God creates us and loves us but if you're gay you go to hell?

a reply to: TAECOLE7

No, no no.

Spoken like a truly ignorant person who believes the words of a dusty old book over common sense and reality.

Trust me, I used to think like you. I ended up dead because of it. FORTUNATELY for me, there were some very determined nurses who saved me (resuscitation), then gave me the telling off of my life. (I was 17 at the time)

It's only when a gay person learns to accept themselves for who they are that they become at peace with their self.

The hypocrisy people of who think like you: You're not perfect either. But you would have yourself believe you are more perfect than me.

And that is sickening.

originally posted by: AugustusMasonicus

originally posted by: EveryUsernameWasTaken
People who do believe in God know that having intercourse with the opposite gender is going against nature.

I believe in God and do not care who you bone.

Yeah , other folks' "sins" do not concern me. Leave that up to the Ministers. I am having a "whale of a time" keeping up with myself. Dont give a rat's rear what anyone else does as long as they are not hurting me or mine...

originally posted by: DBCowboy
a reply to: auto3000

Can we give this man a #ing medal or something??


My only thing with the OP is this:

-Be true to yourself, but know thyself first.


Everyone is different, each path unique.

originally posted by: RiptKeys
a reply to: BuzzyWigs

Did you miss the part that said being Gay was a punishment? Which means you cannot be born with it. Your whole post is dead just based off that.

Wow. Just - so much wtf and nope.

So - this person was born and gay, but being gay (like equals being "brown", or having "blue eyes" or being "deformed" or "deaf" or whatever!) is a punishment because they already sucked before they ever got here? That is hindu "untouchables" thinking indeed.

People are "born with it (the Gay)" - whether you want to believe that or not. My whole post is accurate just based off that.

I'm just adding this for the gay folks in the thread just to reinforce that truly there is nothing wrong with being gay:

pdxscholar.library.pdx.edu...

www.sciencedaily.com...

medicalxpress.com...

There's many more studies out there so I'd encourage you to learn more if you are interested but here's the gist:
Homosexuality in mammals increases in relation to population density. As much as heterosexuality is a biological imperative to keep the species alive, homosexuality acts as a way to curb population growth. They are both completely natural and healthy expressions of human and mammalian sexuality. Don't ever buy in to you being wrong for your feelings or that you should act a certain way because of who you are. Do no harm and help those around you and you're every bit the person every other good person is, no sin in being who you are needed.

Side note, the first paper was written in the early 70's with data from the 60's, you'll have to forgive some of the lingo as it was a new frontier.

originally posted by: RiptKeys
a reply to: BuzzyWigs

Did you miss the part that said being Gay was a punishment? Which means you cannot be born with it. Your whole post is dead just based off that.

Sorry Buzzy, but I gotta address this one too....

Punishment for what?

Is God some sort of psychopath who plays cosmic lotto, randomly picking people to make miserable?

During my entire childhood both myself and my family lived piously, following the teachings of the bible, going to church often more than once a week, we said our prayers, confessed our sins, practised our acts of contrition, donated money to the Church which used it to help the poor etc etc. I even wanted (like REALLY wanted) to become a priest.

When it comes to sex, we were kept as ignorant as you can imagine. My mother had a real thing about shielding us from having any knowledge whatsoever. I did not even know what gay was until it happened to me.

So if I were following the rules, why did I get punished? Why didn't you?

a reply to: markosity1973

Religion makes people stupid...

thats really all you need to know

originally posted by: Akragon
a reply to: markosity1973

Religion makes people stupid...

thats really all you need to know

God has spoken!!


wait...

no one is punished for their nature or their attractions. We are punished for our ACTIONS....and in the bible it explicitly places the lions share of onus on our actions, not our temptations. Yes, thoughts are important....motive and intent are super important......but dont let anyone tell you that lusting after a women, or a man, is anywhere even close to the same ball park as actually doing something WITH them or to them.


being gay is no worse or better than being hetero if the desire is not manifested into action. Traditional, non biblical christianity has almost always given a free pass to heterosexual adultery but not homosexual adultery. Its completely illogical and non biblical. Yes, in the OT there absolutely WAS a difference in how the two were handled. Homosexual acts were punishable by death. Usually, but not always, heterosexual adultery was not punishable by death, as there were sometimes other options to "make it right". But rest assured, plenty of ppl were stoned to death for committing heterosexual adultery as well. Thankfully we live in the New Testament era and are not subject to the laws of moses on those issues. We are under grace. This obviously isnt a blanket, carte blanche, catholic style indulgence that we can use anytime we want......but we are far better off under the current dispensation than the one of Moses and ancient Israel.

"where sin did abound Grace did much more abound"


something else thats really important here is....there is no eternal hell....so God will not punish gays or anyone else in eternal hellfire and damnation.

a reply to: markosity1973

Taking religion out of it...you're still not born gay. There just isn't any credible evidence.

When the LGBT community paid for their own study in 2013-2014, they thought they came up with the "gay gene" to prove it.

The study identified two genetic regions – Xq28 an 8q12 – which seemed to be correlated to homosexuality in men.

But then in the same study, they found that heterosexual men had these genes as well. The lead scientist even discredits himself by saying...

but said the study also did not identify a single gene which was the direct cause of homosexuality.

Everything after that is said means absolutely nothing. It discredits the whole study which you can find here with all the other nonsense.
PinkNews

Then, last year, the actual smart people came out and told the truth.

The 144-page paper was written by Dr. Lawrence S. Mayer, an epidemiologist and biostatistician also trained in psychiatry, who is currently a scholar in residence at the Department of Psychiatry at Johns Hopkins School of Medicine, and Dr. Paul R. McHugh, a renowned psychiatrist, researcher, and educator and former chief of psychiatry at Johns Hopkins Hospital. The paper’s three parts focus on sexual orientation, links between sexuality and mental health, and gender identity.

Wow! 2 world renowned PhD's from Johns Hopkins? Amazing.

There are biological factors associated with sexual behavior, the paper acknowledges, but there are no compelling “causal biological explanations for human sexual orientation.” Differences in the brain structures of gay and straight individuals identified by researchers are not necessarily innate and may be the result of environmental or psychological factors.

You can read the rest here, or any other credible source you can find because EVERY media outlet covered it.
RT

In conclusion, whether it's religion or science, there is no proof you're born gay.

a reply to: RiptKeys

Taking religion out of it...you're still not born gay. There just isn't any credible evidence.

Yes, there is.

Please join the 21st century.
People are born "gay." You refusing to believe it doesn't make it false.

a reply to: auto3000

According to the Bible, no one goes to hell for what they do, they go because they don't care about what they do. I have done things that I am sorry for. I should be damned for what I have done. BUT I have told God I am sorry and I have asked Him to make it right (almost like if I could turn back time). God has provided a substitute for me, Jesus. Jesus died so I won't have to. That is the gospel message, Jesus died for you - if you want to accept it.

More than that, if you ask Him, Jesus will come in to your life and actually change the way you feel and things you want to do and actually make it possible to live a good life free from sin. You will still let the corrupt flesh dominate your spirit some times, and then you repent and accept what Jesus did for you. "want us to experience life at it's fullest and to be happy here on earth?" Yes, that is why if you ask Jesus in to your life you can be healed of anything and live a full and happy life.

When you get before God to be judged, you can't point to all the good things you did because it only takes one bad thing to be damned. But if you point to the cross and say I want you to forgive me, and believe He can because of the cross, then the Bible promises you will be saved from damnation.

Again this is the core of the gospel message, it boggles my mind that people still think you go to heaven if you are good and hell if you are bad!

John 3:16 For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.

1 John 1:9 If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just and will forgive us our sins and purify us from all unrighteousness.
Like AA, you can't get help unless you admit there is a problem.

a reply to: markosity1973

mark, what are you talking about? Did you mean "sorry, Buzzy" as in you wanted to comment as well? I'm delighted that you did!!
I think you meant to correct RipKnees...because

I did not say anything about 'gay' being a punishment. That was RipTide or whoever the hell. I don't think you were "punished." I also don't think you're "defective" or "untouchable" like RepTiles does, either.

I said that the Hindu religion has a similar notion - that people are born with handicaps or in lower classes because of prior infractions (karma). I didn't say I believe it.

a reply to: auto3000

The sign of human extinction.

originally posted by: tribal
no one is punished for their nature or their attractions. We are punished for our ACTIONS....and in the bible it explicitly places the lions share of onus on our actions, not our temptations. Yes, thoughts are important....motive and intent are super important......but dont let anyone tell you that lusting after a women, or a man, is anywhere even close to the same ball park as actually doing something WITH them or to them.

Yes and no.

Yes, I agree that physical actions are what should be judged on. However, as we all know there is a difference between love and lust.

being gay is no worse or better than being hetero if the desire is not manifested into action. Traditional, non biblical christianity has almost always given a free pass to heterosexual adultery but not homosexual adultery. Its completely illogical and non biblical. Yes, in the OT there absolutely WAS a difference in how the two were handled. Homosexual acts were punishable by death. Usually, but not always, heterosexual adultery was not punishable by death, as there were sometimes other options to "make it right". But rest assured, plenty of ppl were stoned to death for committing heterosexual adultery as well.

As someone raised in the faith, I can agree that acts of lust do more harm than good usually. They can lead to feelings of shame and even loneliness after the event.

Therefore under religious guises they can be considered as sinful because they have the ability to harm the self.

However acts of love i.e. in committed relationships are different. They comfort, relax and bring a sense of connection with humanity. Even when one is gay. Therefore the self is enriched and not harmed.

The whole Christian gay is wrong thing only relies on the shaky argument that a book that is frankly outdated and quite biased written thousands of years ago is the only authority on the subject.

originally posted by: markosity1973
a reply to: TAECOLE7

No, no no.

Spoken like a truly ignorant person who believes the words of a dusty old book over common sense and reality.

Trust me, I used to think like you. I ended up dead because of it. FORTUNATELY for me, there were some very determined nurses who saved me (resuscitation), then gave me the telling off of my life. (I was 17 at the time)

It's only when a gay person learns to accept themselves for who they are that they become at peace with their self.

The hypocrisy people of who think like you: You're not perfect either. But you would have yourself believe you are more perfect than me.

And that is sickening.

Careful, if your response was sincere then you're allowing my words to have power over your emotions. The wrong intilletual person would not only predict any following responses but demonstrate why you chose to respond that way.....never the less, my response is not about me being more spotless than you..

a reply to: markosity1973

This:

The whole Christian gay is wrong thing only relies on the shaky argument that a book that is frankly outdated and quite biased written thousands of years ago is the only authority on the subject.

That ^

TRUTH

originally posted by: RiptKeys
a reply to: markosity1973

Taking religion out of it...you're still not born gay. There just isn't any credible evidence.


In conclusion, whether it's religion or science, there is no proof you're born gay.

Lack of evidence is not proof.

It's one of the tenets of the scientific realm.

And you choose to believe the words of a book over real life experience.

Here is something for you to ponder. My own mother used to tell me all the time that when I was born she sense that there was something 'different' about me. She calls it mother's instinct. She thought she had given birth to something wonderful like a saint.

Imagine her disappointment when she found out that I am just plain old gay. Even she admits now that I am 43 that what she sensed was my sexuality.

a reply to: RiptKeys

The idea that there's a gay gene is rather ridiculous, if there were a gene then it wouldn't be linked to population density it would be linked to the rate at which that gene gets propagated. Which isn't the case. Since it is related to population density then it's more than likely related to hormonal queues or some other outside indicator ( I'm pretty sure our cells aren't psychic but hey, I've got no proof).

Even if it's caused by hormonal levels levied at an individual when they start entering pre-pubescence it doesn't change the fact that it's the natural order of things and perfectly in tune with our biological make up and species and the kingdom our species belongs to.

I think your take on the matter is a perfect example of the the main failure of western religions, you dictate how the world should be based on what men wrote rather then observing the world that was created, something that only the divine had a say in. Things are the way they are regardless of whether we've learned enough to understand them or not. Thank god there were people willing to eschew dogma in favor of the natural world created by whatever force created everything. I'd hate to be stuck in a 21st century that never escaped the dark ages.

originally posted by: BuzzyWigs
a reply to: markosity1973

mark, what are you talking about?

I did not say anything about 'gay' being a punishment. That was RipTide or whoever the hell. I don't think you were "punished." I also don't think you're "defective" or "untouchable" like RepTiles does, either.

I said that the Hindu religion has a similar notion - that people are born with handicaps or in lower classes because of prior infractions (karma). I didn't say I believe it.

No Buzzy, I just meant I was answering the same post as you.

I was not attacking what you said