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Viewing the world without bias and ego

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posted on Jan, 12 2017 @ 06:08 AM
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Something many people seem to take for granted is where they were born, the reality is you could have been born anywhere, and your nation isn't necessarily the "best" or most righteous. That's not to say there's no place for patriotism, there's nothing wrong with having pride in your heritage, but you shouldn't let it blind you or stop you from empathizing with people who are different from you. We are all human at the end of the day, our parents don't define who we are, the nation we were born into doesn't define us, the type of person we choose to be is what defines us.

There's an old saying, I cannot recall exactly what it is, but it goes something like: we are always the hero of our own story. Don't assume the religion you grew up with is the right one, don't assume your government is always on the right side of world events, don't generalize people in an entire nation because the guy on the news constantly tells you they are your enemy. Of course what I'm leading towards here is the ramping up of anti-Russian rhetoric by the establishment MSM mouthpieces. We recently just learned that the widely reported news of Russia having dirt on Trump seems to be a story created by some guys on the internet.

I'm sure people in Russia must distrust the U.S. government just as much, if not more than the U.S. distrusts them, but we don't often take the time to think about what it would be like to be in the other persons shoes do we? Let us recall that Russia was virtually the only nation willing to offer safe harbor for Snowden, saying that they support people who fight for human rights. On the other hand, Bradley Manning exposed what were essentially war crimes and he has been locked up by the U.S. and being treated extremely poorly. Likewise, Assange has been confined to a small embassy for many years because western forces want to lock him up.

Let us also remember Russia is one of the only nations offering real support in the Middle East to help fight against terrorists, whereas the U.S. has been providing weapons and funding to "moderate rebels" who are provably linked to terrorist groups. It's documented that thousands of rebel fighters have defected to these terrorist groups and provide them with weapons. It should be hard for you to see how the U.S. is the good guy in this situation unless you're completely deluded. I personally don't like Trump very much, and he may not have the best way of wording things, but if there's one thing he's right about it's not treating Russia as a default enemy.

It doesn't make him a puppet for Russia anymore than you're a puppet of your friends because you have a mutual respect for each other. It's called having rationality and understanding, seeing people as humans instead of some stereotype concocted by pundits who cannot possibly fathom the idea they are sad little trolls who don't have any friends because they don't know how to get along with other people. And yes I am slightly drunk as I write this, but that doesn't invalidate my point. I wish we could just stop this "us vs them" crap already... stop with the political agendas, let me assure you your threads are obvious to spot... you know who you are.

EDIT: also I want to point out that the Russian government is far from perfect, there are plenty of reasons to distrust them. Once again it's about having a realistic and balanced perspective on the world. Don't play favorites, see things for what they are and you will truly begin to understand how the game is played. Trump is a billionaire with a sketchy history and shouldn't be portrayed as the savior of humanity, but he also isn't the worst thing to ever happen to the U.S., we must try to understand that this path is for the best, and will lead us towards a better future than the alternative path would have taken us, of that we can be certain.
edit on 12/1/2017 by ChaoticOrder because: (no reason given)




posted on Jan, 12 2017 @ 06:16 AM
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This should be in the rant forum instead of polluting the philosophy board.
It reminds me how crappie the philosophy forum really is on ATS.



posted on Jan, 12 2017 @ 06:26 AM
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a reply to: grainofsand

Well I did consider placing it in a different forum but actually this is quite a philosophical topic about the human condition and how we view the world. Admittedly it did drift a bit into a political rant, I guess it'll be up the mods, honestly I don't really care and I don't know why you would care so much considering there are countless threads containing much less substance posted on a daily basis. You are free to view this thread as "pollution", but I'm sure many others will appreciate the points I'm trying to make
edit on 12/1/2017 by ChaoticOrder because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 12 2017 @ 06:31 AM
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a reply to: ChaoticOrder

Oh agreed, the philosophy forum is embarrassingly poor on ATS.
Your political rant just reinforced what I already thought.



posted on Jan, 12 2017 @ 06:55 AM
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a reply to: grainofsand

en.wikipedia.org...


Philosophy (from Greek φιλοσοφία, philosophia, literally "love of wisdom"[1][2][3][4]) is the study of general and fundamental problems concerning matters such as existence, knowledge, values, reason, mind, and language


existence,
knowledge,
values,
reason,
mind,
language (or the use of propaganda)

Sounds like the right forum for me



posted on Jan, 12 2017 @ 06:59 AM
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a reply to: TheConstruKctionofLight

I have access to wiki as well thanks



posted on Jan, 12 2017 @ 07:02 AM
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I often feel and think what your saying.

If I could be so cheeky as to distill it further with what I believe is a Navajo saying "Never judge a man till youve walked a mile in his moccasins"

Am I on the same page?

Despite the political lean I felt the philosophy



posted on Jan, 12 2017 @ 07:04 AM
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a reply to: IkNOwSTuff

Haha that's a great saying, definitely on the same page.



posted on Jan, 12 2017 @ 07:27 AM
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a reply to: ChaoticOrder

So what is your main philosophical point in this thread then?
Don't be a blind patriot?
Give Trump a chance?

Your title doesn't equate to the ramblings in your OP to me, but I'm sure your Trump fans will disagree lol



posted on Jan, 12 2017 @ 07:28 AM
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a reply to: grainofsand

OK well how about rising the tone by a more philosophical quote?


I believe that we should try to rise above our biases by relentlessly pursuing truth. It does mean that when we review our actions we may even be wrong but we should strive to confess to ourselves and other in a quiet way. Behind the bluster of politics all I really want is a fair society. Where effort generates reward.


edit on 12-1-2017 by Tiger5 because: addition



posted on Jan, 12 2017 @ 07:33 AM
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a reply to: Tiger5

Yep I'd agree with that.
Hardly a difficult concept really, common sense for cohesive communities as far as I see it.



posted on Jan, 12 2017 @ 07:48 AM
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originally posted by: grainofsand
a reply to: ChaoticOrder

So what is your main philosophical point in this thread then?

Well if you're such a connoisseur of philosophy you should be able to figure out the underlying points I'm making. Although I guess the main point I'm trying to make is that we need to be realists in how we view the world, and understand that the people on the other "side" are often facing all the exact same problems, we just need to have a bit of empathy and we will realize that fact.
edit on 12/1/2017 by ChaoticOrder because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 12 2017 @ 07:51 AM
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originally posted by: ChaoticOrder

originally posted by: grainofsand
a reply to: ChaoticOrder

So what is your main philosophical point in this thread then?

Well if you're such a connoisseur of philosophy you should be able to figure out the underlying points I'm making. Although I guess the main point I'm trying to make is that we need to be realists in how we view the world, and understand that the people on the other "side" are often facing all the exact same problems, we just need to have a bit of empathy and we will realize that fact.



And therein lies the philosophy! Is there one reality or multiple ones? Yes we are in a similar set of circumstances. The Super rich do not have the basic survival problems but they can also loose their wealth as have the middle classes.



posted on Jan, 12 2017 @ 07:57 AM
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a reply to: ChaoticOrder

The saying to clean up your own back yard first comes to mind for me when thinking about judging our neighbors .Also because of culture and being less fortunate always plays a factor to consider . But actually meeting the people on the ground in their environment can give you the best hands on data . Dick Chaney commenting about the Middle east was responding to a question as to why the US didn't go further . He used the word quagmire ...well guess what ...its a quagmire over there with the differing groups withing groups . Call it a family feud or even disagreements we can have with our neighbors here at home and you get the picture .

As individual nations paddling our own canoes ,we enter waters outside our territory .We shouldn't sneak in or covertly try to destroy them .We should respect them and if they point to the door we should exit .Its a common courtesy to do so .But in life there are actors too big for their own home and need many others . Unfortunately those actors know how to subdue nations and destroy them . Their biggest asset is us people . They not only need our blessings ,they need our kids to fight their wars .

Our nations future survival depends on our kids .Sending them to war can only damage them in ways unimaginable (think ptsd ) One of the strategies of war is not to kill the other guy but to injure them . It then takes more people to tend to them . Well guess what , when they come home psychologically damaged it takes a community .

By now it would seem that there is a paradigm shift happening .The old guard (MSM/Fake News ) has been exposed .They took a heavy punch with the wiki leaks and that put them on their heels .They should of went to the ropes to buy some time to recover instead they continued swinging . Their timing is off their balance wobbly and they are having trouble seeing straight . This is good news but we should not drop our guard or change our plan . Keep jabbing and look to throw those hooks . This is not going to be a one punch knockout fight . Think like Ali and float like the butterfly and sting like a bee .



posted on Jan, 12 2017 @ 07:59 AM
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a reply to: ChaoticOrder

So just a general sweeping statement about being realists when perceiving the world, recognising everyone has problems, and championing empathy?

Okay, I agree.
Hardly a recipe for a philosophical debate though.
Just standard musings of anyone who wants a caring society.



posted on Jan, 12 2017 @ 08:06 AM
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Personally, I don't believe in the possibility of viewing the world without bias and ego, at least to some extent.

Gosh, i just had to explain this to a friend yesterday, and it made no sense to her. But she has never been out of this country, and her interactions with foreigners have been severely limited.

I'm in a class preparing for a career in which we must interact with people from all cultures, and though there are five of us from different countries there (US, Britain, China, Russia, Spain) I have been hesitant to make my suggestion that we have a day of presentations where we expose our particular culture to the class, for help in dealing with clients in the future. Because I know that even discussing very different values, ethics, morals, and world views tends to put so many people into a defensive mode! I don't know if most of the class can handle it.

I doubt we are capable of seeing the real objective world. I can observe myself observing and describe what I see,
I can listen to what others observe and do my best to grasp their perception,
but the "objective truth" is something I simply have let go of, as being attainable.

It sounds like a very insecure position, but it also opens the world to just an unending discovery of "more views" in each person I meet!

Now, on the question of Russia and US relations-
I didn't grow up with the Cold War fears, I started off with hippy parents rebelling against their parents, and sure that other countries must be better than ours and probably much more positive than popular media portrays. I did n't have any negative bias towards Russia.

I've gotten to know a few Russians, and I still think they are a very interesting people, no better or worse than ourselves, but definately different in some ways. But one thing they made clear to me is that they do not see themselves as our buddies, and do not aspire to be. (speaking of relations between our countries, not individuals).

They do see us a rivals, and it is deeply ingrained, and from their point of view, there is a lot to critisize us for and more than enough reason to want to see us fall as a world power.

The animosity runs deep and long, it isn't just a myth. I am not into trying to fear monger- and don't intend to encourage unecessary hostility... but I also don't want to encourage naive illusions either. There's no rainbow farting unicorns, nor Russians dying to be our BFF. (as soothing as that would be to believe)


But then that there is just what I have been able to perceive, based on my experiences with others. All we can do is hope to listen to as many people as we can and see if there are general trends..
edit on 12-1-2017 by Bluesma because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 12 2017 @ 08:10 AM
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a reply to: grainofsand

Yes I'm hardly presenting any ground breaking philosophical topics, what I'm saying has been said many times before, and yet when you look at current events it's very clear that many people are totally caught up in their own little world. The main reason I made this thread is due to current world events, we are being hit hard with anti-Russian nonsense and I'm getting very tired of it. Some times we just need to be reminded that we are all human beings trying to live our life, and creating these bogey man figures is not healthy for society, we should be trying to get along with other nations instead of this tribal warfare nonsense.
edit on 12/1/2017 by ChaoticOrder because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 12 2017 @ 08:13 AM
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a reply to: Bluesma


but the "objective truth" is something I simply have let go of, as being attainable.

Well in a way that's what I'm saying. There is no "good" and "bad" guy, there is only one guy and another guy, each with their own downfalls. Instead of always assuming we are on the right side of things, we need to be more critical and be aware that we are often the bad guy from the perspective of some one else. Yeah now the philosophy is flowing chaps. Lmao.



posted on Jan, 12 2017 @ 08:15 AM
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a reply to: ChaoticOrder

Oh okay, I agree.

Yeah philosophy rocks on ATS lol



posted on Jan, 12 2017 @ 08:36 AM
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a reply to: Bluesma


But one thing they made clear to me is that they do not see themselves as our buddies, and do not aspire to be. (speaking of relations between our countries, not individuals).

They do see us a rivals, and it is deeply ingrained, and from their point of view, there is a lot to critisize us for and more than enough reason to want to see us fall as a world power.

I don't doubt what you say, it's the same type of ingrained disposition the U.S. population has against Russia. However we must realize that much of the hatred is artificial and a result of propaganda, and not all Russians feel the way you describe. There is always a large number of people who don't play into the hate game, on both sides. I couldn't write a thread like this without being that sort of neutral person. I know of many awesome Russian people and I judge them as individuals.

We must also remember that the government isn't the same thing as the people. I would argue a large number of U.S. citizens don't trust their government and the same thing would apply to Russians. A lot of the time the hatred is directed towards our governments, not the actual people of the nation. And again if we try to see it from the perspective of Russia, they have many reasons not to like the U.S., and vice versa. Hatred doesn't usually just spring out of thin air, something causes it.



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