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Meeting with Trump emboldens anti-vaccine activists

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posted on Dec, 2 2016 @ 09:39 AM
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Just to reaffirm what others have pointed out, to define terms here, what we're really talking about are forced vaxxers vs. anti-forced vaxxers. Not vaxxers vs anti-vaxxers. Most so-called "anti-vaxxers" are not against all vaccines all the time. Their objections are more along the lines of "which ones?" and "how many?" and "when?".

Forced vaxxers: Those who would force any/all vaccines on others.

Anti-Forced vaxxers: Those who force no vaccinations on anyone, but allow others to make their own choices as to which vaccines to take and when.

There is no doubt or question that vaccines can and do cause adverse reactions. The only argument is how many and how bad, which we really have no way of knowing, much less quantifying/qualifying. There is also much to be said for natural (genuine) immunity which only comes from having the disease; as opposed to vaccinations which are only temporary. And it should be understood that most people do not die from any of the diseases we vaccinate for. Just as most people do not seem to have adverse reactions from vaccinations. I would also point out that malnutrition is a major factor in those patients with the worst complications of diseases, so better nutrition has also greatly improved outcomes as a whole.

I stand on the principle that we all have autonomy over our own bodies; and that rights are self-evident -- if you can do it for yourself and by yourself, then it's your right. Therefore, if you must force someone else to do something, it is not your right... and it is in fact and in deed a violation of the other person's rights.

Count me as an Anti-Forced Vaxxer.




posted on Dec, 2 2016 @ 11:24 AM
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originally posted by: projectvxn
a reply to: X88B88

What does that have to do with vaccines?

Let me answer that:

Nothing.


That's because you didn't read it. So, fail.



posted on Dec, 2 2016 @ 11:27 AM
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a reply to: SlapMonkey

Very. Well. Said.

/thread.
edit on 2-12-2016 by X88B88 because: ...



posted on Dec, 2 2016 @ 12:06 PM
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a reply to: projectvxn

www.naturalnews.com...




Former Merck virologist Stephen A Krahling tried to go to the FDA with evidence of vaccine research fraud taking place at Merck, but he was threatened with jail time by Merck's own people, according to a False Claims Act document he and another co-worker filed with the federal government. Merck senior management not only threatened jail time if the scientist exposed the fraud; they also attempted to pay him off with promises of financial bonuses if he kept quiet, the documents explain. The following quotes are found in this document: United States District Court for the Eastern District of Pennsylvania. Civil action No. 10-4374. "Complaint for Violations of the Federal False Claims Act." Learn more: www.naturalnews.com...



posted on Dec, 2 2016 @ 03:46 PM
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a reply to: TheConstruKctionofLight

You need to find a better source.

Natural News is known for spreading disinformation.



posted on Dec, 2 2016 @ 03:46 PM
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a reply to: X88B88

I most certainly did.



posted on Dec, 2 2016 @ 07:47 PM
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originally posted by: projectvxn
a reply to: TheConstruKctionofLight

You need to find a better source.

Natural News is known for spreading disinformation.


Can you show any evidence of this regarding this story, as it was also picked up by quite a few 'mainstream' sources.

Forbes
edit on 2-12-2016 by X88B88 because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 2 2016 @ 07:50 PM
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originally posted by: projectvxn
a reply to: X88B88

I most certainly did.





You obviously did not or you would have commented on the correlation to this subject.



posted on Dec, 3 2016 @ 12:14 AM
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originally posted by: projectvxn
This is definitely a step backwards if that is the direction the President-elect will take.

Anti-vaxxers like Andrew Wakefield are dangrous peddlers of pseudoscience and should never be allowed to give medical advice to anyone ever.


Dude, you are highly gulible to not see something wrong with injecting your children and YOURSELF with dormant/dead viruses, shady materials that cause disease, and outright "mystery" chems...! You gobble up everything someone will tell you and beg for more...even if they pull it out the darkest corner of their ass. Let me guess, you believe in evolution don't you?

Sad.

Some vaccines ARE absolutely necessary. But I am talking the bare, BARE basics. Like the vaccines for diseases that you will likely catch and die otherwise. Otherwise, you can keep your death elixirs and inject yourself with as many as you like. But the government isn't going to dare tell me what to put in my own body.

Sorry dude...it hit a nerve there.

I like my DNA to not unravel or get obliterated into unrecognizeable ****. My DNA is God-given and I'm keeping it that way.



posted on Dec, 3 2016 @ 02:45 AM
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I don't fall into the anti-vaccine group by any means. For myself...I don't want to take any medicine unless there is no other choice. I take blood pressure medication and that is about it except for some over-the-counter cold medicine when I'm sick. I'm a firm believe in...well...our history. Long ago the medical industry believe one thing was good that we have since found out to be bad. We used barbaric methods before and we will one day look at the methods and medications today as barbaric.

In my opinion, we don't know anywhere near everything. We allow doctors and pharmaceutical companies to tell us what is right and often they are only guessing. I don't believe they have any idea what decades of use of some medications will do to us...or our offspring, etc.

So I don't take any medication I don't have to. But...for disease and especially for children, even though I don't like it...I have to go with the lessor of two evils and believe the "professionals".

But with that said...I will NEVER allow a government body to force me or my children to be medicated. PERIOD! They don't have my interest or the interest of MY children at heart. They have the masses to consider and my life...my daughter's life, etc. individually mean nothing. If an individual or parent (this is their job) decides not to take a vaccine or any medicine, no one...especially a government...should be allowed to force them.

Yes...that sucks for children of idiots, but idiot parents do a lot of things that are bad for their children that is their choice. Unless it is 100% fact, truth and proven that something is and will always be safe for everyone (which isn't possible), you can't force people to do something they don't want to do.

IMHO



posted on Dec, 3 2016 @ 05:09 AM
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a reply to: kef33890

I don't even know where to start with your hysterics.



posted on Dec, 3 2016 @ 11:50 AM
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originally posted by: projectvxn
a reply to: kef33890

I don't even know where to start with your hysterics.


Neither do I, but you are right. These anti vaxxers are dangerous



posted on Dec, 3 2016 @ 02:46 PM
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a reply to: MysticPearl

In 2015, there were 134 200 measles deaths globally – about 367 deaths every day or 15 deaths every hour.
Measles vaccination resulted in a 79% drop in measles deaths between 2000 and 2015 worldwide.

This drop is from vaccine use . Current data. In the 60's thousands were saved.

mumps:Mumps is no longer very common in the United States. From year to year, mumps cases can range from roughly a couple hundred to a couple thousand. For example in 2010, there were 2,612 cases reported to CDC, and in 2012, there were 229. Before the U.S. mumps vaccination program started in 1967, about 186,000 cases were reported each year, but the actual number of cases was likely much higher due to underreporting. Since the pre-vaccine era, there has been a more than 99% decrease in mumps cases in the United States.


Just picking two of the things we get shots for indicates that even in the 2100st century that vacines are saving peoples health and lives. If you count the millions of people that were hurt or killed by preventable (by vaccines) 1900-2000 century how CAN YOU not see the value of vaccines.



posted on Dec, 3 2016 @ 02:49 PM
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originally posted by: kef33890

originally posted by: projectvxn
This is definitely a step backwards if that is the direction the President-elect will take.

Anti-vaxxers like Andrew Wakefield are dangrous peddlers of pseudoscience and should never be allowed to give medical advice to anyone ever.


Dude, you are highly gulible to not see something wrong with injecting your children and YOURSELF with dormant/dead viruses, shady materials that cause disease, and outright "mystery" chems...! You gobble up everything someone will tell you and beg for more...even if they pull it out the darkest corner of their ass. Let me guess, you believe in evolution don't you?

Sad.

Some vaccines ARE absolutely necessary. But I am talking the bare, BARE basics. Like the vaccines for diseases that you will likely catch and die otherwise. Otherwise, you can keep your death elixirs and inject yourself with as many as you like. But the government isn't going to dare tell me what to put in my own body.

Sorry dude...it hit a nerve there.

I like my DNA to not unravel or get obliterated into unrecognizeable ****. My DNA is God-given and I'm keeping it that way.


Buddy the only reason you have your health is the fact that your parent got you your shots.



posted on Dec, 3 2016 @ 05:52 PM
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a reply to: MysticPearl

Is this accurate ? -- doctors who do not vaccinate their own children?



posted on Dec, 3 2016 @ 05:58 PM
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originally posted by: projectvxn
a reply to: [post=21593826]MysticPearl]

This stupid ass conspiracy theory relies on the notion that all these people are evil and only went to college to hurt people with their vaccines and live saving drugs.


projectvxn
I believe most chemical researchers have altruistic desires to help mankind.
However;
… there is a grand misconception that it is OK to vaccine-kill or vaccine-harm one child or more for any purpose. . . and to me, such premeditated murder is or should be a capital crime, if it is *forced* upon any child/person.
I understand that there is a major dedication issue of wanting to believe that a Star Trek injection will cure all symptoms of dis-order… but no.
Shots of pus do not prevent a pus environment; rather, pus injections create a pus environment, although most pus reactions are latent and the microbes have mutated somewhat.
I do not believe in giving alcohol to cure an alcoholic
and I do not believe in giving pus to create a pus-protected environment within the body.



posted on Dec, 3 2016 @ 06:10 PM
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originally posted by: Annee
There is a type of Autism that strikes around age 3.

Up until that point the child seems normal, and is beginning to talk. But, then the child starts regressing, losing language skills, etc.

The timing with kids that age getting vaccinations makes some parents think its the vaccine.

Its not.


Annee,

Annee,
I think it is extremely close-minded to NOT note the statistical and verifiable connection between immunized children and possible 3 year latent reaction clusters .



posted on Dec, 3 2016 @ 06:17 PM
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originally posted by: Agartha


Please, answer this (seeing as you are not 'naive' apparently): do you visit the emergency department in hospitals if you or your loved ones had an accident?

Because you shouldn't: the same science based medicine used for preventive health care (vaccines included) is the same science based medicine used in the emergency departments in hospitals (where they pump you full of all kinds of drugs straight into your veins). If you do use the ER then you should stop as it would make you look highly hypocritical.



Agartha,
I think that emergency medicine is the finest and most advanced this planet has seen (perhaps, for a LONG time). I ALSO believe that emergency medical care is vastly different from medical preventative or treatment care.
One is immediate and obviously can be life-saving.
The other is assumed to be the BEST method for addressing illness or physical disorders.

The Chinese use of green pigmented teas and ocupuncture is renowned.
There are many methods, and some work; but not all methods work, such as Star Trek claims to instantly heal.

I note that adding poison to the soil of a rose bush will eventually cause the plant to wither and die.
However, replanting the rose bush in clean (poison-free) soil will allow the rose bush the nutrients needed to thrive.
I observe the human body to be no less capable of maintaining health without having to inject pus or poison into the system.



posted on Dec, 3 2016 @ 06:19 PM
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originally posted by: Annee

originally posted by: tribal
a reply to: Annee

youre living in a dream world. The fact is, in any country with a healthy travel and tourism industry or with wide access to the rest of the wrolds population it is a certainty you and your child are coming in contact with unvaccinated or incomplete vaccinated people from other countries or even our own country all of the time.



No I'm not. I'm a realist.

I'm not taking my kid anywhere that doesn't have mandated vaccinations.


Annee,
You may have to put your child into a bubble because the playground, the park, the post office, the grocery store, et al public areas of the world are filled with germs and people who have not injected germs, pus or poisons into their body.



posted on Dec, 3 2016 @ 06:21 PM
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originally posted by: SmilingROB
a reply to: MysticPearl

In 2015, there were 134 200 measles deaths globally – about 367 deaths every day or 15 deaths every hour.
Measles vaccination resulted in a 79% drop in measles deaths between 2000 and 2015 worldwide.

This drop is from vaccine use . Current data. In the 60's thousands were saved.



SmilingROB,

Is there a source link for these statistics, that you can post for me? Thank you.




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