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I might have invented an over-unity device - design included

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posted on Nov, 24 2016 @ 05:32 AM
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originally posted by: swanne
a reply to: Bedlam

The thread would start initially twisted.


after all the initial twists are used up (energy stored in there as a starting condition), then all the twists are coming from the motor.


Good point. However, in practice, the motor will be adding twists at the same time the magnets are using them up. It's an intrinsic property of the design. So what then?


It'll take electrical energy to add twists. That energy is taken from the rotor, in the form of counter torque from the coils.

TANSTAAFL, I'm afraid.



It takes a long time for twists to get used up, especially if you use a long thread. With the motor adding twists periodically, you're bound to actually get as many twists (if not more) than what you've started with.


No, no you're not bound to. You're actually bound NOT to. It'll take more energy to add more twists than you can get from the twists untwisting.

A lot of perpetual motion machines are this way - they stick something in the loop somewhere that sort of obfuscates where the energy is coming from and going to - but that's just the smoke and mirrors part. In your case, the thread. Bedini likes batteries. Steorn likes time lags in magnetising materials, Bearden likes amorphous glass. But they're all distractions. They're the beautiful assistant you're looking at whilst the magician goes through the trap door.


edit on 24-11-2016 by Bedlam because: (no reason given)




posted on Nov, 24 2016 @ 05:32 AM
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a reply to: Bedlam

Even if it could slow the momentum of the magnets, which I concede is a valid point, it wouldn't remove the magnet's potential energy. The thing would keep on running as soon as the coils de-energise.



posted on Nov, 24 2016 @ 05:34 AM
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originally posted by: swanne
a reply to: Bedlam

Even if it could slow the momentum of the magnets, which I concede is a valid point, it wouldn't remove the magnet's potential energy. The thing would keep on running as soon as the coils de-energise.


Which sort of potential energy might that be?



posted on Nov, 24 2016 @ 05:36 AM
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a reply to: Bedlam

Um, gravitational?

The twisted thread has a weight at its end - it's, by itself, seeking to reach its lowest gravitational potential energy.


edit on 24-11-2016 by swanne because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 24 2016 @ 05:41 AM
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originally posted by: swanne
a reply to: Bedlam

Um, gravitational?

The thread has a weight at its end - it's effectively a pendulum, by itself seeking to reach its lowest gravitational potential energy.


Okay, it has reached its lowest potential energy, the thread stopped spinning, the magnet is at its lowest point.

What now?

Using stored energy to lift it back up? Well, there goes ALL of the stored energy + some because of losses.


Seriously, why are free-energy-people so fascinated about magnets? Whatever amount of energy you pull out of those systems, you first had to put in to move the magnets in the correct position - there is never, ever anything to gain extra!



posted on Nov, 24 2016 @ 05:42 AM
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originally posted by: swanne
a reply to: Bedlam

Um, gravitational?

The thread has a weight at its end - it's effectively a pendulum, by itself seeking to reach its lowest gravitational potential energy.


If you have a free swinging pendulum, start it, and watch, what happens? Does it keep going forever, or does it come to a stop pretty quickly?

That will happen with either lateral or torque pendulums, the same thing happens. They don't return to their starting point, the energy is lost to dissipation in the string, the air and in your case, to the motor, wires, and coils. Eventually, the energy you put in as a starting condition is gone, and it grinds to a sad halt.



posted on Nov, 24 2016 @ 05:45 AM
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a reply to: ManFromEurope

Have you ever spinned a weight at the end of a thread?

Because of the helicoidal motion of the weight, the lowest potential energy point is pretty easy to overcome. Once it has reached the lowest point, the weight hardly comes to a dead stop. The weight will just keep on spinning because of its momentum.



posted on Nov, 24 2016 @ 05:45 AM
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a reply to: Bedlam

Not a pendulum! Check my edit

Sorry, wrong word, some things I still have to translate.
edit on 24-11-2016 by swanne because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 24 2016 @ 05:45 AM
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originally posted by: ManFromEurope
Seriously, why are free-energy-people so fascinated about magnets?


Well, they're cool, and it's a good spot for the smoke and mirrors to go in.

Not that the smoke and mirror insertion is necessarily intentional. It's just a point where it looks like it might do something, and after all magnets attract and repel, and bob's your uncle.

I spent a lot of time as a kid building various types. I never found the Holy Grail, although a lot of the ones I see now I did then in some form or other. I did, however, come away from that period with an appreciation for basic Newtonian physics and a lot of machine shop time that has stood me in good stead ever after, so you can't say it's a total loss.



posted on Nov, 24 2016 @ 05:46 AM
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Need some 'nothing' to create a void around something and then the energy won't leak out.

Voila



posted on Nov, 24 2016 @ 05:46 AM
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originally posted by: swanne
a reply to: Bedlam

Not a pendulum! Check my edit


It's actually a form of one. It'll spin down, then wind itself up, then spin down and wind itself up, and every time it does, it does so to a lesser degree, until it will finally unwind and stop.

You can also have a conical pendulum, where instead of swinging laterally, the tip of the bob inscribes a circle. They, too, will stop.

Anyways, I have to go code for a while on my personal 'perpetual motion' problem involving decrypting certain things by reducing them from NP to P, so I'll check in tomorrow. I'm pretty sure there's no solution. But like when I was a kid, I learn a lot by attacking it and failing.
edit on 24-11-2016 by Bedlam because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 24 2016 @ 05:50 AM
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a reply to: Bedlam

Hm, I've always thought of a pendulum as something that must necessarily swing.

Thanks for the info!



posted on Nov, 24 2016 @ 05:55 AM
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originally posted by: ManFromEurope
Seriously, why are free-energy-people so fascinated about magnets? Whatever amount of energy you pull out of those systems, you first had to put in to move the magnets in the correct position - there is never, ever anything to gain extra!


Then there is gravity... I would love to see this working!

www.rarenergia.com.br...



posted on Nov, 24 2016 @ 05:58 AM
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a reply to: hellobruce

Yeah, that's pretty weird.

Hehe, Are they planning on making it roll down a hill?



posted on Nov, 24 2016 @ 06:06 AM
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originally posted by: swanne

originally posted by: Bleeeeep
You spin the magnet one way and it feeds electricity to your capacitor, but if you spin it the other way, it leeches electricity from your capacitor or where?


Um... Aren't you forgetting the transformer??

That was the first thing about your drawing that I questioned.
It is a rectifier, not a transformer.



posted on Nov, 24 2016 @ 06:11 AM
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a reply to: Bedlam


Anyways, I have to go code for a while on my personal 'perpetual motion' problem involving decrypting certain things by reducing them from NP to P, so I'll check in tomorrow. I'm pretty sure there's no solution. But like when I was a kid, I learn a lot by attacking it and failing.


You and me the same.

I'm just glad to have written this thread and get it off my chest. Believe it or not I'm not really obsessed with free energy (I'm not, as ManFromEurope accuse me to be, "obsessed with magnets"), it's just that this puzzle was rattling around in my mind, and I needed some feedback about it. Your input was much appreciated, so I thank you! I really mean it: thank you.

I wish you luck with your coding! I am doing some coding myself (Javascript).



posted on Nov, 24 2016 @ 06:15 AM
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a reply to: butcherguy

Oh shlutz, you're right!

(yells in desperation: ) I've made a typo! Noooooo!




edit on 24-11-2016 by swanne because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 24 2016 @ 06:15 AM
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originally posted by: swanneHowever, if I am not missing anything, then this experiment might very well prove to be quite a groundbreaking leap.


A magnet on a string?



posted on Nov, 24 2016 @ 06:18 AM
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a reply to: GetHyped

I can't stop laughing at how bluntly you've put it.


Though in truth it's just a tad more than that.
edit on 24-11-2016 by swanne because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 24 2016 @ 06:24 AM
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distance x force = work

work = distance x force

distance = machine

force = force



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