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originally posted by: Aazadan
a reply to: lakenheath24
Given enough time and freedom, most people eventually seek out some form of structure for themselves. Some take longer than others depending on their work ethic and how they feel about their current jobs. The majority of people try to become productive on their own if given the opportunity though.
originally posted by: soficrow
I think so too. But lakenheath24 has some good observations. Many substantiated right here on ATS. ...I am an anarchist - intellectually, emotionally and intuitively. But that all goes out the window when I see the hate, brutality and savagery online - the overwhelming mass of intellectual toddlers, all obviously abused physically, emotionally, psychically, and giving it back 10-fold.
Golding nailed it. Given a corporate-military upbringing, and absent authoritarian structure, there is no civilization.
Increasing motivation in low-achieving students
Traditional classroom structures center on an ability-based system where each student’s achievement is compared to others’ and measured by grades. An increasing body of research indicates that a more student-centered approach in a noncompetitive classroom setting can increase intrinsic motivation, while grades can actually decrease it. In one study, student-centered goals, used over three days, led to greater effectiveness, skill and persistence. In the longest experimental study so far, lasting for one school year, those in experimental classrooms using a student-centered approach showed more positive attitudes to school, had higher self-concepts, preferred more challenging work and showed more intrinsic motivation than students in the control group
originally posted by: Tranceopticalinclined
I've thought about this for a very long time.
I think that if you give society just enough to cover food, housing, medical and maybe a little extra for whatnot that you'd be surprised how many people would still seek employment, however they'd seek employment doing something they have a passion for or are talented at.
The majority of people are not content just doing nothing, people get bored very easily and even entertainment can become boring.
I think a dawn of human involvement is at hand, where we will see that we do want to collectively help others out and evolve technology.
I think we will move from this " make myself money while doing nothing of real importance " to this " make humanity better and I feel good while doing it " mentality.
I know it's hard to think of the whole population as this HIVE mind type that want's to better ourselves and our surroundings, but it's our next logical step of evolution. To really understand we're the same and if we don't work with one another we're working against one another and that's not productive.
Life adapts but within a means of evolution.
originally posted by: soficrow
I gave you a star, but not because I agree. I don't. ...Anecdotal disclosure: I am not competitive and raised an uncompetitive child - yes, it can be a bit of a drawback in a professional milieu but both of us are astoundingly self-motivated (and self-assured, self-confident, self-possessed, et al). It works on a personal level. Moreover, there are examples of communities where it was shown to work well. ...Also, I'm sure you know of motivational research and studies that disprove the generality of your statements.
originally posted by: lakenheath24
That's interesting, but what happens when you apply those passive incomes to a global scale? I would argue that productivity, advancement, and the like would just stop. Did those individuals provide for the greater good of society, or was the benefit within their own clan?
I would also point to East and West Germany to see what happens between 2 different societies and the difference in ingenuity, art, and culture. It seems most of human advancement comes after a war or some such chaos.
I completely agree with your assessment of needing to compete with others. It's how we evolve, otherwise we would still be using stone tools.
The data is pretty clear on this, societies which have harsher rules and expect more out of people have been more advanced, and derive a greater understanding of the world.
originally posted by: coop039
originally posted by: mclarenmp4
a reply to: coop039
The thing is you already pay for those type of people through the social programs, so why not get rid of those programs and give everyone UBI. Everyone gets the same, so there's no animosity.
If people want to live the bare minimum then so be it, they are no longer a burden on society.
A lot of people turn to crime just to make ends meet, take that burden away and some people may not feel the need to go down that route.
What happens when the number of people getting UBI exceeds the amount taxed on the working people? Sooner or later people will get tired of paying for others to do nothing.
To take money and do no work is almost a sin. It will take a seismic shift in attitudes to change that.