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Question For Those Opposed To Trump's Wall

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posted on Jan, 28 2017 @ 02:23 AM
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a reply to: DomTullipso

For a fraction of the cost of a wall, a significant increase in the number of CBP Agents placed along the border would produce REAL results at a finite cost that does not punish American consumers.

Tariffs are taxes paid by the consumer.

A 20% Tariff on all products imported from Mexico would mean that AMERICAN CONSUMERS, not "Mexico" would be "paying America back for the wall".

So, American taxpayers will pay for the wall up front ($10-15 Billion) assuming Congress votes to allocate the funds needed to build it.

Following that, the American taxpayers will continually pay via a 20% cost increase on the $295 Billion per year that America imports from Mexico. ($60 Billion per annum)




posted on Jan, 28 2017 @ 02:28 AM
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a reply to: Leonidas




Following that, the American taxpayers will continually pay via a 20% cost increase on the $295 Billion per year that America imports from Mexico. ($60 Billion per annum)

Not to mention the debt service on that cost.



posted on Jan, 28 2017 @ 02:47 AM
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a reply to: Leonidas

And don't forget, American taxpayers will also be paying for it through the reallocated taxpayer dollars that would've gone to American "sanctuary cities".



posted on Jan, 28 2017 @ 02:52 AM
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nevermind.
bad post.
edit on 2017-01-28T03:02:25-06:002201728America/Chicago1 by c2oden because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 28 2017 @ 03:01 AM
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a reply to: c2oden

They can't. This is what it's like to get into the US from Ciudad Juarez, Mexico.


Those agents check your passport &/or papers. Random or suspicious people & vehicles get pulled aside for extensive searches. Truckers constantly travel back & forth across the border, and both businesses and individuals (typically commuters) can buy special "fast track" styled passes to decrease the waiting time.



posted on Jan, 28 2017 @ 04:38 AM
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a reply to: DomTullipso

I get my views on this subject from these two over privileged elitist liberal snowflakes....






posted on Jan, 28 2017 @ 04:57 AM
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a reply to: neformore

As crazy as this sounds, I agree completely with their answers.

To put it into more context, Mexico in the 60s and 70s was fighting its own Cold War-related "Dirty War" (not to be confused with the more famous "Dirty War" in Argentina). Cuba and the communists were trying to win over Mexico, while the US and the other capitalists were also trying to win them over (note: by "win them over", I mean "backing paramilitaries, businesses, and politicians to get favorable results by any means necessary"). So Bush and Reagan in particular were trying to improve economic relations with Mexico in order to keep the communists out.

Fast forward to today and it seems like we're trying to do the opposite. What stops China and Russia from swooping into Mexico and pulling them towards BRICS & its affiliated banks, defense contractors, etc? China is already working on an alternative to the Panama Canal in Nicaragua.

To be honest, the Machiavellian streak in me sees this as a business opportunity. There's a lot of money to be made if the US and Mexico really do have a trade war.



posted on Jan, 28 2017 @ 04:57 AM
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a reply to: neformore

Ronnie speaks from beyond the grave with a prediction of "the lid blowing off down there"



posted on Jan, 28 2017 @ 06:07 AM
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originally posted by: enlightenedservant
a reply to: LesMisanthrope

That's a false equivalence and you know it.

A more accurate analogy would be building a wall only in the front of your neighborhood to stop "intruders", yet leaving every other side & port of entry untouched. Then you allow a lot of different people from all over the world into your neighborhood for specific permits, only to do nothing when they violate the terms of those permits. You even have agreements with other neighborhoods to allow their members to come to your neighborhood without any permits whatsoever, yet do nothing when they still violate the terms of the agreement.

Other people in your household & neighborhood hire those same people to do illegal things, purchase illegal things from them, and screw them over financially. But if the ones who are screwed over try to speak up, they're kicked out of your neighborhood. And if the ones who sell goods to your eager neighbors and family members are caught, then you suddenly pretend to have morals and arrest them... unless the sellers happen to be affiliated with your corrupt "neighborhood watch". If so, they get a slap on the wrist and are released so they can continue selling their goods to the happy customers in your neighborhood.

But when people point out how pointless the wall in the front of the neighborhood is, you act like you don't understand the issue.


Except you have the coast guard on the sides and Canadians to the north. Securing the southern border (you know, the one where lots of illegal immigrants seem to be pouring in from) would be the smartest move to slow the flow of them. Sure gun turrets and killer drones would also do well, but the bleeding heart liberals would explode over the injustice there, so a wall and some more guards and more surveillance is what it looks like we will be doing, even if you don't agree.



posted on Jan, 28 2017 @ 06:12 AM
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a reply to: DomTullipso

Here's my question for you: why do you believe that a wall is either possible or would do anything to solve any of America's problems, real or imagined?



posted on Jan, 28 2017 @ 06:16 AM
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a reply to: network dude

LOL Feel free to spend as much time & money on it as you want. In fact, I'd rather you guys spend all of your time pushing this stupid wall than pushing your other stated policies. Just be sure to accept responsibility for it when it fails. Repubs will be in control of all 3 branches of the federal govt once their Supreme Court nominee is approved, so all blame for any incompetence will fall completely on your side. No more scapegoats and no more excuses.



posted on Jan, 28 2017 @ 08:12 AM
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originally posted by: Tardacus

if 2 or more illegals have ever murdered a U.S. citizen in America then what he said IS true. he didn`t say all illegals murder American citizens.


Using that reasoning I would argue that since many if not most of the mass shootings here in the US were perpetrated by people suffering mental health issues, Mr. Trump should round up everyone with mental health issues and lock them up somewhere. His insinuation was that illegals=murderers. That was abundantly clear to anyone who can read.



posted on Jan, 28 2017 @ 08:31 AM
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a reply to: enlightenedservant


Repubs will be in control of all 3 branches of the federal govt once their Supreme Court nominee is approved, so all blame for any incompetence will fall completely on your side. No more scapegoats and no more excuses.


Yes. And for whatever it's worth -- I think we now have 4 branches of the government - the Media Branch is the latest addition.



posted on Jan, 28 2017 @ 08:38 AM
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a reply to: enlightenedservant

And don't forget the more recent Dirty Wars by Jeremy Scahill that proves how mercenaries, Bush/Cheney Rumsfeld and Prince (Betsy Devos's brother) paid for it. Recommended for anyone wanting to excuse the last Republican regime.

Dirty Wars is the most thorough and authoritative history I've read yet of the causes and consequences of America’s post 9/11 conflation of war and national security. I know of no other journalist who could have written it: For over a decade, Scahill has visited the war zones, overt and covert; interviewed the soldiers, spooks, jihadists, and victims; and seen with his own eyes the fruits of America's bipartisan war fever. He risked his life many times over to write this book, and the result is a masterpiece of insight, journalism, and true patriotism.
—Barry Eisler, novelist and former operative in the CIA’s Directorate of Operations


Have you read Captains and the Kings by Taylor Caldwell?
It should also be required reading for every person in this country. There's a film version, too.


This is a great surging novel about the amassing of a colossal fortune, the political power that comes with it, and the operation of a curse laid on an Irish-American dynasty and the ruthless driving man who founded it.


We must not forget that history.


edit on 1/28/2017 by BuzzyWigs because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 28 2017 @ 08:42 AM
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a reply to: enlightenedservant


I'd rather you guys spend all of your time pushing this stupid wall than pushing your other stated policies.


That's what the big gold letters will say, so we should give it a title-case treatment.

The Stupid Wall. To differentiate it from Hadrian's Wall, and The Great Wall Of China, and The Berlin Wall, and The Wailing Wall.



posted on Jan, 28 2017 @ 08:45 AM
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a reply to: DomTullipso



“Fixed fortifications are a monument to the stupidity of man.” - Some guy named Patton.

He was a general or something.



posted on Jan, 28 2017 @ 08:54 AM
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originally posted by: Middleoftheroad
As a Trump supporter, I could care less if he built the wall. I'd rather it be like the security system Area 51/Groom Lake has to be honest. Nobody crosses into that territory without detection.



Except the border is 2000 miles long. Three and half times the length of Britain.



posted on Jan, 28 2017 @ 08:56 AM
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a reply to: BuzzyWigs

I was familiar with Scahill but never heard of Caldwell. I'll have to look into that.

Although I think it's too late in regards to people remembering those years. At one point we were losing hundreds of thousands of jobs per month, yet people think that things were worse under Pres Obama. They also seem to have forgotten all about the Iraq War & occupation, the Afghan War & occupation, the Abu Ghraib torture scandal, the Anthrax attacks & how they influenced the passage of the Patriot Act, the numerous embassies attacked under Bush, etc.

And even worse than the Stupid Wall, I'm curious to see if they'll seriously try to push through tariffs, border adjustment/value added taxes, or a trade war against Mexico. One of my brothers was telling me that he doubted they would because it makes no sense economically. But I tried to warn him that xenophobia is more powerful than their other self interests.So only time will tell, I guess.



posted on Jan, 28 2017 @ 09:04 AM
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a reply to: enlightenedservant


Although I think it's too late in regards to people remembering those years.

Nah. Never too late.....the Millennials are an educated generation. So are women who are their parents. Bernie would have won against Trump. The DNC blew it....for whatever cause or reason or stupidity. He would have won.

We won't forget. (It's rather ironic that if women were still cast as sub-important that march would never have happened.)

And we aim to make sure no one does. Also ironic is that Holocaust Remembrance Day was yesterday. Seventy-two years ago, Hitler's victims were liberated. My husband's family and mine as well served in that war.
edit on 1/28/2017 by BuzzyWigs because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 28 2017 @ 12:22 PM
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a reply to: neformore

I miss reason and compassion

It's hard to believe how far we've fallen



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