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Trump suggests jail, loss of citizenship for burning U.S. flag

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posted on Nov, 29 2016 @ 11:12 AM
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a reply to: RomeByFire

Agreed completely. Caring about flag burners is so low on my priority list that it wasn't even something I had thought about in DECADES.




posted on Nov, 29 2016 @ 11:13 AM
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On a more important note, how does Trump feel about bra burning?



posted on Nov, 29 2016 @ 11:13 AM
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originally posted by: rockintitz

originally posted by: Krazysh0t

originally posted by: rockintitz

But the act of burning the flag shows such contempt for one's own country. At the very least you should be barred from holding a government job or public office if caught disrespecting the flag.

That's easy. Just don't vote for that person. That'll bar them from office really quickly.


You're right, and I wouldn't. But some people still might.

Overt actions against the flag of your own country show that you do not have the capacity to work for its best interests. IMO that should be grounds for disqualification.


But it isn't and our country doesn't work that way. So it is on YOUR personal responsibility to ensure you don't vote for that person instead of forcing the government to care about you being offended by someone else' (non-violent) actions.



posted on Nov, 29 2016 @ 11:13 AM
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a reply to: RomeByFire




Forget all of the soldiers, marines, airmen, etc who have lost their lives in a proxy war fighting against an enemy that's been armed, trained, and funded by their own government.


Yep, the traitors are the flag burners.



posted on Nov, 29 2016 @ 11:13 AM
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you people claim "freedom of speech" but what are you saying by burning the flag? these people you see burning the flag are usually dumb*** kids claiming "oppression".



posted on Nov, 29 2016 @ 11:14 AM
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originally posted by: Greggers
On a more important note, how does Trump feel about bra burning?


My guess would be that it depends on the bra size.



posted on Nov, 29 2016 @ 11:14 AM
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originally posted by: ware2010
you people claim "freedom of speech" but what are you saying by burning the flag? these people you see burning the flag are usually dumb*** kids claiming "oppression".


In America, people have a long-standing human right to be "dumb kids making stupid claims."

It's called college.



posted on Nov, 29 2016 @ 11:15 AM
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originally posted by: ware2010
you people claim "freedom of speech" but what are you saying by burning the flag? these people you see burning the flag are usually dumb*** kids claiming "oppression".

Irrelevant. The message is unimportant in regards to speech being free. All speech is free even the most absurd. If I have to abide by KKK or nazi members having rallies down the middle of main street in some town then you can abide by some triggered douche burning a flag.



posted on Nov, 29 2016 @ 11:15 AM
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a reply to: ware2010

Exactly. So focusing on this is a tune up wag the dog. Can't wait for the feature presentation



posted on Nov, 29 2016 @ 11:17 AM
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a reply to: eNumbra

Veterans do it after a service is performed to properly show respect to the symbol of our country.



posted on Nov, 29 2016 @ 11:20 AM
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originally posted by: luthier

originally posted by: Vasa Croe

originally posted by: anotherside
Flags have proper handling rules, if a flag touches the ground it's a symbol of defamation, and if memory serves me right, a flag can be burned as a symbol to respect it, so this will go nowhere, he needs to consult the military or scouts for more info.


I think the main argument is that it is protected under US law now...the right to burn the flag.

It appears most are under the impression it was always this way and it wasn'the.

The argument became, as it always does, about the fact that nobody did what the law said and nobody was held responsible for not doing so and it would have been too hard to finally uphold a law, similar to gun laws, so we changed it to make it easier and not have to deal with it.

Wussification is going to ruin the US eventually.


Really?

Slaves were not always free, woman couldn't vote or have bank accounts, schools were segregated, children could work in coal mines.

If you want to form a solid argument it's not based on having had better morality at the time the flag was considered sacred.

In fact in Ww1 and 2 Blacks fought came back and had to eat around back in mess halls after everyone else ate.



I'm not arguing wrongs done to people. I do have morals and it's sad that those folks didn't back then. This is about respecting a symbol of freedom for me.

And please don't compare this symbol to others that have been used for tyranny and have long been gone. Had that been the case with the US flag it too would be long gone. Burning something gets nobody anywhere except for emotionally charging those opposed....it is directly used for that. It is used because someone is at a point when they feel like their not heard in the true instances of it happening. It is used by others simply as a tool to evoke a reaction....and typically to evoke a aggressive reaction.

It is doing the very thing the left says they are against in order to get a reaction that they can then whine about and say others are not tolerant. Provocation gets nobody anywhere. If that Provocation leads to death, as it has in recent protests/riots, then should I conclude that was the desired reaction?



posted on Nov, 29 2016 @ 11:20 AM
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One thing we should all be on board with is any government trying to clamp down on freedom of speech/expression to be resisted by any means necessary.

I am sure the Don may one day have someone in his inner circle who will slap some sense into him and explain to him shutting down expression that annoys him first is Despot level dictatorship, but also the precedence will shut down fox news as "hate speech" by some far left government in the future.

We all should stand together here...there is no way this is ever good..be it some right wingnut saying punish flag burners, or some left wingnut saying make illegal anyone purposefully not using someones preferred pronouns (Hi Canada)



posted on Nov, 29 2016 @ 11:22 AM
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a reply to: SaturnFX

Hillary Clinton co-sponsored a bill in 2005 to make damage of a flag and flag-burning illegal, with penalties including prison and fines.

Why are people slamming Trump for this?



posted on Nov, 29 2016 @ 11:23 AM
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a reply to: Vasa Croe

A symbol of freedom to you but want to repress freedom eh?.



posted on Nov, 29 2016 @ 11:24 AM
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a reply to: Profusion

Trump is stating his opinion and you know the old saying...opinions are like a**holes, everyone has one.
Get used to the fact that he has no filter and will say things that some people will not agree with. I don't agree with everything he says and I voted for him.
I find it amusing and slightly refreshing that he does not tow the politically correct line, I am tired of the PC nonsense that has infiltrated this country.
Now I think a year in jail is crazy for something like burning the flag but I do think it shouldn't be covered under 1st Amendment rights.
There is nothing sacred in this country anymore, it's become a sick free for all. It should be a crime for burning the flag, 6 month sentence community service at a VA hospital, 6 month sentence getting up at dawn to run the flag up a flagpole everyday at the nearest city hall or whatever it takes to make the offender think about what they have done and what the flag means to this country.



posted on Nov, 29 2016 @ 11:24 AM
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originally posted by: Vasa Croe

originally posted by: luthier

originally posted by: Vasa Croe

originally posted by: anotherside
Flags have proper handling rules, if a flag touches the ground it's a symbol of defamation, and if memory serves me right, a flag can be burned as a symbol to respect it, so this will go nowhere, he needs to consult the military or scouts for more info.


I think the main argument is that it is protected under US law now...the right to burn the flag.

It appears most are under the impression it was always this way and it wasn'the.

The argument became, as it always does, about the fact that nobody did what the law said and nobody was held responsible for not doing so and it would have been too hard to finally uphold a law, similar to gun laws, so we changed it to make it easier and not have to deal with it.

Wussification is going to ruin the US eventually.


Really?

Slaves were not always free, woman couldn't vote or have bank accounts, schools were segregated, children could work in coal mines.

If you want to form a solid argument it's not based on having had better morality at the time the flag was considered sacred.

In fact in Ww1 and 2 Blacks fought came back and had to eat around back in mess halls after everyone else ate.



I'm not arguing wrongs done to people. I do have morals and it's sad that those folks didn't back then. This is about respecting a symbol of freedom for me.

And please don't compare this symbol to others that have been used for tyranny and have long been gone. Had that been the case with the US flag it too would be long gone. Burning something gets nobody anywhere except for emotionally charging those opposed....it is directly used for that. It is used because someone is at a point when they feel like their not heard in the true instances of it happening. It is used by others simply as a tool to evoke a reaction....and typically to evoke a aggressive reaction.

It is doing the very thing the left says they are against in order to get a reaction that they can then whine about and say others are not tolerant. Provocation gets nobody anywhere. If that Provocation leads to death, as it has in recent protests/riots, then should I conclude that was the desired reaction?



I don't agree with or buy into one extreme or the other philosphy.

I don't think your average soldier cares at all. I do think they would rather not sit as a police officer in the third world and never signed up for that.

Liberal whiners and no more or less a noting than the right wing whiners.

The flag isn't America. The idiots making laws that don't reflect the people are the danger.

This is simply fodder distraction.

Plus it's an old supreme court case they don't get I've turned easily. Fighting for it is a complete waste of time in comparison to real issues.



posted on Nov, 29 2016 @ 11:24 AM
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originally posted by: Krazysh0t
a reply to: Vasa Croe

What are you talking about? You do know that in order for the SCOTUS to rule on something it must already be a law right. THUS if I point out a SCOTUS ruling then I am also acknowledging the existence of a law related to that ruling.


Yet you said this in response to my post?


originally posted by: Krazysh0t

That is a bull# story. I posted the Supreme Court ruling and discussion already in the thread and that issue wasn't part of it.


So which part of my post was a bullsh#t story?

And yes I am fully aware these things have to be law to be ruled on. Not sure what you're arguing here. I said it was a law and most don't understand that.
edit on 11/29/16 by Vasa Croe because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 29 2016 @ 11:26 AM
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a reply to: Vasa Croe

This part:

The argument became, as it always does, about the fact that nobody did what the law said and nobody was held responsible for not doing so and it would have been too hard to finally uphold a law, similar to gun laws, so we changed it to make it easier and not have to deal with it.

I contested the reason why the law went away not that it actually existed.
edit on 29-11-2016 by Krazysh0t because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 29 2016 @ 11:30 AM
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originally posted by: Sillyolme
a reply to: 4N0M4LY

Emotions have nothing to do with the law. I can burn it on my front lawn if I want.


Must be nice. If I burn leaves in my back yard I'm breaking the law. Maybe I should say I'm exercising my First Amendment right to protest Fall.



posted on Nov, 29 2016 @ 11:35 AM
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a reply to: ColdWisdom

The Supreme Court ruled that burning the flag is considered symbolic speech, and is protected by the First Amendment.

Donald Trump can not just override the Supreme Courts decision.


Facts and case summary for Texas v. Johnson, 491 U.S. 397 (1989). Flag burning constitutes symbolic speech that is protected by the First Amendment.



The majority of the Court, according to Justice William Brennan, agreed with Johnson and held that flag burning constitutes a form of "symbolic speech" that is protected by the First Amendment. The majority noted that freedom of speech protects actions that society may find very offensive, but society's outrage alone is not justification for suppressing free speech.


Facts and Case Summary - Texas v. Johnson



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