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When do you give up?

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posted on Jan, 29 2005 @ 02:59 AM
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Question for y'all. I want a large perspective of ideas,so I posed this question to many people with vastly different opinions, and posted it on ATS as well. Sorry about the formatting, but it was an email origianlly. I would really like to hear back from y'all.

When is it acceptable to walk away?

I was just in a situation where I was presented with an opinion, then
asked to justify my own. As I tried, the people kept interrupting me
and wouldn't let me continue or explain anything, it was an
interruption lecture. They'd pause, then as soon as I'd open my mouth,
interrupt me and explain their opinion in yet another way. Finally, I
told them when they're ready to hear what I have to say, I'll talk
with them, in the mean time, enjoy my parent's house, I'll be
upstairs.

So my question to y'all is this: When is it acceptable to walk away
from a conversation/friendship/relationship? What, in your world,
constitutes the point where you just plain give up? I mean, to quote
Third Day:

I hate to be, to be the one
Who's given up
And feels that all our hope is gone
But what I thought was a miracle
Just turned into the same old
Problem that it was

When, in your minds, is that mentality acceptable to have?

Personally, I am one who never gives up on people. I'm focused on
other people's happiness, and to give up on them would be to give up
on their happiness. Yet, I'm coming to suspect this is a very
unhealthy mentality. So, is it, and if so, when do you give up on
people?

I'm in a transitory personality mode right now, who I am hasn't worked for me or to serve God. Many things need to change, and this may be one of
them. Thank you very much for you consideration and time, I am looking forward to hearing what y'all have to say.

Thank you very much,
Jake




posted on Jan, 29 2005 @ 03:01 AM
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Can't you just agree to disagree? Is it such a big issue that you have to terminate a friendship/relationship over it?



posted on Jan, 29 2005 @ 04:00 AM
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This seems to be a very touching topic to me. Judging your wording, you seem to be similar to me. I am very much a 'people pleaser' - if you will. I always try to give people benefit of doubt and have a very open mind. It seems to me ever more so that a majority of people are prone to just pleasing themselves and don't care to listen to anything other than what their agenda is. They are not open to criticism or debate but only to make you agree to what they think, whether or not it is beneficial or not. I see this every day.

Really, it is up to you to decide when to give up on other people. No one can say when to do this, but I think you will come to the conclusion that most people will reject sound judgment and feed you nonsense. Statistically, I have found that 25% of the people I know have any common sense; the rest are foolish in some way. Of course, this is my objective opinion, but this is how I see it. I think the main thing you need to learn, which I still struggle with is that you will never be able to convince anyone of anything or control anyone, so be content that you may be more wise than another and it is their loss if they choose to keep being stupid. I think you need to learn that perhaps you were not destined to make a big impact on your peers/associations in life. It is frustrating, I know. If you can impact one person - changing their mind towards what is correct - then you have accomplished more than arguing with a group of closed minded idiots.



posted on Jan, 29 2005 @ 04:14 AM
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I give my opinions and answer questions. Then its up to them. If they accept what I say, fine. If not, thats their choice.
Then we go for drink.



posted on Jan, 29 2005 @ 04:27 AM
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Originally posted by Pisky
Then we go for drink.


.............and hey! I am all for that Pisk!:w:


XL5

posted on Jan, 29 2005 @ 05:48 AM
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When that happens, try to come up with a word thats totally unrelated and silly, if that don't stop em then try a fart. Confuse them, people pause when you confuse them.



posted on Jan, 29 2005 @ 06:52 AM
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I think that you've got three questions in there but the answer is the same for each one, just at a different magnitude.

It's pretty much acceptable to walk away from a conversation when you did, in fact I usually do it a lot earlier. Sometimes you get more attention by being silent.

From friends - I give people the benefit of the doubt, I have a core of about 8 or 9 friends who will never hurt me and will always look out for me, so they don't come into the equation. For other people, I walk away if it's obvious that they're making a significantly lesser effort than I am. This is pretty easy for me 'cos I have my main group anyway, and to be honest I don't really need any more good friends. I pretty much mirror the effort that the other person puts in.

From relationships - I'm not sure that I can really answer this question as I've never had to do it. i may have to soon, but it won't be because of lack of effort from either of us, just a pretty impossible situation. If you have to walk away from the relationship it's gotta be because you don't love them or they don't love you (and you can tell by how much they're puuting in).

Those are my two euro-cents except for one last word - in the first two cases I always leave it open for them to come back.



posted on Jan, 29 2005 @ 08:02 AM
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Walking away, and whether you stay friends or not, is up to you and your own set of standards that you live your life by. I have friends that are of other religions and friends that do not in anyway believe in anything "I" believe strongly in...the only type of person I will not tolerate to be friends or friendly with, are those that have no compassion for innocents....animals and children, I believe that if a person doesn't like animals, there is some type of deep flaw within hte character of that person. I will not subject myself to those types of sub humans....you have to figure where you draw the line for your tolerances.....a difference of opinion is not a bad thing


[edit on 1/29/2005 by LadyV]



posted on Jan, 29 2005 @ 08:24 AM
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When do I stop and give up? Heh, well, the first scenario is when i'd rather stop arguing and would prefer to just kiss the damn girl, but thats one in... 6.5 billion or so.

I stop when teh debate no longer becomes healthy. I rarely find that a very heated argument will get either side to ever change, but its almost always healthy for each group to have that argument. Debating is truly very healthy. However, when it gets prolonged and absurd, and they refuse to aknowledge anything you say, then its time to pack it away.

This happened recently with a few friends. They staunchly believe in ghosts. Okay. I staunchly dont. Okay. The three of us had at for a while, but they eventually just devolved to saying i was wrong. (also, theyre teenage girls) Then i stood down, because it just wasn't worth it.



posted on Jan, 29 2005 @ 11:47 AM
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The best thing I ever learned from my parents: Choose your battles. Your not going to win everyone, so choose carefully.

When your brought to the point of anger, due to lack of intellegent conversation, tell em so, then walk. Thats what I do. Plus if it gets really bad, the mods usually step in, to cool things off a bit...

www.belowtopsecret.com...'

heres a good example of ignorance explemplified....



posted on Jan, 29 2005 @ 12:32 PM
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That's a lot to respond to after throwing that all of y'all's way at 2:30 in the morning (here in the Midwest).

djohnsto77, no, because they wouldn't let me even state where I'm coming from. But it goes far beyond that, this is a recuring thing where it seems my opinion and thoughts are totally disrespected, and the individuals involved have all the answers and don't need to know where I'm coming from. Sadly, this is the case in many of the intrapersonal relationships I have because I don't get angry, or shout over them, typically. I just shut up with a small smile on my face and let them preach, when they're done I try again.

ben91069, You seem to have a pretty good idea where I'm coming from. However, I wouldn't say that 25% of the people have common sense. I would say people display common sense 25% of the time. I have lucid periods where I know it all and don't care where anyone else is coming from as I'm sure we all have. People on average, though, seem to display this lack of common sense a lot more often that most people here at ATS do.

Pisky, my biggest contention with last night was that I couldn't give my opinion. Every time I would try I'd get steamrolled. That's why I finally gave up and walked away from the conversation. That was one instance, though, but this is a recurring problem in my life which is why I've posed it as it is. There's something I'm doing wrong in my relationships with friends and deeper relationships.

XL5 I know, that does work quite well, but in the heat of the moment it doesn't always occur to me to do so. I do like that debate tactic when someone's not listening, though. Bizzare, that is. I don't like to fart or be rude in public


jeepers_ie, I have the problem in all three of those categories, and would like to address the relationship one, though that wasn't the relationship I had with the people last night, they were family. What if you love someone, but know that the relationship is just wrong and you're bringing eachother down? I've been in one of those for a while now and am trying to walk away, but she won't let me. I still really care for her, but every time I walk away, she does something to bring be back in. Ergh.

LadyV, it wasn't a difference of opinion that bothered me. It was the fact that they didn't give a krump about my opinion. I wasn't able to really share it, and when I did get it out, you may have noticed in conversations I state an extreme opinion, then justify and rectify it. This is mainly due to people shutting me out and steamrolling over my words; when it's really extreme, they want to know how the heck I could believe something like that. Difference of opinion is fantastic. I am in the minority here at ATS in most of my opinions. If I didn't like the difference, I'd be on some religious right wing discussion board, not a generally liberal conspiracy board (If you believe that to be false, take that up with me on another thread or via U2U, as it's way off topic and will spur a very long discussion).

Amorymeltzer, for the most part, all of my friends and most of my family believes the exact opposite I do. I have a few like minded friends, but I love to debate, and my closest friends are the ones where we have some fantastic conversations. As I'd said in another thread the other day, I know I'm probably not going to convince them they're wrong. The major reason I do so is to show that my opinion is valid as well, and based on information I've gathered, not just pulled outta my rear. The friends I have who are the same way I respect greatly, though I think they're dead wrong in their opinion and they respect me. However, if I can't explain where I'm coming from, how can they know that it's an educated opinion instead of following what mommy and daddy told me when I was growing up?

As for teenage girls, I won't even bother going there with my cousins that age, and it stands the same with the teen boys, though the girls are usually a lot more liberal and hate, yes hate, where I am coming from without knowing why. Really no point, I'll wait for them to get a little bit older.

spliff4020, choosing your battles in core to life; it gives weight to those battles you do fight. Thankfully, my "angry" response is to typically shut up. Another important lesson my parents ingrained into me was if you can't say something good don't say anything at all. When the conversation turns to insults and I'm ready to start on that path, too, I usually catch myself and clam up. In text, I tend to not do this so much, but with words, you can't review them after you say them and decide if you're going to modify them or let it fly. As a result, I don't speak fearing passion will cause me to say something I'll regret after the fact. That's also why I can pour my heart out to someone in an email and then not give them any window into my life in person (I need to talk to my pastor about this, because he's one of the people I do that with and I can tell he's really confused by it. He is, by the way, an extreme extrovert and I'm an extreme introvert, too.)

Whew, I think I addressed everyone. Thanks for taking the time to reply to this, all of your feedback is really appreciated. This is a question I've been pondering for many years, and the combonation of alcohol and anger last night finally got me to outsource the question to y'all. Like I said, introvert



posted on Jan, 29 2005 @ 12:39 PM
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I should point out that this is a little more deep seeded than that conversation last night. I think the real reason this is so forward in my mind is because of that relationship I mentioned earlier. One conversation with an aunt and uncle whom I know are going to do that is not going to bring a question like this up. So no, it wasn't that important of an issue that I would walk away.



posted on Jan, 29 2005 @ 01:07 PM
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I think that if your right to your own opinion or beliefs is not being respected, it is perfectly acceptable to end the conversation. I think that by being the one to walk away, and not treating them with the same lack of respect they are showing you, you are showing your maturity.

If I'm in that situation what I will often do is say, quite forcefully and somewhat loudly, ‘Ralph (usually who I say this too), you are not listening to what I'm saying.' Usually this works, without being overly offensive.

Just remember, we teach people how to treat us, and you should refuse to allow people to disrespect you. Not by disrespecting them, but by being the better person, and setting an example, even if this means walking away. Family is slightly different, because often what they say hurts more. I make some allowances for mine, but will not allow them to trample on my beliefs either. We usually end up agreeing to disagree and talk about something else.



posted on Jan, 29 2005 @ 01:17 PM
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It's time to walk away when the conversation is no longer a conversation. When the other person is doing all the talking and none of the listening. Sometimes you don't even need to walk away--I sometimes simplify remove myself mentallly


It's time to walk away from friendships when the friendship is all one way. I recently completely cut off a friend. It was always meet on her schedule. The final straw was when I found she had spoken behind my back, all the time being a friend to my face.

Relationships. wow, man, that IS hard. If it is a deep and long-term relationship, I will go the distance, do what I must to keep the relationship alive.
If it is meant to end, I think somewhere deep inside, I will know. So, it is important to not be blind to your inner voice. If you know what I mean.


BTW, JJ, good to see you around posting on ATS again



posted on Jan, 29 2005 @ 01:25 PM
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If you don't forgive someone there's nothing for them to learn from. I believe any person can change whether it be they need a 3rd 4th or 5th chance.



posted on Jan, 29 2005 @ 01:31 PM
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Originally posted by junglejake
I'm focused on other people's happiness, and to give up on them would be to give up on their happiness. Yet, I'm coming to suspect this is a very unhealthy mentality. So, is it, and if so, when do you give up on people?


It is good to worry about other people's feelings, but it becomes unhealthy when you put their feelings above your emotional needs. When you get to the point where you start to doubt yourself and your self-worth, due to put-downs, insults to your intelligence or find yourself making excuses not to see that person because you dread listening to them, it is past time to end it. There is such a thing as a toxic relationship.

If they don't respect your beliefs and opinions, and your right to them, then don't subject yourself to it anymore.



posted on Jan, 29 2005 @ 01:44 PM
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Originally posted by Aether
If you don't forgive someone there's nothing for them to learn from. I believe any person can change whether it be they need a 3rd 4th or 5th chance.

Sometimes, it's not about forgiveness. I know people who I just had to walk away from. I had to remove all emotion in relation to these people. I can't like them or dislike, more like they don't exist. They didn't necessarily do ANYthing to me directly, so nothing to forgive. You just have to leave evil people alone.



posted on Jan, 29 2005 @ 02:06 PM
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Originally posted by DontTreadOnMe
Sometimes, it's not about forgiveness. I know people who I just had to walk away from.


Sometimes, for your own sake, you have to walk away. Someone really smart once asked me 'If your head was being crushed in a vice, would you ask for asprin, or would you simply remove your head?'. Some people only feel better when they make others feel worse, there is nothing wrong with valuing yourself enough not to allow it.

Of course, before you walk away, you must make it clear exactly why you are doing so. That way if they do change their ways, they know it was their behaviour you couldn't handle, not them.



posted on Jan, 31 2005 @ 04:52 PM
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Well, re. relationships, man all I can tell you is that my ex finally walked away from me, I was struggling with completely letting go. Anyway, she told me that she'd always have a place in her heart for me and that she wished me well but that she never even wanted to hear from me again. It worked - I've let go. I don't know how she is but I hope she's good. I guess that works for some people but not others. You might try it...



posted on Jan, 31 2005 @ 04:59 PM
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When do you give up? When the current negative out-weights any possible future positive. I use to hang on to things past their time and looking back on it, I wish I had just walked away every single time. Perhaps not the happy, hopeful response that some members are giving, but that is my honest opinion.



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