Ok phoenix I devised that quote when seeing a bit about your psyche.

You obviously deny certain truths because it disrupts your political agendas, hence the quote.

Not that you're all BS but that you won't admit to things that hurt your arguments, because there are such things.

When I present such you just dismiss them as Lies...hence the innovation of that quote.

Ok phoenix I devised that quote when seeing a bit about your psyche.

You obviously deny certain truths because it disrupts your political agendas, hence the quote.

Not that you're all BS but that you won't admit to things that hurt your arguments, because there are such things.

When I present such you just dismiss them as Lies...hence the innovation of that quote.


first, where did you see anything about my psyche? it's not like i have my personal problems written out for the world to enjoy, anyone can be anything in words on a screen.

secondly, i cannot deny certain truths when a certain person certainly doesn't supply them. of this i am certain.

if i am knowlingly in error, i will not fight it to the ground, i'm not stubborn like that, if you did indeed study my psyche, then you would've found examples of that before.

and you haven't presented anything for me to debunk. when i saw this subject updated i was lookin for a good debate? come on man, you can do better than this, my brother who is in the 6th grade can do better than this, don't let yourself be beaten by a sophomore in high school, come on.

Phoenix_cross everything we say reveals a little about our psyche, and you more than anything want to fight against what the government is doing so badly you'd shoot Bush in the head if you could.

You've talked about wanting a revolution before or I'd not have mentioned the "600,000" men.

revolution is the answer, it's what we need

Either way, you're still denying that what I've told you is the Truth.

It is...it's just plain history. Fact, not fiction, you are "imagining things."

You are imagining that history is really a big lie, and that the REAL truth serves to fuel your revolutionary "spirit."

There's not going to be a good debate phoenix_cross, because you believe in your own imaginations too strongly.

Anything I tell you is a lie, some government propoganda, or something you've never heard and therefore I must be making it up.

People like you don't make good debate partners sorry.

[Edited on 29-6-2003 by HuramAbi]

a lot of our history has been doctored to coverup the atrocities that made america america. those 6oo,ooo people could just as easily be the native americans that we killed through small pox in the explorative age of america, and it could also have been any number of Nazi soldiers, not the SS in the camps, that fought for a lost cause.

revolution doesn't neccesarily mean conflict, and vise versa.

the truth is there is no truth. if our history is a lie, then tell me hiram, what exactly is it?

the catholic church lost a lot fo our history too, burning the books as they say. who can truely be certain, learn how to master the future, through the examples of the past, then you can be paid attention.

See that's what I mean...you believe history to be false, now a debate on if it IS false or not would be interesting but too hard to do for either side.

However, I can assure you most history is true, to a very good extent, all they way back to 2000 BC.

yeah I suppose earlier I could have taken "revolution" too violently but I don't since any "sitting around and peacful protesting" in you lol, you're a "doer" and want to see it done.

Don't worry, there are forces in this world that saw to it that what the Catholics wanted destroyed, were kept.

Even what was in Alexandria still was kept mostly intact elsewhere, all that happend is the people stopped learning it...

there's a difference between it being destroyed, and forgotten. The Church knew like the Jews knew like the Templars knew like the Masons knew...knowledge is power.

And keeping good history helps you use leverage over people, not erasing history...for if you forget history, you fall in the same category as your slaves.

The Catholics failed because there were groups who realized they MUST at all costs remember their own history, lest they be defeated...Jews are the primary among those...

The 600,000 was referring to the Civil War nothing more.

you want a debate, you got a debate, i'll defend the arguement, that our history has been doctored and is incomplete. i'll go send a u2u to william right now.

the rage on this site is absolutely awesome and is a true reflection of our social existience. this is not the only thread out of control. there are others. the question is why??
dragonwriter has proposed an assualt on the mental awareness of humans by HAARP I suggest you all read it and consider the possible implications. this is a new age we are living in and there are no limits any longer. all I realize is that something somewhere is very wrong and you all are twisting off and you all are a barometer of civilization or what is left of it!!

tut tut

no dude, first he says there shouldn't be any revolution, then he says my psyche is jacked up, and then he says i insult people with disabilities, (bush cos of his bushisms)

dude, i want you to accept my challenge to a debate, and too bad dueling wild wild west stryle was banned, other wise i would've gone for that option. that'd be interesting too.

do this, and we can see who is truly unknowing

yeah alright that should be fun A debate on an interesting topic

the topic is

our history has been doctored and is incomplete.

i am defending the side of the affirmative, and you are defending the side of the ummm, let's busherize it, the side of the unaffirmative.

Is there a nation on Earth who's history has not been doctored and is incomplete, e.g. original writings/sayings diluted, forgotten; lost or approriated by others? I don't think American history is a lie, how could we have been what we were if this were true? Do I think some use history in a revisionistic manner? Yes.
But to say our history is a lie is a bit presumptuous you think?

Well, as much as it pains me I have to agree with Tyriffic. First and foremost, the original writings from both the period pre-dating the establishment of the United States, all the way through to the present time are preserved and readily available. Unless some one is too lazy to read for themselves and instead accepts propaganda, it should not be hard to confirm the accuracy of any given history book compared to these writings.

However, I do insert a caveat. I have noticed recently (in the past decade) that the textbooks being used in the public school systems ARE attempting to rewrite history by 1.) omitting facts on topics, and 2.) inserting "interpretations" on topics....in other words, "stacking the deck" when an historical event is discussed. And usually in a liberal, new age kind of way. I know this to be true, because I have two children who are either through their primary education in the public system, or in the middle of it.

Originally posted by phoenix_cross
the topic is

our history has been doctored and is incomplete.

What about if it's also been lost? Who gets to push that side of the argument?

astrocreep

VERY interesting post !

i think classifies as incomplete.

i'm looking more at, in school, we aren't told much of the detainment camps we held japanese citisens in during the second world war, or that we knowingly gave smallpox to indians so they'd die. not to mention, when fighting england, america fought honorably, killing only the soldiers, but against the natives, it was killing everyone.

i am not some hippie native americanist, i'm just trying to let you know that in american history taught in our schools, that is a subject that isn't exactly lies, but has been made to make us belive that we didn't commit atrocities. the situation is getting better though.

and to say that we know all of our history is true? who's to say. what really happened, not to mention, we weren't there. do we really know much more than archeological records of the egyptians? they used paper, what happened to that?

the greeks and romans, a lot of their discovreies were destroyed by the Church in the Dark Ages right after the fall of Byzantium.

[Edited on 30-6-2003 by Thomas Crowne]

Hey Val, peace and love.

I dig your signature, is that yours by the way?.............................

[Edited on 30-6-2003 by Tyriffic]

[Edited on 30-6-2003 by Tyriffic]

Phoenix I'll 2nd you there, a lot tought in schools is very abreviated. But how many know that if you were in LA just after pearl harbor you'd wake up to hearing the sounds of Japanese Subs firing at the Oil Dericks. And gun fire at the coasts?

How many are tought about the attacks of shipping that would occur just off coast of Florida, civilians would pluck the dead right off the shore, the war wasn't so far from home for some.