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Question For Those Opposed To Trump's Wall

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posted on Jan, 27 2017 @ 04:58 PM
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originally posted by: dukeofjive696969
Because there is already a wall in place, and most of the illegals living im the usa come in with work or education visas, and stay after the visa expires.


WOW, I am not sure I have ever encountered this level of stupid. I have no response.

Just #ing WOW.




posted on Jan, 27 2017 @ 05:01 PM
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originally posted by: jtma508
a reply to: seeker1963
Nice! I like how you took one line out of my post. Excellent (although infantile) tactic.

The person to whom I responded made the unsubstantiated and egregious, based upon the facts, assertion that illegals were coming across the border and murdering our citizens. As you will note, I cited facts saying this was entirely untrue and made the comparison about how dangerous it is to place unsubstantiated blame on one group for societal problems. Shame on you.




if 2 or more illegals have ever murdered a U.S. citizen in America then what he said IS true. he didn`t say all illegals murder American citizens.



posted on Jan, 27 2017 @ 05:02 PM
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A bigger and more effective wall is needed. Whether you like the idea of a wall or not, it will help.
Will it stop all 100% of them, no, but it will help and that is progress.

Add a minefield, then we'll probably see even better results.



posted on Jan, 27 2017 @ 05:03 PM
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a reply to: Swills

Some more lies by you, but it's ok I'll refresh your memory. Your "noble peace prize" winner outspent GWB by almost a trillion on wars.

"Comparing the eight years of George W. Bush’s base budgets and the eight years of Obama’s (including the one proposed today), Obama’s exceed Bush’s by a sum total of $816.7 billion ($4,121.2 billion for Obama’s two terms, $3,304.5 for Bush’s). "

amp.slate.com...
edi t on 27-1-2017 by avgguy because: (no reason given)

edit on 27-1-2017 by avgguy because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 27 2017 @ 05:15 PM
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originally posted by: avgguy
a reply to: Swills

Some more lies by you, but it's ok I'll refresh your memory. Your "noble peace prize" winner outspent GWB by almost a trillion on wars.

"Comparing the eight years of George W. Bush’s base budgets and the eight years of Obama’s (including the one proposed today), Obama’s exceed Bush’s by a sum total of $816.7 billion ($4,121.2 billion for Obama’s two terms, $3,304.5 for Bush’s). "

amp.slate.com...

Just for the record:

1. It's "Nobel", not "noble".

2. Congress passes the federal budgets, not the President. So it's not his budget, it's theirs. Just like the budgets for the next 2 years will be the respnsibility of the 115th Congress, not Trump.



posted on Jan, 27 2017 @ 05:19 PM
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a reply to: enlightenedservant

So Obama didn't use that budget for war? It sure wasn't used on shovel ready jobs or affordable healthcare.



posted on Jan, 27 2017 @ 05:33 PM
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a reply to: avgguy

You know what the separation of powers is, right? The Legislative Branches (aka Congress, State legislatures, and city/county councils) pass the laws. The Executive Branches (aka Presidents, Governors, & Mayors) interpret, implement, and enforce those laws. And the Judicial Branches determine if those laws are constitutional, among other things.

So yeah, Congress determines the budget & allocates funds to specific programs and agencies, then the President uses those funds appropriately.



posted on Jan, 27 2017 @ 05:39 PM
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a reply to: enlightenedservant

So the president used those funds to kill people



posted on Jan, 27 2017 @ 05:44 PM
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Well, read through all five pages, and wow......lots of responses, and not one single person against the wall actually answered the questions from the OP! Not one. What did we get, instead?

1. Walls don't work.
2. "Hitler"
3. Americans really want drug dealers. (wait....maybe that was an answer of sorts...)
4. It costs too much.
5. Aliens!!!

Does that pretty much sum it up? The level of cluelessness on display is growing exponentially, it seems!! Let's keep this simple, people.

1. Walls do work. The Great Wall of China was effective. Hadrian's Wall was effective. The walls of your house are effective. Oh, sure, some could find a way through/in, but do you plan to live in an open field, with no walls, because burglars can enter a home that has them? I didn't think so.

2. No, people aren't "Hitler" because they don't want their nation to be invaded. What utter nonsense!! Stop pretending that wanting to control who enters, or doesn't, the country is somehow racist. It's not, and everyone knows that. The petty name-calling, and other associated behavior, cost the Left an election. On second thought, go right ahead and continue. Please. The 2018 elections could be quite satisfying if you do!!!

3. Drug dealers are only a small part of those that come across the unprotected southern border. Terrorists comes, too, and can come easily. Criminals as well. No crime from illegals? Really?? Better look again! Case after case after case of people being victimized by criminals that should not even be here. We have enough crime already, without allowing more to come over, uninvited. An unsecured border is about as senseless as open doors and windows on your home, while you sleep, and signs inviting in the local riffraff. Unless you plan to invite every single person you see into your home, and give them free reign to take your stuff, eat your food, sleep in your beds, etc, you have no business complaining about a border wall.

4. Oh, and paying for garbage labeled as "art" doesn't? Money for this and that stupid study doesn't? Money for any and all "social" programs is just fine, or sent off to our enemies in Iran, but how dare anyone talk of building a wall!! The illegals in California are literally bankrupting the state, but, hey, don't sweat those costs. If you do, you must be a "racist"! Well, guess what? The wall is being built, and all the complaining and whining won't help. The flow of money to illegals is stopping as well. The entry of any and all who want to come is done. we are not, and cannot afford to be, financially responsible for every poor person in the world. Besides, since conservatives give a lot more to charity, WILLINGLY, and liberals push to take money from others to give, I flat don't want to hear it.

5. Aliens? Really?? Yes, I know the show, and it's entertaining. It's also fiction. No, we aren't under control of aliens (well, not that sort), and no, that isn't why we need a wall on the southern border. I just knew aliens would come into this at some point!! Someone actually joked, on another site, that aliens would be the next thing claimed by the Left. I'll have to make a point of telling them they were right!!



posted on Jan, 27 2017 @ 05:47 PM
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a reply to: avgguy

Every President has used funds from Congress to kill people. Maybe not Carter, but I'm pretty sure he still used special forces. Although you're moving the goalpost. I simply pointed out that it's Congress' budget, not the President's budget (and that you misspelled Nobel
).

Just like Trump can't use any funds for the Trump Wall without congressional approval. Of course, "congressional approval" can also be found in laws passed by a previous Congress, which seems to be the route Trump used w/his executive order when they used a previous law from 2006 to justify it.



posted on Jan, 27 2017 @ 05:52 PM
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a reply to: DomTullipso

You'll note the criticisms of government spending and wastes of tax-payer dollars, but the same criticisms are never heard from the same mouths when it comes to government spending and tax-payer dollars at the federal, state and local levels for illegal immigrants, which far exceeds the cost of a wall.

As for the idiots saying "it won't work; they'll just find another way in", I suggest you remove your fence and the locks on your doors for the very same reason.
edit on 27-1-2017 by LesMisanthrope because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 27 2017 @ 05:54 PM
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I don't understand the use of a physical wall because it is trivial to go over, around, or through it. Constant surveillance would be needed in either case, and would no doubt be more effective than a physical wall. Plus, and I know you don't care about environmental concerns, but what impacts would a physical wall have on local wildlife?



posted on Jan, 27 2017 @ 05:56 PM
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originally posted by: SolAquarius

originally posted by: BuzzyWigs
a reply to: enlightenedservant



It will become a world heritage UNESCO landmark like the pyramids or the great wall of China. Hadrian's wall -- the Berlin wall -- the Isreali wall (cuz yeah, that's working)....all of those actual walls....



You know I keep having this visual in my mind like some sci-fi movie where future archaeologist are standing by the ruins of trumps wall and trying to explain it's purpose and significance. Just like today we talk about the significance of the great wall of china or hadrian's wall.

Nah, I think they'll talk about it the way we talked about "the bridge to nowhere" in Alaska. Or the government's rumored $600 hammer. Or the way we used to use the "miracle mineral" asbestos in hundreds of products. Some things deservedly are ridiculed by future generations.
edit on 27-1-2017 by enlightenedservant because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 27 2017 @ 06:01 PM
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a reply to: LesMisanthrope

you all worry about wasting money contributing to healthcare, education and the arts but no problem spending money on a stupid wall that won't stop the wrong people from getting in. that's not idiotic?



posted on Jan, 27 2017 @ 06:11 PM
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originally posted by: knoxie
a reply to: LesMisanthrope

you all worry about wasting money contributing to healthcare, education and the arts but no problem spending money on a stupid wall that won't stop the wrong people from getting in. that's not idiotic?





Wrong people? Won't the 'right' people be the ones who recognize our laws are for the good of American citizens and being they want to legitimately be an American living the American dream, be those in line to come here via the legal process set forth?

The idea of of a wall is more to slow them down, not an actual deterrent. Oftentimes, though, that process that hinders them, allows our border patrol time to apprehend them.



posted on Jan, 27 2017 @ 06:13 PM
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a reply to: LesMisanthrope

That's a false equivalence and you know it.

A more accurate analogy would be building a wall only in the front of your neighborhood to stop "intruders", yet leaving every other side & port of entry untouched. Then you allow a lot of different people from all over the world into your neighborhood for specific permits, only to do nothing when they violate the terms of those permits. You even have agreements with other neighborhoods to allow their members to come to your neighborhood without any permits whatsoever, yet do nothing when they still violate the terms of the agreement.

Other people in your household & neighborhood hire those same people to do illegal things, purchase illegal things from them, and screw them over financially. But if the ones who are screwed over try to speak up, they're kicked out of your neighborhood. And if the ones who sell goods to your eager neighbors and family members are caught, then you suddenly pretend to have morals and arrest them... unless the sellers happen to be affiliated with your corrupt "neighborhood watch". If so, they get a slap on the wrist and are released so they can continue selling their goods to the happy customers in your neighborhood.

But when people point out how pointless the wall in the front of the neighborhood is, you act like you don't understand the issue.



posted on Jan, 27 2017 @ 06:14 PM
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a reply to: enlightenedservant

Lol traffic sucks and I was using speech text. I should know how to spell it with the amount of money I've spent on science classes lol 😀. I get what you mean, I was just trying to make a point.



posted on Jan, 27 2017 @ 06:17 PM
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a reply to: knoxie




you all worry about wasting money contributing to healthcare, education and the arts but no problem spending money on a stupid wall that won't stop the wrong people from getting in. that's not idiotic?


It's infrastructure. Besides, it recoups the costs of illegal immigration in the long run, as I just stated. Short term pain; long term gain. I wish I could say the same for education and the arts, which are no more than indoctrination and propaganda outlets.
edit on 27-1-2017 by LesMisanthrope because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 27 2017 @ 06:19 PM
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a reply to: avgguy

No worries. Drive safely, though. I don't want to see you in a road rage video on youtube because I was too snippy on ATS lol.



posted on Jan, 27 2017 @ 06:19 PM
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originally posted by: enlightenedservant
a reply to: LesMisanthrope

That's a false equivalence and you know it.

A more accurate analogy would be building a wall only in the front of your neighborhood to stop "intruders", yet leaving every other side & port of entry untouched. Then you allow a lot of different people from all over the world into your neighborhood for specific permits, only to do nothing when they violate the terms of those permits. You even have agreements with other neighborhoods to allow their members to come to your neighborhood without any permits whatsoever, yet do nothing when they still violate the terms of the agreement.

Other people in your household & neighborhood hire those same people to do illegal things, purchase illegal things from them, and screw them over financially. But if the ones who are screwed over try to speak up, they're kicked out of your neighborhood. And if the ones who sell goods to your eager neighbors and family members are caught, then you suddenly pretend to have morals and arrest them... unless the sellers happen to be affiliated with your corrupt "neighborhood watch". If so, they get a slap on the wrist and are released so they can continue selling their goods to the happy customers in your neighborhood.

But when people point out how pointless the wall in the front of the neighborhood is, you act like you don't understand the issue.


It wasn't a false analogy, and perhaps you don't know it because ignorance is ubiquitous. I was talking specifically about the notion that "they'll find another way in".



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