Steve Martin on Carrie Fisher: Can a Man Still Notice a Woman’s Beauty?

originally posted by: Anaana
It always make me wonder what it says about us as a society that we find a woman enslaved and chained, as well as forced to wear what she considers to be demeaning clothes, so attractive.

Interesting one that.

It seems I am not the only one to wonder that...

Princess Leia’s status as the catalyst of male sexual awakening has been alluded to countless times in pop culture. On Friends, when Ross confesses to Rachel that he had a sexual fantasy about bikini-clad Leia, Phoebe assures her it’s a rite of passage. “Every guy our age loved that,” she says. “It’s huge. That’s the moment when she stopped being a princess and she became, like, a woman.” As the Washington Post’s Alyssa Rosenberg points out, one of the most glaring signs that Leia is seen as sexy rather than complex is the Philadelphia dad who complained about a scantily clad Leia action figure. And on Tuesday, Steve Martin helpfully reminded us of this fact in a now-deleted tweet when he said that for him as a young man, “she was the most beautiful creature I had ever seen.”

But that characterization of Leia — as a wet dream for prepubescent men — is something Fisher spoke out against her whole career. She addressed Leia’s role as a sex object in a 1983 interview with Rolling Stone. “Let’s not forget that these movies are basically boys’ fantasies,” she said. “So the other way they made her more female in this one was to have her take off her clothes.”

nymag.com...

originally posted by: Anaana

originally posted by: testingtesting
He knew her and tweeted the truth.
Sod all those who attacked Martin...sure attack him because he aint that funny anymore but don't attack him when he is tweeting about his pal who has just died.
Plus as a child watching star wars for the first time I saw her beauty also...still do and what she wore in Jedi....badda bing!.

It's an over-reaction, sure, but it also makes quite clear that Martin, whether he met her or not, didn't know her very well.

She added, "Youth and beauty are not accomplishments, they're the temporary happy byproducts of time and/or DNA." Neither, of course, have anything to do with talent but when have women been judged on talent alone? Especially in an industry such as Hollywood, known for its sexist standards against women, Fisher's speaking out was uncommonly bold.

And to the young actress Daisy Ridley who played Rey in The Force Awakens, Fisher offered advice that really seemed geared for every woman in the universe: "You should fight for your outfit," Fisher said — but then, making clear she really was talking about more than clothes, she added, "Don't be a slave like I was."

edition.cnn.com...

It always make me wonder what it says about us as a society that we find a woman enslaved and chained, as well as forced to wear what she considers to be demeaning clothes, so attractive.

Interesting one that.

I don't think it's negative or nefarious. Men don't want women to be enslaved, chained, forced to do anything. The archetype of a woman left vulnerable in duress ("Damsel in Distress") plays on men's inherent desire/need to be a protector to women. It's not that man wants woman to remain bound, but that man wants to free woman from her oppressors.

It's instinctual, this innate desire to be protective and to be the defender. The behavior is attractive to many women, as there is an instinctual desire to to find protection against harm.

I wouldn't consider it to be saying something about our society, it says something about our basic basic instinct/desires.

Your strong, smart and wonderful, oh and your pretty too. This was a compliment I paid to a female friend on social media who has kept positive through massive adversity. She didn't seem in the least offended, in fact she said that it had made her day. There is no lesson modern idiocy can teach me.

a reply to: Profusion

I guess his biggest sin, according to those who complained about his tweet, was that he dared to view her as a woman...

...or some similar idiocy.

originally posted by: Anaana
It always make me wonder what it says about us as a society that we find a woman enslaved and chained, as well as forced to wear what she considers to be demeaning clothes, so attractive.

Interesting one that.

enslaved and chained? Well, I think what attracts people is the showing of flesh from a highly talented pop icon. Now, I could explain why people like seeing people in scantly clad clothing..but whats the point. either you know why people like that, in which case your question is absurd, or you dont, in which case perhaps human contact simply isn't your..."thing".

Incidentally, the scene where she is forced into a pleasure slave in chains, she turns it around and uses those chains to kill Jabba. I seem to remember most fans cheering at this turnabout and not mourning her escaping.

Can a Man Still Notice a Woman’s Beauty?

Of course we can, but we cannot say anything about it without the superstitious thinking the words are harming them. It's more sexist to say that women cannot be complimented on their looks.

a reply to: Profusion
Leaving aside, for a moment, the exact reason for their disapproval- this episode shows how global social media are developing into a terrifying force of coercion working towards absolute uniformity. Very soon, nobody will be allowed to buy or sell or conduct any kind of business without their mark of approval.

a reply to: Profusion

Guarantee Carrie doesn't care

no one else should to

“When I was a young man, Carrie Fisher was the most beautiful creature I had ever seen. She turned out to be witty and bright as well.”

we've all said worse to people we love

people just need something to argue about i guess...

I'm an old woman and I think it was very honest and heartfelt what Steve Martin said about Carrie Fisher. And I'm quite surprised about all the backlash over what he said. It doesn't read like an insult to me.

a reply to: SaturnFX

Nobody complains when the ewoks enslave all the males and attempt to burn them alive, to then eat them.

Only to be saved by a golden robot flying on a chair

Where's the justice ?

As for the tweet, he shouldn't have deleted it, he just gave those whiny jabba the hutt lookalike feminists a false victory

originally posted by: Anaana

originally posted by: testingtesting
He knew her and tweeted the truth.
Sod all those who attacked Martin...sure attack him because he aint that funny anymore but don't attack him when he is tweeting about his pal who has just died.
Plus as a child watching star wars for the first time I saw her beauty also...still do and what she wore in Jedi....badda bing!.

It's an over-reaction, sure, but it also makes quite clear that Martin, whether he met her or not, didn't know her very well.

She added, "Youth and beauty are not accomplishments, they're the temporary happy byproducts of time and/or DNA." Neither, of course, have anything to do with talent but when have women been judged on talent alone? Especially in an industry such as Hollywood, known for its sexist standards against women, Fisher's speaking out was uncommonly bold.

And to the young actress Daisy Ridley who played Rey in The Force Awakens, Fisher offered advice that really seemed geared for every woman in the universe: "You should fight for your outfit," Fisher said — but then, making clear she really was talking about more than clothes, she added, "Don't be a slave like I was."

edition.cnn.com...

It always make me wonder what it says about us as a society that we find a woman enslaved and chained, as well as forced to wear what she considers to be demeaning clothes, so attractive.

Interesting one that.

Those words were said in hindsight, said after the glamorous looks started to fade.

Looks are fleeting, as the majority of us middle aged discover. I think Steve Martin was being completely complimentary, because until you actually learn what a person is like, by engaging in conversation etc, then looks are all we have.

a reply to: Profusion

The woman is dead. Like every Star Wars fan I can think of, I am heartbroken that she is no longer walking upon this world, but at least she has become one with The Force, in a manner of speaking.

Steve Martin said something honest, and complimentary about someone to whom he had a connection in real life, who has passed from the world. The fact that he, in his grief, was expected to conform to the standards of people who never met Carrie Fisher, were not part of her daily life, were not part of her social circle, did not break bread with her, were not in her confidence, is bloody appalling. He knows better than those who responded badly to his words, what Carrie Fisher would have thought of what he said, because unlike them, he actually spent time around her, knew her, was involved in her life and the world in which they both moved. He should have been free to offer what he did in mourning without those who had no business interfering, piping up to silence him.

originally posted by: everyone

originally posted by: CantStandIt
a reply to: Profusion

I'm a girl, and the fact that Mr Martin felt he had to delete his tweet breaks my heart!

The ultimate irony... The people complaining are the very people who can't possibly get to know how smart and caring another person is, because they can't stop self-indulging in constant criticism of others long enough.

I felt exactly the same way about it. I also wonder why they think it is better to delete their message. It only enables creatures like that to claim they were right about it all along, which obviousness they are not.

People should stop being so scared of this SJW BS and be proud to stand up to it. Let them call you a racist or a misogynist or whatever but no matter what even when they do you can still even get to be president of the united states!

The proof is in the pudding and there is nothing to lose and only to gain when we stand up against this.

I agree it is time to stand up.

I am Nickn3 and I have been called a misogynists, a sexist, a racist and many more vile names.
This usually occurs when some would-be SJW can't think of anything relevant to say to me or about me. Hurtful name calling is what I mentally referred to as liberal attack posture 2.
In my example LAP-2 usually happens when said SJW realises that their argument is lost on me or that I simply don't care what they think. This if followed by loud voices and the inevitable point where they are proven right and my language skills deteriorates to that of my sailer roots. The name calling attackers are a waste of oxygen and best to be ignored.

My heart goes out to Mr. Martin loosing any friend is extremely difficult, and a beautiful lady even more so. Ms. Fisher was without a doubt very beautiful, talented, and intelligent. She will be sorely missed by many.

I made the thread on ATS when she passed. I said I had her poster on my wall and we grew up with her in our fantasies.

I dont think even one person on ATS said anything about being offended or call me a sexist.

So this is just overblown bs because if the liberals here are not offended then there is no foul.

I have found, from personal experience, those that scream like this the loudest are the ones that secretly yearn to receive those compliments. However, their internal hatred for themselves and low self-esteem forces them to suppress it and project that anger outward at others. Mainly because they cannot face their own faults and must attack others to get some feeling of worth in this life.

It is sad really. I pity those that live like that, they suffer at their own hand.

There is nothing I nor anyone else can do to change them, nor should we. Let them wallow in their secret self-pity, and do not give in to their demands and reinforce their behavior.

Call me whatever name you like, but I am comfortable in my skin, are you as much in yours? If not, look deep into yourself and ask why.....because the answer is in there, not outside yourself.

a reply to: goou111

You sick individual !!

a reply to: goou111

I said I had her poster on my wall growing up and I dont think even one person on ATS said anything about being offended

I was secretly offended that it wasn't a Farrah Fawcett poster instead,.. I just chose too self censor...

You gotta have a middle fingers up philosophy on the internet or every adult baby out there will wear you down relentlessly.

originally posted by: Cobaltic1978
Those words were said in hindsight, said after the glamorous looks started to fade.

Looks are fleeting, as the majority of us middle aged discover. I think Steve Martin was being completely complimentary, because until you actually learn what a person is like, by engaging in conversation etc, then looks are all we have.

I also included a quote from 1983.

I am not saying that what he said was uncomplimentary, I only pointed out that Carrie Fisher had fought for most of her life to be treated as more than just a pretty face, for her other talents to be appreciated. Martin perhaps could have thought about that, he didn't, perhaps because he is dealing with grief, I don't know. Some people have over-reacted and kicked up a fuss, yes, but does that mean we should just disregard the words of the lady herself, no.

a reply to: Anaana

You are also overlooking that you (nor I, nor anyone here) know what was said between he and she as part of their friendship over the years. You are coming off as arrogant, IMO, to assume you know what she would feel or how she would react. Her statements you are quoting is a public presentation. Her private feelings for Steve Martin and their personal dynamics might be totally different. Only he and her would know that. And unless you personally know him, then anything you say on this matter about his statement, and attempts to interpret them are irrelevant and fraught with personal bias.