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NYTimes : A trainee noted for incompetence, 2002/05/04 : Mr. Hanjour, who investigators contend piloted the airliner that crashed into the Pentagon, was reported to the Federal Aviation Agency in February 2001 after instructors at his flight school in Phoenix had found his piloting skills so shoddy and his grasp of English so inadequate that they questioned whether his pilot's license was genuine.
Records show a Hani Hanjour obtained a license in 1999 in Scottsdale, Ariz. Previous and sometimes contradictory reports said he failed in 1996 and 1997 to obtain a license at other schools.
''The staff thought he was a very nice guy, but they didn't think his English was up to level,'' said Marilyn Ladner, a vice president at the Pan Am International Flight Academy, which operated the center in Phoenix. Ms. Ladner said that the F.A.A. examined Mr. Hanjour's credentials and found them legitimate and that an inspector, by coincidence, attended a class with Mr. Hanjour. The inspector also offered to find an interpreter to help Mr. Hanjour, she said.
''He ended up observing Hani in class,'' Ms. Ladner added, ''though that was not his original reason for being there.''
Company officials briefed members of Congress about the case, including Representative James L. Oberstar, Democrat of Minnesota, who made public some of its general details in December.
The aviation agency did not return a call for comment.
Pan Am International, one of the largest pilot schools in the nation, also operated the flight school in Eagan, Minn., near Minneapolis, where the instructors' suspicions led to the arrest of Zacarias Moussaoui, the man whom the authorities have said was intended to be the 20th hijacker.
Ms. Ladner said the Phoenix staff never suspected that Mr. Hanjour was a hijacker but feared that his skills were so weak that he could pose a safety hazard if he flew a commercial airliner.
''There was no suspicion as far as evildoing,'' Ms. Ladner said. ''It was more of a very typical instructional concern that 'you really shouldn't be in the air.' ''
A former employee of the school said that the staff initially made good-faith efforts to help Mr. Hanjour and that he received individual instruction for a few days. But he was a poor student. On one written problem that usually takes 20 minutes to complete, Mr. Hanjour took three hours, the former employee said, and he answered incorrectly.
Ultimately, administrators at the school told Mr. Hanjour that he would not qualify for the advanced certificate. But the ex-employee said Mr. Hanjour continued to pay to train on a simulator for Boeing 737 jets. ''He didn't care about the fact that he couldn't get through the course,'' the ex-employee said.
Staff members characterized Mr. Hanjour as polite, meek and very quiet. But most of all, the former employee said, they considered him a very bad pilot.
''I'm still to this day amazed that he could have flown into the Pentagon,'' the former employee said. ''He could not fly at all.''
originally posted by: Mianeye
a reply to: LaBTop
The bumpy ride can possibly be seen in this cockpit video of a low pass 757, the lowest he goes is 20, i'm not sure of the measurements, is it feet ?
Wouldn't the ground effect be very short for the plane at the Pentagon at the speed it was going, as it only seem to be at the very last part he is very close to the ground.
I can't say why he went for the lower floor in stead of aiming more center of the building, but possibly because he didn't have time to correct upwards after aiming down towards the building.
originally posted by: anonentity
This is strange as well, funny how the truth will always stagger out. www.thetruthseeker.co.uk... this guy didn't pay his UK TV licence because the BBC showed the third building collapsing twenty mins. before it did. He claimed why should he pay for fake news...What's surprising is that the Judge agreed and let him walk.
Video Footage Pentagon
On December 15, 2004 Judicial Watch filed a Freedom of Information Act request seeking all records pertaining to camera recordings from the Sheraton National Hotel, the Nexcomm/Citgo gas station, Pentagon security cameras and the Virginia Department of Transportation.
On May 16, 2006 the following footage was released:
www.judicialwatch.org... (5756 frames)
www.judicialwatch.org... (6076 frames)
On December 26, 2009 Erik Larson filed a FOIA request for additional AA77/Pentagon information with the FBI. On March 16, 2010 the FBI released higher quality copies of the security camera videos previously obtained by Judicial Watch:
(Note the originals are encoded with ADV1, a format used by old CCTV systems)
----237 FBI FOIPA Source : Torrent-file
----135 FBI FOIPA Source : Torrent-file
911 Case Study - Pentagon Flight 77: www.youtube.com...
originally posted by: Xenogears
Again however no truther can explain how this vast (and it would indeed have to be vast) conspiracy could be carried out and kept secret for 15 years. No one with any credibility has come forward to say "I worked on the plan"...well actually I take that back Khalid Shek Muhammad specifically said that he worked on the plan.
Two things, first in the real world a pedo sharing network with 70,000 members operated in secret for years, iirc. So even the most horrible of things can be kept secret. Those with knowledge might be far less than 70,000, also they could've been chosen cultists or member of some secret order... we know cultists are capable of self torture, lying, murder and even suicide in the name of their beliefs. Also those who have patriotic reasons might do so too, I hear the nuke program had nearly a fifth of a million people involved, and it was kept secret during the war, and right now many if not most do not know how to make a nuke in fine detail.
Many, if not most, of the world religions are basically founded on make believe by many cultists keeping the secret of their fake leader for their entire lifetime.
Second, and more speculative, the simulation theory. Say this world was built for entertainment by a conspiracy nut, or fan, all manner of conspiracy could actually be real. You could have mind control, NPCs, etc all manner of things, could happen, designed to foster back and forth debates between conspiracists and anticonspiracists.
originally posted by: Zaphod58
a reply to: D8Tee
Prior to 2001, flight crews were trained to give hijackers the aircraft, keep passengers in their seats, and get the aircraft on the ground where they could negotiate with the hijackers. It's not like today, where they'd actually fight back. The crews would actually stop people from fighting back.
Didn't they fortify cockpit doors to ensure if the pilot is suicidal and crazy bye-bye you're not taking control of it.
BTW, is cockpit another of those weird 'manly' words like seminal?
. Flight 93 passengers knew also about that time about the fate of two planes in Manhattan, and revolted.
Why would it be so farfetched to suppose that the same was also known already inside Flight 77 ? Air-phones and hand-phones a lot at hand.
That's probably why D8Tee said :
""One thing that I have questions about, there were a lot of ex military on the plane, if I remember right the pilot himself had been in the Air force. I just don't get how some guys with boxcutters could take control of the plane and not have a fight on their hands.""
Brian David Sweeney tried calling his wife, Julie, at 08:58, but ended up leaving a message, telling her that the plane had been hijacked. He then called his parents at 9:00 a.m. and spoke with his mother, Louise. Sweeney told his mother about the hijacking and mentioned that passengers were considering storming the cockpit and taking control of the aircraft
originally posted by: firerescue
a reply to: AnAbsoluteCreation
I find it absolutely impossible that an aluminum nose and fuselage can penetrate reinforced concrete through three sectors of the Pentagon. This is literally what these missile are meant to do, not airplanes.
Don't think an aircraft can penetrate a masonry wall...??
Example - July 1945 Empire State Building B 25 lost in heavy fog strikes ESB at 79th floor tearing huge hole in side of
Even better - aircraft penetrating solid steel side of ship
Both aircraft weighed a fraction of the Boeing B 757 which struck Pentagon . They were also travelling at 1/3 speed
of the Boeing
It is the speed which determines the impact forces as energy produced is determined by the SQUARE OF THE VELOCITY
Double the velocity, increase energy by 4 times, triple it, energy is 9 times the original
This report describes how the fires that followed the impact of debris from the collapse of WTC 1 (the north tower) led to the collapse of WTC 7; an evaluation of the building evacuation and emergency response procedures; what procedures and practices were used in the design, construction, operation, and maintenance of the building; and areas in current building and fire codes, standards, and practices that warrant revision. Also in this report is a summary of how NIST reached its conclusions. NIST complemented in-house expertise with private sector technical experts; accumulated copious documents, photographs, and videos of the disaster; conducted first-person interviews of building occupants and emergency responders; analyzed the evacuation and emergency response operations in and around WTC 7; performed computer simulations of the behavior of WTC 7 on September 11, 2001; and combined the knowledge gained into a probable collapse sequence. The report concludes with a list of 13 recommendations for action in the areas of increased structural integrity, enhanced fire endurance of structures, new methods for fire resistant design of structures, enhanced active fire protection, improved emergency response, improved procedures and practices, and education and training. One of these is new; the other 12 are reiterated from the investigation into the collapse of the towers. Each of the 13 is relevant to WTC 7.