The Unconscious and Autoimmune Diseases

Because the mind emerges upon the movements of the body - or the material realm - what we experience as our consciousness can only be partially studied at a scientific level.

The problem is that consciousness arises within brain dynamics not so much in the "synchrony" of parts - but in the resonance differences between partially coupled systems.

This is the weirdness of the brain. Deep within the forebrain "cortical EEGs" - with the electrode actually on the or within the brain - what we find as the 'signature of consciousness' is whats called 'gamma' wave activity - or electromagnetic oscillations at 40Hz, which means that the electrical signal occurs at 40 cycles (or more) every second as recorded by the EEG.

Yet if you pull farther out, change scale - such as readings from the scalp i.e. a normal EEG - its pretty rare to pick up gamma wave activity (according to Paul Nunez, an expert in neurodynamics and professor of Neuroscience at Tulane) - instead, the signature of consciousness as read from the scalp is alpha and theta wave activities.

This is all very interesting, because the further out you pull, you are essentially dealing with different dynamical fields occurring at different levels of activity. Nunez argues that these higher-level electromagnetic 'rhythms' occurring at and just slightly above the scalp is where consciousness is most likely to arise (thus helping to find the right vantage point to the 'binding problem' of consciousness) - as it is not the 'local' or low-level network dynamics of the 10 billion frontal cortical neurons, nested within one another in a "column" embedded within another column - but the highest level resonance which occurs in the difference between the relations - which is to say, that consciousness is an enormously non-linear product - and so probably unlikely to be reproduced in any artificial form - and thus, of course, only goes to prove how insanely wishful and idealistic this culture of ours is.

Conscious Perception, Symbolization, and the Body

When we have a perception of something, it becomes a part of us. When we construct and re-member, and transform our object-relations into full-blown ideologies - or beliefs about how we think the world works - this is all arising at the highest dynamical level - and indeed, the slowest and last part to emerge - as interacts and makes meaning with the other large-scale emergent creatures the Human lives its life with - other Humans.

This emphasis on Emergence helps us to not lose focus on the continuity, but also to recognize that each level of structure (networks of atoms, networks of molecules, networks of tissues, networks of organs, networks of organisms etc) relates with other elements with it, and in the process, a higher level structure emerges.

We all sense this - that we derive from something 'above' us - and this is true: what is above us is the goodness that helped build our brain - which motivated our choices, and channeled down consciousness into the structure of space, time and matter through the existential challenges of being an individualized organism.

As an earlier thread of mine argued, the ideas we have - the coherency we sense - matters with regard to how our brain actually self organizes. Indeed, the oribitofrontal cortex is mostly built out of neurons which use Gamma amino butryic acid (or GABA) which has an inhibitory effect on pyramidal cells (which excite). This brain behind your eyeball - to me the true third eye - is where conscious regulation of affect is said to occur, as suggested by neurological and developmental studies, as well as fMRI and post-mortem studies which leave no doubt that sensing into your emotions and regulating them - i.e. functioning coherently within your mental space - is processed here.

Furthermore, it also suggests that the actual process of using your consciousness to regulate inappropriate or unjustified affects (as it relates to the realities of others) constitutes a correlation - or matching, between my own state and the Others state, and seeking to 'attune' to the Other to bring about a state of 'shared-intentionality' or, more basically, a feeling of relaxation, peace, and pleasure with the others.

In short, consciousness has REAL effects on matter - specifically the organization and viability of brain matter. If it were possible, an fMRI of Donald j Trump's forebrain, or his OFC, the small part behind his eye - would show a shrunken structure and for good reason: you have to actually exercise that aspect of consciousness to possess the corresponding structure. Yes - indeed, consciousness - or effects at the highest and most abstract level in neurological dynamics - 'feeds back down' into the viability of certain parts of frontal brain structure intrinsically related to regulating of affect. Mind you - again - the fact that this works, and indeed, that brain structure emerges as a function of consciousness, speaks to the very real physical power of this emergent property.

A Devil On Your Palm

Is it possible for the mental to effect the physical? It happens all the time, and its called 'autoimmune diseases'.

Already, we live in a day and age that acknowledges 'stress' on the body, but we really fail to recognize the degree to which the mind can represent its internal dysfunction in the maladies of its body.

The woman who holds in her anger and never speaks up against mistreatment, in a sense, defies her bodies yearning for fecundity - for being reflected, nurtured, and to nurture. The breasts, ovaries and the uterus - both very related cancers - are an expression of fecundity: the place within the biodynamical flowing of the Human where life is nurtured at its various stages in a cyclical life fashion: sex - arousal for the man - is largely stimulated by the breasts and the hip-waist ratio. The breasts 'nurture' desire for the other in the man. Later, in gestation, the males sperm triggers the release of eggs from the ovary (especially if organsm occurs in the female - hence why multiple orgasms exist for them) and the sperm waits outside the egg for one to open up (they do not barge in: the eggs decide which sperm enters) and when it happens, the uterus fosters the being into existence, until it enters the world, and the breasts can once more suckle the living being.

Diseases like this are deeply related - and can be very scientifically established - to the way and manner we relate to one another, and how that affects our object-relations, or how we feel, or "metabolize", the situations we enter in our living.

Indeed, the more conscious you become, the more those conscious parts you cultivate play a part in regulating your dynamical structure. This is where autoimmune diseases and spiritual effects seem to surface, as the person who has made coherent-to-themselves the injustice of prostitution (i.e. an intrinsic despoilation of the feminine principle; a remaking of the female in the shadow of the male i.e. into a sex object, so that she comes to seek, like a person with stockholm syndrome, to be 'desired by the object which objectifies her' i.e. other males.) for example, will experience a shocking autoimmune reaction from his own body - i.e. from his own internalized psychological dynamics, that is, his construction of meaning towards particular objects. An example such as this would materiali

ze if he happens to become "possessed by desire" - a desire which acts upon the "archaic" part of the psyche. In pursuit of this state, he necessarily must dissociate that other self-knowledge lest it interfere with his desire for release and pleasure. Yet, of course, the mind is a system - a physically closed system because the mind emerges from the brain.

There is no "out" for my experiences to be placed - everything that happens to someone is their - and so a strategy like this, or trying to dissociate, can only work if the person is either a) dissociatively blocked off from another state, or b) naively related to his own internal disapproval to what he does.

The above example (happened to a client of mine) can be found elsewhere in the in's and out's of people various infidelities - breakdowns in consistency, where an internal contradiction in states at a mental level, "leaks" into the dynamics of the body - oftentimes in a symbolic way, likely mediated by fractal dynamics.

To disown you conscience is nothing more than an agreement to a "short ride" - whether it be in life, as for Sean Spicer - Trumps press secretary and avid eater and swallower of gum - or, as we see for the Human species, for the viability of life on our planet - an example of a "small creature" i.e. Humans, being able to have fairly large effects on the ecological processes on Earth.

Of course, the higher and larger system will then act back down - and as Lovelock puts it, "the revenge of Gaia" will be upon all of us, but primarily those of us who thought life was only for the aggrandizement of the individual self.

a reply to: Astrocyte

I think some of that is over my head, using jargon I am not familiar with. (heheh..pun not intended but quite appropriate)

But in terms of autoimmunity and consciousness, I think they influence each other greatly.

My youngest son has Alopecia Areata, ever since he was a toddler. He always has large bald spots on his head.
We've been to all kinds of specialists throughout the years, but there is no effective treatment. The most recent findings suggest it is an autoimmune disfunction - in which the body sort of becomes allergic to it's own hair folicles.

He also has had some sort of crisis twice that landed him in the hospital in critical condition, but they could not diagnose the cause. Some sort of autoimmune disfunction was all they could determine.

He happens to also have a problem expressing himself. He gets along with everyone, has an extraordinary wit and humor, is very intelligent (he's the math and physics major), but if he is sad, or mad, he does not express it. He holds it within. We (as a family) are all sure this is related to his autoimmune problems because we watch the correspondance with flairups.

When he found he could express himself through music, as a musician, it made a HUGE difference, which reinforced our perception of the link.

Sorry, but autoimmune disease is not a condition bought on by mental problems.

originally posted by: weirdguy
Sorry, but autoimmune disease is not a condition bought on by mental problems.

Sorry, there is a wide array of study and research which indicates psychological states influence all kinds of health disorders, including autoimmune.
www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov...
Effects of Stress and Psychological Disorders on the Immune System
Autoimmune Disease & Histories of Stress
Mental Illness and Autoimmune Disease
Psychological Profiles in Autoimmune disease
The Emerging Link Between Autoimmune Disorders and Neuropsychiatric Disease

I've always wondered about the mind-body connection deep down and have read about several studies that seem to back it up. In my own case I think there could be some truth to it. Having spent time in a psychiatric hospital back in December 2015 for 'suicide reasons', I know for sure that I actually don't have any of the really serious mental disorders like schizophrenia or psychosis due to being thoroughly analyzed. I have, however, had a panic disorder for many years, which always seemed to tie in with other psychological problems I've had since I was about 7 years old. In my early childhood these problems were fairly benign, but escalated once I got to around 10-13, and worsened when I was diagnosed with hypothyroidism at 15 years old. Albeit a rather mild one, comparatively, I think hypothyroidism is considered an autoimmune disorder in most cases due to the fact that the immune system is the assailant that attacks the tissues of the thyroid gland in the first place, gradually weakening it until it can no longer produce sufficient amounts of thyroxine.

In summary, it makes me wonder if traumatic childhood experiences that caused psychological disturbances could ultimately lead to physical disturbances.

a reply to: Astrocyte

The OP is interesting. I think there could be a link between bad thoughts and autoimmune diseases.

The brain is a crazy thing. When I was in college I spent time studying artificial intelligence. I was thinking if there could be a thought a person could have that would lock the brain up. The most hurtful thought I found was asking the question, "Have you ever thought about what your brain is doing between thoughts?" Many people laugh at this thought which I believe is the brain's defense mechanism against locking up.

I eventually heard the idea of "thought virus". The idea of a "thought virus" is a thought virus. After reading your post I was thinking of a thought virus that would attack the brain's unconsciousness thoughts. I kind of think the idea exists but I haven't yet been able to verbalize it.

A lot of what you are talking about I found described in a book I read that was depth psychology and specifically a particular psychology of types. It talks about self-destructive behavior and how it relates to the mind:

www.amazon.com...

Kind of pop psychology but a very good read for changing the way you think about your mind's own self-image.

a reply to: Astrocyte
Thanks for the info, I will have to mentally digest it all first....
I would be interested to hear your take on the effects of external EMR that we are exposed to in a greater and greater magnitude.
I.e. 50/60 Hz AC power, radio and microwaves from electronic devices/wifi/stray electromagnetic fields.

Cheers

a reply to: dfnj2015
Your idea of a thought virus could be like ( or be precipitated) by a word virus?
The following is a zombie type movie along those lines.

originally posted by: Astrocyte
Later, in gestation, the males sperm triggers the release of eggs from the ovary (especially if organsm occurs in the female - hence why multiple orgasms exist for them) and the sperm waits outside the egg for one to open up (they do not barge in: the eggs decide which sperm enters) and when it happens, the uterus fosters the being into existence, until it enters the world, and the breasts can once more suckle the living being.

Very interesting, and I believe it has some validity, but this part about how ovulation works is flat out wrong - unless this is some new science I've not yet heard of.

I didn't think the OP was too bad until I saw the part about Trump having a shrunken forebrain. He has a big head, not a shrunken forebrain.

I guess the OP just wants to give us a personal example of how belief distorts your perception with the Trump example.

Trump is trump. Remember in cards, Trump is the wild card and can be used to replace a lot of other cards. He is living up to his namesake.

originally posted by: weirdguy
Sorry, but autoimmune disease is not a condition bought on by mental problems.

I agree 100% at one time even type 1 and 2 diabetes was labeled as mental problems.
Autoimmune disease is part genetics and part toxic exposure.

I have the autoimmune disease Sarcoidosis and its genetic predisposition is seen in people from a few parts of the world.

Its also a occupational disease in even higher numbers due to toxic exposure of those from areas with a genetic predisposition as seen in the higher then normal numbers among firefighters and emergency first responders.(i was a firefighter and emergency first responder)
www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov...

I also have fibromyalgia due to the sarcoidosis and fibro was long labeled a condition bought on by mental problems(depression) because there is no lab test for fibro to prove its there.
Now research has found many of us have a known disease know as autoimmune small fiber polyneuropathy/neurosarcoidosis.
and there is lab test that proves its real disease.

a reply to: Astrocyte


This is an excellent thread though clearly this is not a political forum.

In relation to Alzheimer death occurs when the disease interferers with the Autonomic Nervous System which regulates all the organs in our body.

So yes how one relates to the environment has an effect upon health due to how conscious factors affect unconscious ones.

The ANS is an unconscious function of the brain in general.

a reply to: Astrocyte


One way of looking at it is that when you post at this forum you can take a vacation from politics.

Perhaps you would like to discuss the relationship between neural connections and how they are translated with respect to the matter form and from the perspective of matters wave state?