly capacity. He no longer views you in your human flesh. He views you in your glorified identity. He sees you as being joined to his son which is why Paul could say, “Therefore, if any person is in the Savior, they are a new creature; old things are passed away, behold all things are become new.” (2 Corinthians 5:17) It’s new identity.



posted on Feb, 27 2017 @ 09:49 AM
link   

originally posted by: newnature1

originally posted by: Raggedyman

originally posted by: newnature1

originally posted by: Raggedyman

originally posted by: BELIEVERpriest
a reply to: Raggedyman


Try to see salvation as threefold.

Salvation of the spirit is initial faith in Christ. It is irrevocable.

Salvation of the soul is the daily washing of the robes with the water of the Word, and the Blood of Christ. It is a restoration of the soul's mentality. Consistent use of 1John1:9 + daily learning and living on Bible is required for this.

Salvation of the Body is the resurrection.


Irrevocable, meaning that you can't lose it
I think we can rule that out

There is only one unforgivable sin, blaspheming the Spirit, to blaspheme the Spirit you must know the Spirit.

Thanks newnatur, I am confused by the black robe and why we Christians are wearing it, we through Christ are already as white as snow spiritually, clothed in Christ Gal 3.27

I didn't even consider in the flesh and backsliding, just hit a nerve after listening to a minister recently saying we as Christians are wicked. The devil is wicked, Spiritually through Jesus we are not, in flesh we are. What counts, how Jesus sees us.

It's almost like saying a person is evil and has no value, let's set the bar as low as possible when to the opposite in scripture we see Jesus set the bar so high that Christians have to strive to achieve the goal of love


Is Paul telling us in Romans 6:14 that as believers, we’ll never again have the propensity to sin, or sin shall not have dominion over you because now you are capable of beating it? Is Paul telling you that you are now capable of never committing another sin as long as you live because sin shall not have dominion over you? Is Paul saying it is possible for a believer to live a sinless life? All believers, we’re all alike in this respect, we all continue to struggle with that issue of sins in our lives. Not only do we continue to have the propensity to sin, we do in fact do those things that come short of the glory of God far more often than any of us would like. Sin shall not have dominion over us because we’re not living under the law program, we’re living under grace. The victory has already been won and who won it? Jesus won it. Sin shall not have dominion over us because believers are not under the law, but under grace.


I hope you are not thinking I am saying Christians don't sin, that's not what I am saying.
What I am saying, spiritually in Christ we are free of the stains of sin, sinless


The law pointed to sin and then required death for the sinner. Can the law now stake a further claim against the one who has already satisfied that claim? Will the law ever again have a future claim where Jesus is concerned? Or did Jesus satisfy that claim once and for all. Of course he did! And you are joined to him; being joined to him meaning: fully identified with his satisfying the law’s claim. It only stands to reason that once a person is joined to the one who has satisfied the law’s requirement for sins, and is now standing only in the Savior’s perfect righteousness, that believer’s sinfulness can never be used as proof of that believer’s lack of righteousness. Paul moves us away from the realm of condition and he takes us straight into the realm of identity. The law can make no demand on the world of the lawlessness because Jesus met the law’s demands for the world of sinners for which he died. Today, the law can only serve the purpose of proving people’s need for a righteousness that no person is capable of gaining through performance.


Except those in Jesus
Done deal



posted on Feb, 27 2017 @ 01:55 PM
link   

originally posted by: BELIEVERpriest
a reply to: newnature1


1 John 1:9 - “sins” is a Double Metonymy, a figure of speech that replaces the name of a thing with the name of something else with which it is closely associated. A Figure of speech relates to the form in which the words are used. It consists in the fact that a word or words are used out of their ordinary sense, or place, or manner, for the purpose of attracting our attention to what is thus said. A Figure of speech is a designed and legitimate departure from the laws of language, in order to emphasize what is said.


There is no reason to assume that confession of sin is any form of metonymy. John's first epistle was addressed to believers in Christ, so there would be no reason to attempt conversion of those who've already believed. That fact alone rules out the possibility that John used confession of sin as a figure of speech.

The fact is, that all believers in the Church Age are royal priests in Christ (Rev 1:6). We each represent ourselves individually before God as priests, and it is part of our priestly function to confess our known sins to God on a regular basis. If we neglect this function, or simply refuse to acknowledge it, then we are trying to have a dishonest relationship with God.

A believer who will not consistently confess his/her sins to God is not filled with the Holy Spirit, is not abiding in Christ, is causing damage to their own soul, and as a result, staining their robes. If this degeneration continues, then end will be sin unto death.


Leviticus 26, beginning with verse 40, is the confession Israel would be called upon to make. Israel would also have to accept the remainder of her punishment, that failure under the contract would call for and that would be the seven year tribulation. When John the Baptizer came along, had anything new begun? He simply called upon Israel to change their minds about their righteousness.

John the Baptizer came in connection with Yahweh’s earthly nation Israel and in accordance with an offer to confess their failure under the contract in order to gain their promised land. That confession itself would be considered a fruit of righteousness in the eyes of Yahweh. The focus during John the Baptizer’s ministry was still Israel and the issue continued to be the land. Nothing had changed except that Israel was being offered the opportunity to confess their failure under the contract. Israel continued to be the focus and the land continued to be the issue. 


If Israel was to regain her land, she would have to make that confession Leviticus 26 called for. And John came offering them, soliciting that confession from the nation. When Jesus comes on the scene; Israel’s Messiah is present among them, and Jesus preaches the same message as John the Baptizer. Nothing new has begun, Israel is still being called upon to make that confession concerning their failure under the contract.

The responsibility for keeping the slate clean after salvation would be up to us. If we could do it after salvation, we could have done it before our salvation! If we are not acting saved, we didn’t get saved is the idea that is being promoted. Paul didn’t like that is his day, we should not fall for it in ours. It is amazing that religious teachers would tell people that they have got that sin and they preach a message to make people fell guilty about the indwelling sin and then they would give those people rules to straighten up from the sin. The predicament of sin is that no person can escape it and no person can beat it, there is not any fixing the sin-nature, the flesh cannot be repaired. People want to be saved by grace and then they want their fellowship with God maintained by rule-keeping. In spite of Paul’s highest ambitions and in spite of his most lofty expectations, he could never merit righteousness before God through the perfection of his flesh, that is called “religion.”



posted on Feb, 27 2017 @ 02:54 PM
link   
a reply to: newnature1

John's first epistle is not addressed to Israel, it is addressed to believers in Christ, who have been saved by faith. So 1John 1:9 has nothing to do with John the Baptist, or Israel's acknowledgment of Christ. The apostle John was refering to our priestly responsibility to confess our sins to God. If we don't do this, then our relationship with God cannot grow.



new topics

top topics



 
2
<< 1   >>

log in

join