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Trump suggests jail, loss of citizenship for burning U.S. flag

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posted on Dec, 2 2016 @ 02:26 PM
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originally posted by: Shr00mz
Burning the flag is what darkest, meanest, nastiest people in world do. Same who kill innocent lives. They should be sent to the middle east and north korea and burn flags with them.


That is probably the most un-American thing Ive ever read. Thanks for showing me why I left ATS in the first place.




posted on Dec, 2 2016 @ 02:27 PM
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a reply to: Jungian

Those are also the kind of places that would publicly dismember you for destroying a symbol.



posted on Dec, 2 2016 @ 07:01 PM
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A flag is a symbol of unity and so burning it should be punishable. It is virtually treason. It is a symbol of not believing/trusting your country. While loss of citizenship is a bit harsh, same as a year in jail, I belive there should be some sort of punishment!



posted on Dec, 2 2016 @ 07:04 PM
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a reply to: HammerTime47637

Considering flag burning is protected by the 1st amendment and the government cant revoke citizenship of natural born citizens per scotus this entire situation is a moot point.
edit on 2-12-2016 by Xcathdra because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 3 2016 @ 01:22 AM
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a reply to: Xcathdra

God listen to yourselves.

1.) Nationalist agenda is started by our founding father's to preserve what this country stands for. That flag you burn had just as much thought and meaning as constitution that our Founding Mothers helped piece together (I know. it changed. so does constitution) stars HAVE meaning. Stripes HAVE meaning. Just like you can't kill bald eagle be it to survive a day starving in woods. What is the Eagle? A symbol. Meaning to this country. You can kill a raven, not a eagle? Its not the same but don't matter, it's a contradiction!!

2.) Most diplomatic countries not only prevent flag burning, also prevent burning flags of ANY NATION. It's not just ours, but no flag should be burned unless it's the swastika.

3.) American Flag napkins are not what we drape over our fallen, pledge our ALLEGENCE too. Burn them, whipe your ass with it, blow your nose on it.

4.) Flag is so sacred it's TABOO to so much let it TOUCH DIRT. Consequences have been issued over and over for it.1800s people were murdered for not folding and being negligent to it.

5) burning flag in nam era is BIG differece. Military isn't shooting us. We didn't just have two of our biggest hero's assassinated. We didn't get attacks on homeland like Vietnam. YOU HAVE TO MAKE A STAND AT THAT POINT. Its NOTHING like Hilliary loosing you f#cking cry babies. It's still wrong! Burning the flag only symbolises your ACCEPTANCE of what they do because TYRANNY isn't the symbol of that flag, it's what WE PROTECT.

6) Burning the flag encourages globalist agenda. Amero? Remember? Change everything? Yep.. bye bye American flag. Welcome new flag.

7) Burning items is NOT FREE SPEECH and ISN'T protected. It's being forced on us to devide and loose strings to birth of a one world agenda. It's arson. You need PERMITS to burn things in public.ESPECIALLY if it has a drought. YOU AREN'T SPEECHING YOU'RE BURNING. You say it's self expression... yea well so is jerking off and other things. Doesn't make it SPEECH. WORDS. LITERACY.

8) I and other Americans will not condone it. We pledge our ALLEGENCE to the flag and swore an oath to constitution to protect this nation from all ENEMIES both and DOMESTIC. You can speak, write, assemble, bare arms, and have religion. You can have these things, you just can't be a traitor to country tho.

9) Learn by others. Mexico is pissed but our flag in Mexico is UPSIDE DOWN. It didn't burn. Why not in Mexico? It's ILLEGAL.

10) JAIL to those BORN in America. DEPORTATION/LOSS OF CITIZENSHIP to ALIENS in the country. I mean..this was even a point? It's very well protected... in fact could be worse as tyranny could be COURT MARSHALLED but that wasn't what was said, was it?

11) Contradiction... so.. It's wrong we all agree but you have fight the right to party, right? Well... don't be so quick to protect other ones that don't get protected that if you admit to defend on here just proves you're a lying contradiction.
A) Suicide. It use to naturally be protected to do this. Now, if you fail to kill yourself it's against the law. Rather by RELIGIOUS practice or non.
B) Freedom to practice religion. No we cant. I can't cut your handoff for theft. I can't stone a woman or beat her. I can't sacrifice a cat to Lucifer, child to Molech, a man to Cuchulain, and guys... we could really go on for years here. Yea, it's wrong, it's disturbing... but you said you stand by it because the constitution say it so. It's RELIGION and PRACTICES yet defend BURNING/ACTIONS as SPEECH? Really?
C) Militia and right to bare arms. So it's obvious were suppose to be able to defend ourselves if government tries to use its forces against us. Instead we are to be trained in republic to defend ourselves. USMC or National Guard is GOVERNMENT not a militia. Even then, guard is ran by state...which is GOVERNMENT. It's ILLEGAL for an average man to come close to same right without GOVERNMENT INVOLVEMENT of permits and special licences that declare you're former military or police (government)

These are real excuses to defend and preserve. So wait..what..it changes? Yes because it does and can. We have right to vote it in and do this, it was done before and was basically considered wrong in first place or law wouldn't have popped up. It was common sense.

12) California, New York, and Florida doesn't run this country. Together we run the country. Tennessee, Kansas, Idaho... We can't all BREED large cities or where would we grow food? Corn...tomatoes...cattle... cities don't keep us alive, food and our brother's do. Yea 600,000 votes over Trump... but county by county. State by state it's fair an equal. Otherwise those 10million population states would unhear votes and culltures of society in our independent states. You lossed so burn my flag? Yea.. you're defending constitution alright.

13) Civil war, waving Mexican flags burning American flags, calling to kill people, propaganda that displays turning nation of OUR CONSTITUTION into MEXICAN CONSTITUTION is NOT CONSTITUTIONAL it's an act of tyranny. These people should (since know theres millions of illegals and possible terrorist from middle east) asked to present a valid ID and further actions should take place.

14) Why I left ATS? Cause you're cry baby who can't accept a DEMOCRATIC loss? Can't listen to someone else's opionion? You wonder why we say leave the country because that's USELESS MENTALITY. What do we learn from each other by walking away?

15) You may have bought it, but it's still mine and theirs. That flag is symbol of MY COUNTRY, not just a THING or wouldn't be A WORLD REKNOWN SYMBOL and I have the right to stop you. And people wil, and trust me... we don't want civil war but it's no contest. People on other side not spouting this cry baby rhetoric are patriots, men and women of armed forces, hunters and survivalist, radical constitutionalist and American Nationalist, independent farmers who work hard and don't burn flags and defiled our nation. And sadly, a few racists groups that we don't want. Guys spout war have tightest gun bans and really don't have fully functional brain. Its no contest.

16) Nationalism is Constitutionalism. At least for us it is because nationalism doesn't fall on us like Jews in Germany. We don't have a 'common enemy' in our country but ILLEGAL PEOPLE. We're not a nation of one belief or race. Just Google American Nationalist and become American. People say Hitler was Nationalist? No... he formed his own entire fascist regime with new flag, new flag and tyranny against his true former nation of Germany. Socialism isn't

17) With flip of wrist a bill is signed by choice of president to hand the nation to some real badasses who will torture you, steal every right, and entrap us like patriot act does. What guys are doing by burning flag is not saying "I feel unheard" it's saying "let's provoke marital law for acts of domestic terrorism". How? Easy... Soros pays Muslims to burn flags in America. Terrorist Attack. Now its state of emergency. I and you and we are F#CKED. Thanks. You prepped your very own false flag. Now theres no Constitutional Nationalism but Unconstitutional Fascism. That's what you're representing.


18) Say it, don't spray it.



posted on Dec, 3 2016 @ 03:19 AM
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originally posted by: luthier

originally posted by: WeAreAWAKE

originally posted by: AMPTAH

originally posted by: Shr00mz


Practice of Terrorism:
Burning books, flags,



Nonsense. There's no terror in burning a flag. It's a symbol. Not a person.


Huh? While I agree that it isn't terror by definition...maybe it should be. You are allowed to burn a picture or effigy of a person (which represents them) so I guess burning a flag isn't illegal. But what if I wanted to burn an effigy of your child out on the street in front of your home? Is that legal also? Or what if I wanted to take another symbol...maybe a cross and burn it out on the street of a black family? Is that fine with you too?



The direct threat and fighting words come up.

The law see's a difference with saying I am going to kill your kid and burn a picture than a general flag burning from ignorant, often hormonal youth.

If you burn the flag and say on so and so a date I am going to so and so so and so, now your heading past free speech as far as legal precedence is concerned.

You can legally withhold funding say from a university for protesting, like to test their convictions.

But the flag burning has to be a direct focused threat or cause riots to be considered a crime on its own or as evidence of the crime.

How about it simply being dangerous to the flag burner, other people and property and therefore, it is illegal to burn items without the proper safety precautions such as water, a fire extinguisher and a contained burn area? Kind of solves the problem doesn't it?



posted on Dec, 3 2016 @ 10:48 AM
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originally posted by: Shr00mz
a reply to: Xcathdra

God listen to yourselves.

1.) Nationalist agenda is started by our founding father's to preserve what this country stands for. That flag you burn had just as much thought and meaning as constitution that our Founding Mothers helped piece together (I know. it changed. so does constitution) stars HAVE meaning. Stripes HAVE meaning. Just like you can't kill bald eagle be it to survive a day starving in woods. What is the Eagle? A symbol. Meaning to this country. You can kill a raven, not a eagle? Its not the same but don't matter, it's a contradiction!!
...


Symbols have meaning.

Yes.

Symbols have meaning WE GIVE TO IT.

But, people can CHANGE THE MEANING.

The Swastika had a GOOD MEANING before Hitler adopted it and CHANGED THE MEANING.

The Flag is a symbol, it's not like the constitution. The constitution has "words" that have their own meaning.

The Flag is just a "picture", it has no inherent meaning, other than what we give to it.

So, when people change the meaning of the flag, by the actions they do while flying that flag, we burn it, when those actions are bad.

It's that simple.

We don't let other people take our GOOD SYMBOL and misuse it, to disguise their EVIL.

We EXPOSE THEM by burning the symbol when it has become a symbol of corruption.

People use GOOD WORDS and GOOD SYMBOLS and DRESS WELL to hide secret evil actions behind them.

By removing those symbols they have nothing left to hide behind.



edit on 3-12-2016 by AMPTAH because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 3 2016 @ 10:55 AM
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a reply to: Shr00mz

You can't kill a real eagle. Nobody cares if you destroy a bunch of symbolic eagles. It's not illegal to burn flags with eagles on them. It's illegal to kill an actual eagle.



posted on Dec, 3 2016 @ 10:58 AM
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originally posted by: WeAreAWAKE

originally posted by: luthier

originally posted by: WeAreAWAKE

originally posted by: AMPTAH

originally posted by: Shr00mz


Practice of Terrorism:
Burning books, flags,



Nonsense. There's no terror in burning a flag. It's a symbol. Not a person.


Huh? While I agree that it isn't terror by definition...maybe it should be. You are allowed to burn a picture or effigy of a person (which represents them) so I guess burning a flag isn't illegal. But what if I wanted to burn an effigy of your child out on the street in front of your home? Is that legal also? Or what if I wanted to take another symbol...maybe a cross and burn it out on the street of a black family? Is that fine with you too?



The direct threat and fighting words come up.

The law see's a difference with saying I am going to kill your kid and burn a picture than a general flag burning from ignorant, often hormonal youth.

If you burn the flag and say on so and so a date I am going to so and so so and so, now your heading past free speech as far as legal precedence is concerned.

You can legally withhold funding say from a university for protesting, like to test their convictions.

But the flag burning has to be a direct focused threat or cause riots to be considered a crime on its own or as evidence of the crime.

How about it simply being dangerous to the flag burner, other people and property and therefore, it is illegal to burn items without the proper safety precautions such as water, a fire extinguisher and a contained burn area? Kind of solves the problem doesn't it?


I already mentioned that. Fully agree and it's what actually happens already.....
Next



posted on Dec, 3 2016 @ 01:53 PM
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Here's news I see... I guess me or any of these people are unamerican.

www.theblaze.com...

www.google.com...

toprightnews.com...

There's another one I can't find.. It's soldier standing with his flag as other eldery veterans (think at American legion) collected all their flags and burned them.

The soldier stood there and clung to everything he stands for with a tear in his eye he stood strong and watched and listened. All day he waited. But he refused to leave saying "At the end of the day, I will see to it that there is one flag left."

Does these veterans need to go to jail? No, unless it becomes legal. Does it break my heart to see them do this? Yes.

What could they have done in more true American way? Stand below the flag and anchoring it down, folding it up and bringing it inside.

OR

Bring it down and flip it upside down and not shock value your views for 5 minutes of unheard fame but let it fly upside down to show your distress for as long as you deem needed.

THEN should they be asked why this is being done, they use their right to FREE SPEECH and tell the news and the people and the government why and what they feel and see needs to be done.


====
Point of killing an Eagle was not to kill it by any means. For survival being it's only real means. Lost in woods can't find food. A reasonable excuse. It's not endagered it's causing damage and harm to a NATIONAL SYMBOL, like the Eagle the American Flag is a NATIONAL SYMBOL. We actually don't pledge and allegiance to the Bald Eagle of America, but to the flag of the United States of America.



posted on Dec, 3 2016 @ 03:10 PM
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I would prefer someone to burn the inanimate object, the flag, then kill the living creature, an eagle.



posted on Dec, 3 2016 @ 03:54 PM
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a reply to: Shr00mz
Well what do you know... Hillary shares Trumps view on flag burning and wanting to make it a criminal offense. Lonely and jaded, party of 1, your tables ready. Guess she is a nationalist also.


edit on 3-12-2016 by Xcathdra because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 3 2016 @ 04:02 PM
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a reply to: Xcathdra

Guess it's a party of 3. Trump + Me + Hiliary= 3. My wife it's 4. 66 voted make it illegal out of 34. So...70 confirmed.

Good for Hillary, finally get 1 point from me. Now call back your goons.



posted on Dec, 3 2016 @ 04:04 PM
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In European countries, it's forbidden by law to burn other country flag, and I am not sure what kind of a liberal idiot you need to be to burn a flag of your own nation.

If I saw someone burning the flag of my country, they would not do such retarded thing again
edit on 605k2016Saturdaypm014 by Nikola014 because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 3 2016 @ 04:21 PM
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Burning a Flag is as symbolic as the flag itself.

The Amendment is defending this part of the action.

Can someone explain to me where burning the American flag started? Because I would assume it's here.


Attacking people for burning the flag is equally hasty, you might not even know why.

There are a variety of reasons they could be burning it. They could feel the constitution is destroyed, they could feel Patriotism is a gate of equality, they could hate the Government, they could just hate Flags and Nationalism.. 'Hating America' is likely not the first reason as it's a symbol of an individual concept and ideal. If they wanted to burn their flag in their house, it wouldn't hold as much weight as a symbolic display, but this doesn't give forward reasoning to why it was done.

If America started being run by Hitler, and School was just LGBT equality education and Tennis became the national sport, there would be plenty of people burning "American Flags". That's actually the perfect example, see how I used it in quotes? The quotes represents most of their feelings more than hate for America.

Like how people burned their voter registrations on the Republican side because it wasn't Trump ticket.
edit on 3-12-2016 by imjack because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 3 2016 @ 04:26 PM
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a reply to: imjack




There are a variety of reasons they could be burning it. They could feel the constitution is destroyed, they could feel Patriotism is a gate of equality, they could hate the Government, they could just hate Flags and Nationalism.


Or, they could feel that they are not being represented by the flag, or the flag represents reprehensible things that are being protested by its burning.

Flag burning is one of the most important forms of free speech that the 1st Amendment protects. People should not forget that the constitution gives us the right to overthrow our government if we feel it's not representing the people, so burning the flag is really an important message to the government, demanding a reprieve to grievances.



posted on Dec, 3 2016 @ 05:27 PM
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originally posted by: Shr00mz
a reply to: Xcathdra

Guess it's a party of 3. Trump + Me + Hiliary= 3. My wife it's 4. 66 voted make it illegal out of 34. So...70 confirmed.

Good for Hillary, finally get 1 point from me. Now call back your goons.


Well for starters I dont have any goons. Secondly its the goons on the left who are behaving like spoiled brats, rioting because they didnt get their way.



posted on Dec, 3 2016 @ 05:50 PM
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originally posted by: Profusion
The following is the text of the relevant tweet from Trump.

Nobody should be allowed to burn the American flag - if they do, there must be consequences - perhaps loss of citizenship or year in jail!


So this would spell the end of cremating American service men and women with the flag draped around their coffins.

And going forward, no person would ever dare keeping a flag inside the house for fear of it being burnt to the ground. Not for the burning itself - insurance would cover that - but for the flag kept somewhere inside, even if it's only on a T-shirt.
edit on 3/12/2016 by moniker because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 3 2016 @ 08:47 PM
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a reply to: moniker

Whats ironic is Obama issued an EO that changed the oath of allegiance new citizens of the US take. They are no longer required to pledge allegiance to the flag.



posted on Dec, 3 2016 @ 10:36 PM
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originally posted by: Zanti Misfit
a reply to: Xcathdra

Suppose in the process of Burning a Flag , someone is Burned , or something Catches on Fire ? a Public Hazard IMO , other than being a Very Stupid form of Public Protest Protected by a Constitutional Right . What does it Accomplish ? Absolutely Nothing other than SHAME and a Lack of Respect for a Nation that Gave that Freedom to Burn it by the Blood of it's Patriots .

BULLCOOKIES. They are supporting the patriots because more than likely the flags were made in china.




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