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Why the Russia thing is absurd

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posted on Dec, 13 2016 @ 11:05 AM
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Why? Because every damn nation, including our own does this #, damn near everyone knows it. We catch and trade spies all the effing time. Russia does it, the US does it, China does it. All our nations play these hacking and spying games in the shadows, catching and countering each other other all the time, every single day. People are caught exchanges made, and few of us ever hear about it. It's everyday life that we never ever hear about. Every country engages in some kind of propaganda, influencing other nations. This is all everyday crap world wide. There's literally nothing unique or special about this. Russia is not somehow worse than us or anyone else in this. It's the status quo that's existed for years, a status quo we not only engage in ourselves but supposedly excel at.

So it clearly has nothing to do with Russian hacking, etc. That's nothing new, completely normal. It's propaganda. The only time we the people are ever informed about these things openly is when it's being used as propaganda to manipulate, control, and direct us through fear. Russia is being put forward as the flavor of the hour. Sure other hacks are happening as we speak by other nations, and we're hacking others covertly right this second and have databases filled with hacked info from other countries, sure we've influenced other nations and their elections through propaganda, sure we're still engaging in spy exchanges, sure still doing all this in the shadows, but we're going to conveniently ignore all that, same as we always do? Why? Because only Russia matters, what they do or did not do matters, because some goal requires we believe them somehow worse, unique, that their actions are different, like they aren't the norm.

I'm not saying being hacked is good, I'm not ignoring how abhorrent the stuff our governments do in the shadows are. But I'm also not going to pick and choose one group as being more culpable for such actions and ignore all others. It is bad, it's bad that we live in a world where ALL our governments do this #.




posted on Dec, 13 2016 @ 11:17 AM
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a reply to: Puppylove

This is like saying that we should excuse a murderer because we all speed from time to time.
edit on 13-12-2016 by Krazysh0t because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 13 2016 @ 11:19 AM
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a reply to: Krazysh0t

No it's like saying we don't all witch hunt a murderer that's being pointed out by other murderers.

It's singling out one murderer while giving every other murderer a pass simply because we share the same neighborhood and this one is from another neighborhood.

If you have a problem with what Russia has done, then you should have a problem with every nation including our own doing the same thing.
edit on 12/13/2016 by Puppylove because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 13 2016 @ 11:22 AM
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a reply to: Puppylove

Yeah that's why there are TONS of other countries that have recently annexed parts of other countries and then invented propaganda (which was later exposed in a hack) saying the country wanted that to happen right? Say what you want about the US' international campaigns, but at least the US leaves the country with its autonomy.
edit on 13-12-2016 by Krazysh0t because: (no reason given)


+1 more 
posted on Dec, 13 2016 @ 11:28 AM
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a reply to: Krazysh0t

Sure we do.



posted on Dec, 13 2016 @ 11:30 AM
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a reply to: Krazysh0t

When the USA takes control of a nations policy makers, that is annexing it. When a country (or 3 dozen over four decades) has its leadership overthrown, paramilitaries funded and commit crimes against humanity, and puppets installed who enact favorable economic policies for foreign multinationals, that is actually worse than annexing it, but also at the very least annexing it.

Taking control of markets, legislative influence, and having soldiers and military hardware in those same countries is the same as taking the over. Its worse because they do not receive the protections they would if actually added to our empire as a legal entity instead of an occupied puppet.

As far as foreign policy goes, the USA has a factor of scores more crimes to answer for than Russia will be able to generate in the next two generations or decades.


+2 more 
posted on Dec, 13 2016 @ 11:41 AM
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a reply to: Krazysh0t

Just admit it. You are angry that the DNC's corruption was exposed. Pointing at Russia might make you feel better, but it won't change the facts.



posted on Dec, 13 2016 @ 11:47 AM
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originally posted by: Puppylove
a reply to: Krazysh0t

Sure we do.

Great comeback... Very conducive to further conversation...



posted on Dec, 13 2016 @ 11:47 AM
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a reply to: worldstarcountry

So which countries does the US still have control of then?



posted on Dec, 13 2016 @ 11:48 AM
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a reply to: Puppylove

You are so right Puppylove. It is rampant and we (the USA) are no angels in this area.

It's also absurd because the people complaining are acting like the culprit (maybe Russians maybe not) hacked the voting machines to rig the election. All they really did was expose the evil power-control things that the left did.



posted on Dec, 13 2016 @ 11:50 AM
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a reply to: Puppylove

Can you imagine the absolute outrage from the Right Wing, if the dembs and the Obama admin. was cozying up to the commies.

It would be yugggggge! Believe me, very very yuggge, people tell me, I don't know but really, Yugggeee!


edit on 13-12-2016 by olaru12 because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 13 2016 @ 11:50 AM
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a reply to: network dude

Is it possible for you to talk to me without making the thread about me? It seems like every time you talk to me it comes complete with a personal attack/ad hominem. It's getting tiring.



posted on Dec, 13 2016 @ 11:55 AM
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a reply to: olaru12

You mean like during these times?









edit on 13-12-2016 by loam because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 13 2016 @ 11:57 AM
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originally posted by: Puppylove
Why? Because every damn nation, including our own does this #, damn near everyone knows it. We catch and trade spies all the effing time. Russia does it, the US does it, China does it. All our nations play these hacking and spying games in the shadows, catching and countering each other other all the time, every single day. People are caught exchanges made, and few of us ever hear about it. It's everyday life that we never ever hear about. Every country engages in some kind of propaganda, influencing other nations. This is all everyday crap world wide. There's literally nothing unique or special about this. Russia is not somehow worse than us or anyone else in this. It's the status quo that's existed for years, a status quo we not only engage in ourselves but supposedly excel at.

So it clearly has nothing to do with Russian hacking, etc. That's nothing new, completely normal. It's propaganda. The only time we the people are ever informed about these things openly is when it's being used as propaganda to manipulate, control, and direct us through fear. Russia is being put forward as the flavor of the hour. Sure other hacks are happening as we speak by other nations, and we're hacking others covertly right this second and have databases filled with hacked info from other countries, sure we've influenced other nations and their elections through propaganda, sure we're still engaging in spy exchanges, sure still doing all this in the shadows, but we're going to conveniently ignore all that, same as we always do? Why? Because only Russia matters, what they do or did not do matters, because some goal requires we believe them somehow worse, unique, that their actions are different, like they aren't the norm.

I'm not saying being hacked is good, I'm not ignoring how abhorrent the stuff our governments do in the shadows are. But I'm also not going to pick and choose one group as being more culpable for such actions and ignore all others. It is bad, it's bad that we live in a world where ALL our governments do this #.



we have to attempt to plug any holes being exploited..

Nations don't just ignore spying..

Sure we all do it, but we all will possibly hang any spy we catch.


More than anything it is about POV..even hell has its hero's.

If your an American, you want what's best for america. If your Russian you want what's best for Russia. No one wants the opposition to do better than they do.

Russia doesn't want what is best for America, the weaker we are globally, the stronger they are. Which improves their chances in any future conflict.


So hypothetically, if Russia was trying to get trump elected, you can bet your last dollar. It isn't because it is what they precieve as best for America, it's what they precieve as best for Russia.

What will be really crazy is if they find out trump was in on it. (And I am not saying he was).

But imagaine a president elect with an ironclad case proving treason against him...

Because make no mistake, any American involved has commited treason.



posted on Dec, 13 2016 @ 11:58 AM
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a reply to: Krazysh0t

Maybe I don't feel like going into a back and forth on which country is worse in a never ending unrelated diatribe which has nothing to do with the original post which is all our nations have such organizations and commit such acts, and are all equally culpable for maintaining these kinds of actions the world over.

Me personally, I'm more concerned these people doing this stuff to we everyday citizens, and this kind of behavior becoming more and more rampant everywhere. You're so focused on Russia spying on and exposing corruption, you're ignoring the spying being done on us by our own government.

I'm more concerned with why our resident peeping toms are so gung ho trying to get us to focus on the Russian ones instead when normally they try to keep such things quiet. That's where my concern is. What are they distracting us from?



posted on Dec, 13 2016 @ 12:02 PM
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a reply to: Puppylove

I see. No conflicting viewpoints allowed in this thread. Ok. I'll see myself out now.



posted on Dec, 13 2016 @ 12:02 PM
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a reply to: JoshuaCox

What's good for one nation is not always bad for another nation. There are many groups vying for power, not all nations, some outside manipulating nations. Various nations have alliances, etc. It's infinitely more complicated than what's good for Russia is bad for the US and vice versa.



posted on Dec, 13 2016 @ 12:05 PM
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a reply to: Krazysh0t

Conflicting viewpoints is fine. You were heading us off into a US vs. Russia pissing contest. I could care less about either corrupt nation. Is why I'm saying we need to call both out, and start fixing our world governments, not keep playing their games.

I've no interest in a who's the bigger super villain, US or Russia contest. Is not what this is about, and is ridiculously subjective.



posted on Dec, 13 2016 @ 12:06 PM
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originally posted by: Puppylove
a reply to: Krazysh0t



I'm more concerned with why our resident peeping toms are so gung ho trying to get us to focus on the Russian ones instead when normally they try to keep such things quiet. That's where my concern is. What are they distracting us from?



Perhaps they aren't distracting us at all....Maybe just trying to point out traitors in our midst. That's their job you know; protecting the homeland.
edit on 13-12-2016 by olaru12 because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 13 2016 @ 12:09 PM
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originally posted by: Krazysh0t
a reply to: Puppylove

Say what you want about the US' international campaigns, but at least the US leaves the country with its autonomy.


That is quite possibly the funniest thing Ive ever seen posted on this site



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