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Does God pray?

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posted on Feb, 12 2017 @ 04:22 PM
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a reply to: irenialilivenka


Everyone knows the Bible isn't meant to be literally interpreted,

No, they don't know that. Especially in the "Bible Belt" portions of the US.


or they don't.
Which is it then?

You don't seem to understand that many millions of "Americans" take it very literally.....and they are the "Christians" who are trying to take over this whole country.

You can be mad at me all you want....but the fact is that there are WAY TOO MANY Americans who think that "The Bible" is a literal work of history. It is not.

Please be sure to address that in your coming posts. Do not assume that readers here are aware that The Bible is mythology and metaphor at best. SOME of them are --- but the majority of those who post in this forum are not. No need to take my contrariness personally.




edit on 2/12/2017 by BuzzyWigs because: (no reason given)




posted on Feb, 12 2017 @ 04:54 PM
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a reply to: BuzzyWigs

If I say "everyone knows, or they don't," it's a mere factual statement not something to split up as if it were two separate comments like you did, more tomfoolery.

Because there are 2 options, know or don't.

So it is both, obviously, like I originally without any confusion stated.

You are imagining that I am angry with you?

Are you troubled?
edit on 12-2-2017 by irenialilivenka because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 12 2017 @ 05:00 PM
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Everyone knows the Bible is not meant to be interpreted literally...Or they do not know.

Good God I stated a simple fact, and someone wants to pretend I said both as absolute facts separately and not, as in reality, as a single statement saying some do, some don't.

And wonders why "adversarial" and "gnat like" are my choice descriptive terms.



posted on Feb, 12 2017 @ 05:11 PM
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originally posted by: irenialilivenka

originally posted by: BuzzyWigs
a reply to: irenialilivenka

The Bible is fiction -- it is mythology. When you accept that truth (and not one moment sooner!) you will soar to new heights of awareness and (dare I say!) salvation.

The Bible is a sham. It is fan-fiction. It is a man-made anthology of man-made ideas. To believe it is to be brainwashed.



Everyone knows the Bible isn't meant to be literally interpreted, or they don't.

I do. I can extract wisdom from it and inspiration and it's historicity is no issue whatsoever.

Thanks for getting mad enough to insult every Christian but I am not one.


A sentiment fit to repeat.



posted on Feb, 12 2017 @ 05:42 PM
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Well do you?



posted on Feb, 12 2017 @ 05:49 PM
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a reply to: BuzzyWigs

You are wrong.

The scripture is His story



posted on Feb, 12 2017 @ 05:58 PM
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originally posted by: visitedbythem
a reply to: BuzzyWigs

You are wrong.

The scripture is His story


lol! No. The "scripture" is an anthology of myths compiled by men.



posted on Feb, 12 2017 @ 06:12 PM
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a reply to: irenialilivenka


You are imagining that I am angry with you?

Are you troubled?

Not in the slightest.

Welcome to ATS.



posted on Feb, 12 2017 @ 08:21 PM
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originally posted by: irenialilivenka


I imagine one might think at the suggestion, "What a stupid thing to ask."

My reason for asking is simple, though, and I assure you born out of logical thinking if you will hear me out.

Jesus institute's a universal prayer of sorts in the form of: "Our Father, who is in Heaven, Holy be your name. Until Kingdom come, Your will be done, as in heaven so on earth...."

Forgive us our sins, as we forgive those who sin against us, and don't lead us into temptation.

My own wording, but no difference, if it makes a difference I am sure you have a Bible and know the prayer, that's how I say it though.

My point is, it is hardly the only time Jesus prays to his Father in Heaven. He asked for his burden to be removed, every time he healed someone or performed any miracle it was through the power he had by being in direct 2 way communication with God. But God was the final authority on all things, Jesus power came from God.

Which explains why he obeyed God and prayed and never once did he do his own will alone without permission. He didn't want to be crucified, regretted it even thinking he was forsaken at the point of death, his final words were "My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?" Showing a lack of Omniscience.

Let me wrap this up and get to my point.

If you happen to believe Jesus is the Messiah and Son of God in addition to God (the Jesus Trinity? "In the name of the Christ, Son of God and who is God, amen." Kidding. He has more titles and attributes than the Kabbalistic Sefira on its Tree of Life model to be honest)...

Sorry. If you believe Jesus is God, that would mean you believe God prays. To God. Unless Jesus was not God YET, and was "promoted(?)" from Messiah to Son to full blown God, spiritually progressing along the Way.

In either case I have a question:

Who does God the Father pray to?

The Holy Spirit?

I am seriously curious and not at all trying to mock, aside from a joke or two in good fun.

I would love to hear a logical resolution to my quasi-dilemma of trying to determine who the other two God of the Trinity prays to.

(Interesting side note, I used singular God because of the Monotheistic beliefs of Christians who refer to Elohim, literally "Gods" in Hebrew and Ugaritic, as "God". While Elohim actually is called a "plural of Majesty" and said to refer to the One God of Israel most times it is used,( theologically this is true)... Christianity has a belief in 3 God(s), quite literally, F, S, & H.S., they only call the Trinity "God" even if referring to all three of the members. One God is called many, 3 God(s) is called one...very interesting coincidence, few legitimate coincidences as profound exist)

But yeah...

Who does God pray to? Does Father pray to Son? Receive from Son miraculous powers? Does the Holy Spirit pray to Jesus, Her Son?

Jesus calls the Holy Spirit his Mother in the Hebrew Gospel original translated by Augustine. Something about taking him to a Mt. I think is called "Tabor." It is said because of Spirit being fem. in Hebrew this is the reason the Spirit is called "Mother" but is this true with ''Father" too? Meaning metaphorical, not literal "Father" due to the masculinity of "El" or "God" in Hebrew?

Actually, Elohim is masculo-feminine. El+Eloah. Elohim are also the "Host of Heaven" or "Sons of El." In Canaanite religion "Sons of El and Athirat/Asherah."

It was not uncommon for lesser gods to recite hymns to the High Gods. Prayers to God from gods was normal almost in any polytheistic culture I can think of. Baal pleaded with Asherah who interceded with El and Yamm's fate was sealed, Baal Elyon was the God of Canaan even if he had to answer (hypothetically) to El the actual King of the Pantheon, Mighty El, the Bull.

So it is not outrageous or anything if a god prays to a god, especially his/hers Parent God.

Sophia prayed to the All in the realm of the Light and She was the Creator God (different than demiurge) of the "Gnostics" and other than her consort Christ/Logos and the Great Inneffable Spirit, She was the most important and revered God(ess) they had.

Sophia is the equivalent of the Holy Spirit in Gnostic Scripture and prays, repents for creating without the blessing of the Great God or her consort, and produced imperfection and an unnatural Spirit. Hid it on earth and a great deal of mythology develops from there.

But that is not monotheistic or Orthodox Christian, though Christian indeed.

Does the God of the Bible pray?


Who would He pray to? Jesus was not "God in the flesh". Jesus prayed to the Father just as He taught us to.
Though, I totally get "Buzzyywings" irritation with all of it, as wel, lol.
I think organized "Christianity" has left many jaded...myself included.
I honestly don't think the actual GOD can be defined, put in a book, or a box.
.



posted on Feb, 12 2017 @ 11:02 PM
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a reply to: irenialilivenka




My point is, it is hardly the only time Jesus prays to his Father in Heaven. He asked for his burden to be removed, every time he healed someone or performed any miracle it was through the power he had by being in direct 2 way communication with God.



The answer to this question is found in Philippians 2:



4 Let each of you look not only to his own interests, but also to the interests of others. 5 Have this mind among yourselves, which is yours in Christ Jesus, 6 who, though he was in the form of God, did not count equality with God a thing to be grasped, 7 but emptied himself, by taking the form of a servant, being born in the likeness of men. 8 And being found in human form, he humbled himself by becoming obedient to the point of death, even death on a cross. 9 Therefore God has highly exalted him and bestowed on him the name that is above every name, 10 so that at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, in heaven and on earth and under the earth, 11 and every tongue confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.


The Messiah does not only come as a concurring king but also as the suffering servant (read Isaiah 53), and in verse 7 you have this explaining that Christ was the suffering servant. The fact that God would die for sins is expressed in the names of Genesis 5, below is a list of the following with their meaning out to the right:



Adam Man
Seth Appointed
Enosh Mortal
Kenan Sorrow;
Mahalalel The Blessed God
Jared Shall come down
Enoch Teaching
Methuselah His death shall bring(flood comes at death of Methuselah)
Lamech The Despairing
Noah Rest, or comfort.


Man (is) appointed mortal sorrow; (but) the Blessed God shall come down teaching (that) His death shall bring (the) despairing rest.

Colossians 1:



15 He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of all creation. 16 For by him all things were created, in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities—all things were created through him and for him. 17 And he is before all things, and in him all things hold together.


Christ is the visible image of the invisible God. Let us look for this visible image in the OT and see if it is treated as a different person:

In Genesis 18, YHWH appears to Abraham as a man before going to destroy Sodom. Later in Genesis 19 we read, "Then the LORDrained on Sodom and Gomorrah brimstone and fire from the LORD out of heaven..."

You'll notice the visible image that appears in Genesis 18 to Abraham is said to have rained fire and brimestone from the invisible lord in heaven.

Genesis 22:



11 But the angel of the Lord called to him from heaven and said, “Abraham, Abraham!” And he said, “Here I am.” 12 He said, “Do not lay your hand on the boy or do anything to him, for now I know that you fear God, seeing you have not withheld your son, your only son, from me.


The angel of the Lord speaks as God in the first person.

Exodus 3:



3 Now Moses was keeping the flock of his father-in-law, Jethro, the priest of Midian, and he led his flock to the west side of the wilderness and came to Horeb, the mountain of God. 2 And the angel of the Lord appeared to him in a flame of fire out of the midst of a bush. He looked, and behold, the bush was burning, yet it was not consumed. 3 And Moses said, “I will turn aside to see this great sight, why the bush is not burned.” 4 When the Lord saw that he turned aside to see, God called to him out of the bush, “Moses, Moses!” And he said, “Here I am.


Notice we have here the angel of the lord who appears as the burning bush but God who speaks.

Judges 13:



15 Manoah said to the angel of the Lord, “Please let us detain you and prepare a young goat for you.” 16 And the angel of the Lord said to Manoah, “If you detain me, I will not eat of your food. But if you prepare a burnt offering, then offer it to the Lord.” (For Manoah did not know that he was the angel of the Lord.) 17 And Manoah said to the angel of the Lord, “What is your name, so that, when your words come true, we may honor you?” 18 And the angel of the Lord said to him, “Why do you ask my name, seeing it is wonderful?” 19 So Manoah took the young goat with the grain offering, and offered it on the rock to the Lord, to the one who works wonders, and Manoah and his wife were watching. 20 And when the flame went up toward heaven from the altar, the angel of the Lord went up in the flame of the altar. Now Manoah and his wife were watching, and they fell on their faces to the ground. 21 The angel of the Lord appeared no more to Manoah and to his wife. Then Manoah knew that he was the angel of the Lord. 22 And Manoah said to his wife, “We shall surely die, for we have seen God.”


So hear we know that the angel of the lord is the visible image of the invisible God, as it can't get much clearer. In Exodus 33 we read, But He said, "You cannot see My face, for no man can see Me and live!

In Judges 6 Gideon fears death after a visit from the angel of the lord who leaves the scene, and then the Lord actually tells Gideon not to fear after:




Then the angel of the LORD departed out of his sight. 22 And when Gideon perceived that he was an angel of the LORD, Gideon said, Alas, O LORD God! for because I have seen an angel of the LORD face to face. 23 And the LORD said unto him, Peace be unto thee; fear not: thou shalt not die.



Christ is the visible image of the visible God, but they have some type of separation as well. This portion of the Godhead according to Philippians 2 becomes the suffering servant and humbles himself before the Father. Hence the reason Jesus prays.



posted on Feb, 12 2017 @ 11:09 PM
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originally posted by: irenialilivenka

originally posted by: mysterioustranger
a reply to: irenialilivenka

To WHO? And for what and to what end? I think God speaks and sends wishes and blessings.... But praying?

As the SOURCE of all and whom prayed TO? No... that's silly....and pointless


To say asking philosophically relevant questions is silly....And pointless, is silly....and lacks intelligence...And purpose.


Well...I certainly understand philosophical questions...and nothing asked in earnest is pointless...and I surely do not lack intelligence...perhaps my only flaw would be in implying what your purpose in asking is.

Now, I do...



posted on Feb, 12 2017 @ 11:56 PM
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originally posted by: irenialilivenka

originally posted by: rickymouse
When god looks at me he shakes his head and prays that nobody else will turn out like me.


That's a good one. I actually L'd o L.

But I wonder to whom?

Does he shake his head up and down or left and right? I don't think it is a planetary constant to go horizontal for no, etc.


God is both a being and a concept, I think we can only conjecture and speculate but for me the key is when Jesus said to the man asking about whose wife a certain woman would be in the resurrection after she had married a man who then died leaving her childless and in Jewish tradition she had then been passed onto his brother whom also died and onto his brother and on until all the brothers had died and she still childless was left a widow (Wonder if they had life insurance those day's - just joking).

Now Jesus answer is telling and it was this that in the resurrection there shall be NO DIFFERENCE between a man and a woman and you shall neither be given nor taken in marriage, you shall have a new body, a spiritual body LIKE THE ANGELS.

Now the key here is that you have to ask yourself if we then grow up to become angel's whom were the angels before they grew up? AND what does an angel become when it grows up.

But God is eternal in fact the concept of eternal does not even apply because he is totally beyond even that so it is fair to assume that we grow toward the father but he is more or less an infinite growth away meaning we therefore are embarking upon an endless but also eternal period of slow but definite growth as being's, a growth toward the father in which if we grow well and strong we grow to be more and more like him.

That is my best guess anyway but truth be told though I truly do believe in God and that we have a horrible and evil adversary intent upon destroying us on that journey I do not know any more than any one else.



posted on Feb, 13 2017 @ 03:12 AM
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originally posted by: irenialilivenka
Does God pray?

Of course!
People 'pray', thus God prays!
People fart, thus God farts!
People know how it smells, thus God knows how it smells!
Thus all is Known, thus are We Omni-!
'Omni-' means ALL inclusive, One!

"God cannot know himself without me." - Meister Eckhart

"The eye by which I see God is the same as the eye by which God sees me. My eye and God's eye are one and the same." - Meister Eckhart

tat tvam asi (en.wikipedia.org...)



posted on Feb, 13 2017 @ 08:36 AM
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a reply to: LABTECH767

Very Zoharic sentiment.

Adam Kadmon the primordial man, was an androgyne too. Separating light from darkness is a metaphor for the division of Adam and Eve.

Also reincarnation is a Zoharic sentiment as well, metempsychosis. Moses is Abel, Jethro is Cain repented, etc.

I am not sure though, if our prexistent selves pre incarnation were gendered or not.

What do you think?



posted on Feb, 13 2017 @ 08:40 AM
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originally posted by: Matrixsurvivor

originally posted by: irenialilivenka


I imagine one might think at the suggestion, "What a stupid thing to ask."

My reason for asking is simple, though, and I assure you born out of logical thinking if you will hear me out.

Jesus institute's a universal prayer of sorts in the form of: "Our Father, who is in Heaven, Holy be your name. Until Kingdom come, Your will be done, as in heaven so on earth...."

Forgive us our sins, as we forgive those who sin against us, and don't lead us into temptation.

My own wording, but no difference, if it makes a difference I am sure you have a Bible and know the prayer, that's how I say it though.

My point is, it is hardly the only time Jesus prays to his Father in Heaven. He asked for his burden to be removed, every time he healed someone or performed any miracle it was through the power he had by being in direct 2 way communication with God. But God was the final authority on all things, Jesus power came from God.

Which explains why he obeyed God and prayed and never once did he do his own will alone without permission. He didn't want to be crucified, regretted it even thinking he was forsaken at the point of death, his final words were "My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?" Showing a lack of Omniscience.

Let me wrap this up and get to my point.

If you happen to believe Jesus is the Messiah and Son of God in addition to God (the Jesus Trinity? "In the name of the Christ, Son of God and who is God, amen." Kidding. He has more titles and attributes than the Kabbalistic Sefira on its Tree of Life model to be honest)...

Sorry. If you believe Jesus is God, that would mean you believe God prays. To God. Unless Jesus was not God YET, and was "promoted(?)" from Messiah to Son to full blown God, spiritually progressing along the Way.

In either case I have a question:

Who does God the Father pray to?

The Holy Spirit?

I am seriously curious and not at all trying to mock, aside from a joke or two in good fun.

I would love to hear a logical resolution to my quasi-dilemma of trying to determine who the other two God of the Trinity prays to.

(Interesting side note, I used singular God because of the Monotheistic beliefs of Christians who refer to Elohim, literally "Gods" in Hebrew and Ugaritic, as "God". While Elohim actually is called a "plural of Majesty" and said to refer to the One God of Israel most times it is used,( theologically this is true)... Christianity has a belief in 3 God(s), quite literally, F, S, & H.S., they only call the Trinity "God" even if referring to all three of the members. One God is called many, 3 God(s) is called one...very interesting coincidence, few legitimate coincidences as profound exist)

But yeah...

Who does God pray to? Does Father pray to Son? Receive from Son miraculous powers? Does the Holy Spirit pray to Jesus, Her Son?

Jesus calls the Holy Spirit his Mother in the Hebrew Gospel original translated by Augustine. Something about taking him to a Mt. I think is called "Tabor." It is said because of Spirit being fem. in Hebrew this is the reason the Spirit is called "Mother" but is this true with ''Father" too? Meaning metaphorical, not literal "Father" due to the masculinity of "El" or "God" in Hebrew?

Actually, Elohim is masculo-feminine. El+Eloah. Elohim are also the "Host of Heaven" or "Sons of El." In Canaanite religion "Sons of El and Athirat/Asherah."

It was not uncommon for lesser gods to recite hymns to the High Gods. Prayers to God from gods was normal almost in any polytheistic culture I can think of. Baal pleaded with Asherah who interceded with El and Yamm's fate was sealed, Baal Elyon was the God of Canaan even if he had to answer (hypothetically) to El the actual King of the Pantheon, Mighty El, the Bull.

So it is not outrageous or anything if a god prays to a god, especially his/hers Parent God.

Sophia prayed to the All in the realm of the Light and She was the Creator God (different than demiurge) of the "Gnostics" and other than her consort Christ/Logos and the Great Inneffable Spirit, She was the most important and revered God(ess) they had.

Sophia is the equivalent of the Holy Spirit in Gnostic Scripture and prays, repents for creating without the blessing of the Great God or her consort, and produced imperfection and an unnatural Spirit. Hid it on earth and a great deal of mythology develops from there.

But that is not monotheistic or Orthodox Christian, though Christian indeed.

Does the God of the Bible pray?


Who would He pray to? Jesus was not "God in the flesh". Jesus prayed to the Father just as He taught us to.
Though, I totally get "Buzzyywings" irritation with all of it, as wel, lol.
I think organized "Christianity" has left many jaded...myself included.
I honestly don't think the actual GOD can be defined, put in a book, or a box.
.


I don't personally think Jesus is God in the flesh.

But I am proposing a riddle, if Jesus is God and prays to Father, who does Father pray to, being considered equal and all?

I understand Buzzy is irritatING, yet understand his grief.

To answer your question, God prays to us.

You need to learn Gods language is all, not YOU personally, anyone.

God needs us, or we would not exist, so if God didn't talk or pray to us (prayer / invoke) then we would not know that there is a God, if it can be said we do, and I believe it can.

If you have "Gnosis" that is.
edit on 13-2-2017 by irenialilivenka because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 13 2017 @ 08:45 AM
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a reply to: ServantOfTheLamb

The answers to anything relevant to God are absent from the Pauline side of Christianity, in his epistles specifically.

Junk ''theology" from the enemy of Christ.

Is what Paul's epistles contain.

No more.



posted on Feb, 13 2017 @ 10:08 AM
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originally posted by: mysterioustranger

originally posted by: irenialilivenka

originally posted by: mysterioustranger
a reply to: irenialilivenka

To WHO? And for what and to what end? I think God speaks and sends wishes and blessings.... But praying?

As the SOURCE of all and whom prayed TO? No... that's silly....and pointless


To say asking philosophically relevant questions is silly....And pointless, is silly....and lacks intelligence...And purpose.


Well...I certainly understand philosophical questions...and nothing asked in earnest is pointless...and I surely do not lack intelligence...perhaps my only flaw would be in implying what your purpose in asking is.

Now, I do...


I am wondering what comes after... that you decided not to say. Could not you finish your sentiment?



posted on Feb, 13 2017 @ 01:12 PM
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originally posted by: olaru12

originally posted by: irenialilivenka
a reply to: olaru12

Wo!!!

Chill. Did you make the Pesci remark?

Because I was quoting Goodfellas.


So what, ATS is a free for all and you don't make the rules.

Carry on with your intellectual masturbation and ego stroking if it gets you off.


Heh.



posted on Feb, 13 2017 @ 01:55 PM
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a reply to: irenialilivenka

Yes lets pull up a conspiracy theory on Paul because someone slapped me in the face with Scripture that answers my question. You asked for someone to explain why Jesus prays I did. Tell me this, did the Jesus of Nazareth die on a cross, was he buried, and was his tomb found empty?



posted on Feb, 13 2017 @ 03:34 PM
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originally posted by: ServantOfTheLamb
a reply to: irenialilivenka

Yes lets pull up a conspiracy theory on Paul because someone slapped me in the face with Scripture that answers my question. You asked for someone to explain why Jesus prays I did. Tell me this, did the Jesus of Nazareth die on a cross, was he buried, and was his tomb found empty?


He didn't.

It's mystical literature, not true history.

Historical Jesus is lost forever.

Probably because of Paul.


edit on 13-2-2017 by irenialilivenka because: (no reason given)



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