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We Are The Center Of The Universe

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posted on Feb, 23 2017 @ 05:51 AM
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a reply to: bobs_uruncle

Curvatute of the earth is 6669 feet at 100 miles NOT 33 feet.

Cheers - John




posted on Feb, 23 2017 @ 06:17 AM
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Oddly, I don't see anyone making the obvious comment yet, so I will, I suppose.

Imagine the Solar system. Most of the planets, although not all, orbit the Sun in a pretty flat plane. Some are a bit closer to that plane than others. So envision the solar system as a plate with a ping pong ball at the center. Not to scale, to be sure. But the orbits of the planets pretty much follow in the line of the plate.

Now, imagine the rest of the observable universe, as shown as readings we get from the CMB.

It shows the bulk of the universe not distributed in a ball, as you might assume, but also in a plane, sort of. So imagine the plate lying in the floor of a gymnasium, with crap piled on the floor as far as the eye can see. From our point of view, the other crap we can see is ALSO in the same plane as the planets. Some is piled higher, so you have to look up to see it. Some is piled WAY up. But in general, the crap we can see looks like it, too, is sitting on the floor.

Now, we can see crap both near and far. And we can see that if we look straight up, there's much less crap over us than there is to the sides, about level with us. But that's all we can tell. Now, from the interesting data that things are more densely piled along the floor, we know...that stuff tends to be piled alongside us, rather than over or under us.

But that doesn't tell you doodly squat about where on the floor you are, because you can't see the walls.

In a similar fashion, this information tells you that as far as the CMB sensors on the satellites say, the plane of the Solar ecliptic tends to match the distribution of the microwave background noise. So our plate is level with the floor. But you can't get ANY sense of where you're at on the floor. The CMB aligning with the solar system ecliptic does not convey centration. Just that the planets more or less on average tend to go around the Sun at the same angle that the microwave background is distributed. It says nothing about being the center of anything. And nothing says that this isn't just a coincidence, to boot.

Now, a non-spherical distribution might just tell you that the universe rotates. Which, in itself, is very interesting for other reasons. But it doesn't say a thing about the Solar system being at the center of anything.
edit on 23-2-2017 by Bedlam because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 23 2017 @ 07:31 AM
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I love all the people in this thread discounting peer reviewed scientific evidence.

Probably the same people who believe the global warming data 100% because it's peer reviewed by other scientists.



posted on Feb, 23 2017 @ 08:48 AM
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originally posted by: jjkenobi
I love all the people in this thread discounting peer reviewed scientific evidence.

Probably the same people who believe the global warming data 100% because it's peer reviewed by other scientists.


The evidence is peer reviewed. The conclusion that 'we are the center of the universe' is not. When you understand what "plane of the ecliptic" means, and how that doesn't tell you that you're at the center, you will understand why.

eta: though it's tough to see how I'd make a clearer example, consider a poker chip lying on a round table. Both are co-planar. From the poker chip's point of view, somehow, miraculously the table's plane is the same as its.

However, if you can't see the edges of the table from the chip's point of view, you have no friggin' idea where you are in relation to the center of the table. Yes, your planes are identical. No, you can't tell centration.
edit on 23-2-2017 by Bedlam because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 23 2017 @ 10:24 AM
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originally posted by: john777
a reply to: bobs_uruncle

Curvatute of the earth is 6669 feet at 100 miles NOT 33 feet.

Cheers - John


Well, we are both wrong lol

link

Looks like the curvature is approximately 8" per mile, so 100 miles would be 800 inches or 66.67 feet.

Cheers - Dave



posted on Feb, 24 2017 @ 05:54 AM
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a reply to: TheSpottedOwl

Good find. Here's more:


Most cosmologists will not admit it publicly, but perhaps over a beer they would tell you what is happening. Observations over the last 50 years, culminating with the Planck satellite results (March 2013) set modern science on a counter revolution leading closer to ideas formed 500 years ago. Today’s cosmology is based on two broad principles: The Copernican Principle (we are not in a special place in the universe) and the Cosmological Principle (The Copernican Principle, plus isotropy- the view from anywhere in the universe looks about the same). Starting with early studies of the cosmic microwave background (CMB), and in recent years culminating with results from the COBE then the WMAP satellites, scientists were faced with a signal at the largest scales of the universe- a signal that pointed right back at us, indicating that we are in a special place in the universe.

Without getting overly technical, the Copernican and cosmological principles require that any variation in the radiation from the CMB be more or less randomly distributed throughout the universe, especially on large scales. Results from the WMAP satellite (early 2000s) indicated that when looking at large scales of the universe, the noise could be partitioned into “hot” and “cold” sections, and this partitioning is aligned with our ecliptic plane and equinoxes. This partitioning and alignment resulted in an axis through the universe, which scientists dubbed “the axis of evil”, because of the damage it does to their theories. This axis is aligned to us. Lawrence Krauss commented in 2005:

“ But when you look at [the cosmic microwave background] map, you also see that the structure that is observed, is in fact, in a weird way, correlated with the plane of the earth around the sun. Is this Copernicus coming back to haunt us? That’s crazy. We’re looking out at the whole universe. There’s no way there should be a correlation of structure with our motion of the earth around the sun — the plane of the earth around the sun — the ecliptic. That would say we are truly the center of the universe.”


medium.com...

I know some people want to attempt to try and explain these things away but they can't. If some of the most brilliant minds in Cosmology can't explain these things away then it's not going to happen on a message board. And these Scientist tried to explain it away.


Most scientists brushed the observation off as a fluke of some type, and many theories were created to explain it away. Many awaited the Planck mission. The Planck satellite was looked upon as a referee for these unexpected (and unwelcome) results. The Planck satellite used different sensor technology, and an improved scanning pattern to map the CMB. In March 2013, Planck reported back, and in fact verified the presence of the signal in even higher definition than before!


medium.com...

So yes, this will be explained away ad nauseum because it's an affront to people's belief system.



posted on Feb, 24 2017 @ 01:40 PM
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originally posted by: neoholographic

I know some people want to attempt to try and explain these things away but they can't. If some of the most brilliant minds in Cosmology can't explain these things away then it's not going to happen on a message board. And these Scientist tried to explain it away.


Just because they haven't yet verified a reason that has to do with an unknown local foreground source of microwaves ("local foreground" meaning associated with our solar system, or at least our local galactic neighborhood) showing up in the cosmic microwave background, that does not mean that a local foreground source does not exist. That idea has not been completely ruled out by cosmologists.

There are groups who are considering that the ecliptic anomaly is not part of the background, but an unknown part of the local foreground. For example:

The Uncorrelated Universe: Statistical Anisotropy and the Vanishing Angular Correlation Function in WMAP Years 1-3

CMB Isotropy Anomalies and the Local Kinetic Sunyaev-Zel’dovich Effect


edit on 2017/2/24 by Box of Rain because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 24 2017 @ 02:47 PM
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a reply to: Box of Rain

Your papers fall flat in the face of Planck satellite data.

Most scientists brushed the observation off as a fluke of some type, and many theories were created to explain it away. Many awaited the Planck mission. The Planck satellite was looked upon as a referee for these unexpected (and unwelcome) results. The Planck satellite used different sensor technology, and an improved scanning pattern to map the CMB. In March 2013, Planck reported back, and in fact verified the presence of the signal in even higher definition than before!

medium.com...

This is from 2013. Your sources are from May 2006 and Feb. 2010. Your papers are just trying to explain this but the theories have no support and Planck made it even more profound.

Here's Atheist Laurence Krauss:

“ But when you look at [the cosmic microwave background] map, you also see that the structure that is observed, is in fact, in a weird way, correlated with the plane of the earth around the sun. Is this Copernicus coming back to haunt us? That’s crazy. We’re looking out at the whole universe. There’s no way there should be a correlation of structure with our motion of the earth around the sun — the plane of the earth around the sun — the ecliptic. That would say we are truly the center of the universe.”



posted on Feb, 24 2017 @ 04:08 PM
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a reply to: neoholographic

I know what Lawrence Krauss said, and he is a smart guy. However, he may not be intimately involved with the details of the work of the groups attempting to explain the quadrupole and octopole alignment. Lawrence Krauss knows stuff, but what he says is not necessarily the last word on cosmological questions.

You mention that the observations from the Planck satellite made the alignment more profound. However, the only thing that Planck ruled out was that the WMAP readings were in error, or that WMAP data was in error. The data from Plank has NOT ruled out the possibility of local effects.

It is closed-minded to not attempt to identify a local effect as the cause of the quadrupole octopole alignment -- either an effect caused by something associated with the solar system, or an effect caused by our local neighborhood whose symptoms include affecting the orientation of the solar system.

I'm not saying it does in fact have a local explanation, but at the same time, a local explanation has not been ruled out -- not in the very least. However, it would be just as wrong to jump to the conclusion that "OhMyGod!!! Teh universe is aligned with the solar system's ecliptic!!!" than it would be to jump to the conclusion that the apparent alignment is due to a local effect. The jury is still out on either conclusion.

Cause and effect issues (determining what is a cause and what is an effect, or determining what effects can result from a specific cause) is one of the toughest things in science.



edit on 2017/2/24 by Box of Rain because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 24 2017 @ 08:04 PM
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originally posted by: neoholographic

There’s no way there should be a correlation of structure with our motion of the earth around the sun — the plane of the earth around the sun — the ecliptic. That would say we are truly the center of the universe.”


Again, examine this statement. Co-planarity does NOT equal centration. It just doesn't.

It does NOT say we are at the center of anything. Just that the plane that the planets go around the Sun (more or less - they're not perfectly on the same plane either), aligns with the cosmic background pattern.

In the same way, that rug on your floor is in the same plane as the floor. But that doesn't require the rug to be at the exact center of the room. And if from the rug's point of view it can't see the walls, then it can't know anything about position in the plane. Just that there's co-planarity.

Krauss is making a huge, unfounded, easily seen-to-be-false leap when he assumes centration. Because there's nothing to suggest that's true.



posted on Feb, 26 2017 @ 05:32 PM
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originally posted by: Bedlam
Now, a non-spherical distribution might just tell you that the universe rotates. Which, in itself, is very interesting for other reasons. But it doesn't say a thing about the Solar system being at the center of anything.


Does rotation imply a Machian universe? Or, no bearing on whether or not the universe is Machian, but that IF it is...then you can go FTL?



posted on Feb, 26 2017 @ 07:49 PM
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originally posted by: Tajlakz
but that IF it is...then you can go FTL?


Argh.

How 'bout them Hornets?



posted on Feb, 27 2017 @ 09:45 AM
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narcissism detected
humans are the worst sentient being on the universe believe it or not



posted on Feb, 27 2017 @ 09:48 AM
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originally posted by: humanoidlord
narcissism detected
humans are the worst sentient being on the universe believe it or not

It's narcissistic to think we are special in any way -- either the best OR the worst.

It's far more likely that we are quite average.



posted on Feb, 27 2017 @ 06:46 PM
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a reply to: Box of Rain

nope but he is one of the worst ones



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