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The Poverty of Jesus Christ

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posted on Nov, 22 2016 @ 08:40 AM
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Rather then coming in material riches worthy of God, Jesus wholly embraces poverty. Stooping from the unimaginable infinity of His Divinity, God takes on the limiting poverty of humanity in the Incarnation. Jesus stoops to the lowest entry point of humanity, bypassing earthly riches and power, coming as a helpless child born to a young woman and an earthly father who is a “backwoods” carpenter. Jesus, the God of the Universe, allows Himself to be further bound in swaddling clothing, helpless and poor. His early life is spent on the run as a refugee in Egypt.

When He launches His public ministry, Jesus lives a life that embraces poverty. After His baptism, Jesus goes into the wilderness, living as a starving person might, without food for forty days. He lives the life of a poor itinerate preacher, walking on foot for thousands of miles and often sleeping outdoors. He lives with the poor, heals the poorest of the poor, the blind, the lame, the lepers and the possessed. He lives like the homeless, saying, “Foxes have holes, and birds of the air have nests; but the Son of Man has nowhere to lay his head” (Matt 8:20). Jesus tells the rich young man to give away all his possessions and to follow Him (Luke 18:22). He applauds the destitute widow who, even in her poverty, gives a penny to the Jewish treasury (Mark 12:42-44). Prior to Holy week, Jesus spends time in Bethany (from the Aramaic, meaning “The House of Poverty”). Jesus dies like a common criminal, stripped bare, beaten and hung on the Cross and watches the soldiers gamble for His robe, His one material possession (John 19:23-24).

There can be no denying that Jesus Christ embraces poverty and that “poverty” is one of the core messages in the Gospel; Jesus preaches a Gospel of Poverty. Jesus comes to “preach good news to the poor” (Luke 4:18). “Jesus shares the life of the poor, from the cradle to the cross, He experiences hunger, thirst and privation” (CCC 544).

LINK


I believe the issue of Jesus' poverty is an elephant in the room that a lot of Christians treat as if it didn't exist. It certainly doesn't fit with the message of prosperity preachers in my opinion.


www.youtube.com...

My conclusion is that Jesus' poverty was based on the fact that one of his core stances was the repudiation of the corrupt values of men and the evil systems that come as a result. I discussed some of my views about that in the following thread.

'Give back to Caesar what is Caesar's', a recipe for revolution?

This is one area that I admire about Jesus' message. It seems to me that he was a good example of what it frequently takes to leave the matrix. It takes total dedication and often a tremendous amount of sacrifice.
edit on 22-11-2016 by Profusion because: (no reason given)




posted on Nov, 22 2016 @ 08:47 AM
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Jesus's message and the people who deliver it are two different things. No one can live up to his perfect example, but some preachers (Creflo Dollar, for example) are shamefully giving Christ's followers a bad name.

There isn't much in Jesus's message not to like. I wish everyone would take the time to read about him straight from the source before deciding what it is to be Christian.

Blessings to all.



posted on Nov, 22 2016 @ 08:57 AM
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Yeah but
Though I too am disgusted by the Hinns, the meyers, the Joe Princes and others of their kind as you seem to be, we can't not recognize the common need for money
Providing that God is first in your heart.
We live in times and with family where we need money, work hard for it earn it and God won't be offended. We are not Christ who can be itinerant, heal, forgive.
Responsibility so are important

Now as for render
Remember the image part of the statement, Who's image are we created in, Gods
Who's image is on the coin, Caeser, give the world what it's due
Who's image are we created in, Gods

We are Gods, give to God what is due to Him, ourselves.
Think about it
It's a spiritual lesson, not a civil lesson, it's about offering ourselves to God, not money to the authority's



posted on Nov, 22 2016 @ 09:17 AM
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According to the Bible Jesus said "the love of money is the root of all evil" not Satan, or lucifer but "THE LOVE OF MONEY" So mega churches? EVIL AS #### Any preacher who wears nice clothing or has many possessions = a poser. Of course Jesus also approved of slavery so his morality, atleast by modern standards is questionable imo. But then in my opinion Yaweh IS the Devil. Cheers
edit on 22-11-2016 by 191stMIDET because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 22 2016 @ 09:19 AM
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originally posted by: 191stMIDET
Of course Jesus also approved of slavery so his morality, atleast by modern standards is questionable imo.


Source?



posted on Nov, 22 2016 @ 09:20 AM
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a reply to: Profusion

I will gladly unburden you of your riches, so as to make you more christlike. Shouldn't you be more concerned with proving his existance rather than attributing certain personality quirks to him?



posted on Nov, 22 2016 @ 09:22 AM
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originally posted by: zosimov

originally posted by: 191stMIDET
Of course Jesus also approved of slavery so his morality, atleast by modern standards is questionable imo.


Source?



Source? Jesus Christ. . . . . .read the Bible friend. Jesus used the slave and master analogy many times when teaching.



posted on Nov, 22 2016 @ 09:24 AM
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originally posted by: 191stMIDET

originally posted by: zosimov

originally posted by: 191stMIDET
Of course Jesus also approved of slavery so his morality, atleast by modern standards is questionable imo.


Source?



Source? Jesus Christ. . . . . .read the Bible friend. Jesus used the slave and master analogy many times when teaching.


I believe the word you're looking for is servant? Not the same as a slave. As a matter of fact, Jesus pointed out that he came to serve man, rather than be served. Which is exactly he did.



posted on Nov, 22 2016 @ 09:25 AM
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a reply to: Profusion
The doctrine that Jesus and his disciples lived in poverty became contentious in the early history of the Franciscans. It helped to cause a split between the "Spirituals", who wanted to continue living in poverty, and the "Conventuals", who wanted to allow at least corporate property-owning. In fact the teaching was declared heretical, by papal decree, in 1323.

I would see his poverty as the side-effect of what he was doing, rather than something pursued for its own sake.
But the "prosperity gospel" is certainly very dubious, based (like so many modern trends in the American church) on over-literal application of the Old Testament.



posted on Nov, 22 2016 @ 09:26 AM
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a reply to: zosimov



Quoting Rabbi M.J. Raphall, circa 1861:

"Receiving slavery as one of the conditions of society, the New Testament nowhere interferes with or contradicts the slave code of Moses; it even preserves a letter [to Philemon] written by one of the most eminent Christian teachers [Paul] to a slave owner on sending back to him his runaway slave." 1



Paul's violation of the Mosaic Code on slavery:

While in prison, Paul met a runaway slave, Onesimus, the property of a Christian -- presumably Philemon. He sent the slave back to his owner. This action is forbidden in Deuteronomy 23:15-16:

"Thou shalt not deliver unto his master the servant which is escaped from his master unto thee."

"He shall dwell with thee, even among you, in that place which he shall choose in one of thy gates, where it liketh him best: thou shalt not oppress him."

Rather than give the slave sanctuary, Paul returned him to his owner. Paul seems to hint that he would like Philemon to give Onesimus his freedom, but does not actually request it. See the Letter to Philemon in the Christian Scriptures.



posted on Nov, 22 2016 @ 09:27 AM
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That is Paul, and a rabbi's interpretation. Not Jesus's.



posted on Nov, 22 2016 @ 09:34 AM
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a reply to: Profusion

Was Jesus poor?

Earthly things, I always considered the image humans were made in was a reference of the mind. The things we can be capable of and learning. We eat very real foodstuffs for the hunger of our earthly bodies, knowledge is consumed for the being. The only physical representation of knowledge is forms of written communication and it's upon the observer to understand or manifest that knowledge into reality.

You can tell the birds those worms in the garden are yours, possibly even teach it so... But the birds will never know land ownership, its a human concept as we know it. Even if you ignore the Bible and Jesus most things we attribute with wealth or value is mostly down to knowledge, what we can do with such commodities. The crow might hold value to precious metals to adorn it's nest but to the rest of the birds it's just a shiny object with little or no use.

Point being, poverty and wealth are subject to change depending on knowledge princibly. For the most part all earthly things are useless anyway if you do not know what to do with such commodities, that includes the human concept of money.



posted on Nov, 22 2016 @ 09:39 AM
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Like so many other messages,Modern churchianity has reinterpreted this too. The change came when the word greed was changed to thrift. That way we can have all the money and stuff we want and still be ummm, "christian", i.e., christ-like.



posted on Nov, 22 2016 @ 09:48 AM
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a reply to: Profusion

I am conflicted with the portrayal of Jesus being a poor person . At His birth there were gifts brought to His Mom and Dad that were fit for a King .Gold being one of the gifts may have been a large quantity but we are not told . Surely it would have been enough to pay the way to and from Egypt while providing for a modest life . The solders gambling for His robe would suggest it was not some rags He wore but something of value .

His 40 days of fasting was not a man starving but a man on a mission .He could turn water into wine and fed thousands with bread and fish . If He needed a coin he could muster one up from the mouth of a fish . He was entertained by rich people .Now about his side line as a carpenter well it would provide a income .Just because he lived in a poor part of the country did't mean He had no money like a poor person might

There is no doubt that there are today different gospels being preached and the message to the listeners can be distorted but I feel your post is a bit of a distortion also . Even Jesus's disciples could not have been considered as coming from poverty as some were business men and Mathew worked for the Govt . Heck one of them had a money bag .Just my 2 cents



posted on Nov, 22 2016 @ 09:54 AM
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originally posted by: zosimov
That is Paul, and a rabbi's interpretation. Not Jesus's.
So, paul did not send the slave back to his master according to the words in scripture?
edit on 22-11-2016 by Woodcarver because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 22 2016 @ 10:12 AM
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originally posted by: Woodcarver

originally posted by: zosimov
That is Paul, and a rabbi's interpretation. Not Jesus's.
So, paul did not send the slave back to his master according to the words in scripture?


Paul didn't even know Jesus. He was not Jesus. We can see multiple examples of the disciples "getting it wrong" because they are human and subject to human limitations.




posted on Nov, 22 2016 @ 10:31 AM
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originally posted by: zosimov

originally posted by: 191stMIDET

originally posted by: zosimov

originally posted by: 191stMIDET
Of course Jesus also approved of slavery so his morality, atleast by modern standards is questionable imo.


Source?



Source? Jesus Christ. . . . . .read the Bible friend. Jesus used the slave and master analogy many times when teaching.


I believe the word you're looking for is servant? Not the same as a slave. As a matter of fact, Jesus pointed out that he came to serve man, rather than be served. Which is exactly he did.



No, slavery was normal back then. Jesus was talking about slavery.



posted on Nov, 22 2016 @ 10:35 AM
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Rising On The Third Day... Literally... Is The Full Measure And Weight Of His Majesty.
Those Whose Time Has Come... Who Condemned Him... Did Not Find Forgiveness.
They Became His Servants... Slaves... And His Heart Did Not Break When Their Everlasting Torment Was Inflicted. The Parting Of The Temple... And The Parting Of The Curtain... Was Only The Beginning. Those He Saved... Were The People Who Saw God's Glory.... Hell On Earth Is Real.

As For The Prosperity Pleasure Seekers.... God Himself "All Knowing That He Is" Is Believed To Have Promised: "Glory, Power, Honor, 'Riches', And Life Everlasting... And An Inexplicable Amount Of Virgins" (Sex?)... For Him That Keeps His Faith To The End... Wherein Found Is A Seat At His Right Hand. So.... I Kinda Lose The Point Of OP. No Offense...

Thanks OP.... That Was Admirable.



posted on Nov, 22 2016 @ 10:37 AM
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originally posted by: zosimov

originally posted by: 191stMIDET

originally posted by: zosimov

originally posted by: 191stMIDET
Of course Jesus also approved of slavery so his morality, atleast by modern standards is questionable imo.


Source?



Source? Jesus Christ. . . . . .read the Bible friend. Jesus used the slave and master analogy many times when teaching.


I believe the word you're looking for is servant? Not the same as a slave. As a matter of fact, Jesus pointed out that he came to serve man, rather than be served. Which is exactly he did.


I didn't mean that Jesus (if he did exist) owned slaves, I'm saying Jesus was well aware about slavery as it was everywhere 2,000 years ago and he never condemned the practice. It was normal so ol' Jesus never said it was bad . . . . Wich it is. If you actually think you are a Christian then Read the whole 'effing Bible ALL OF IT. Study it, analyze it, don't just except it on blind faith, question the "Good" book. And if u feel God would be angered by any of that, well then, find a new God.



posted on Nov, 22 2016 @ 10:38 AM
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originally posted by: Profusion

I believe the issue of Jesus' poverty is an elephant in the room that a lot of Christians treat as if it didn't exist.


Ha. Yup. Renouncing your reliance on material possessions, in my opinion, is often the last step towards a complete communion with God and a liberation from this matrix (Matthew 19:21). We think we possess material things, but these material things possess us - this was the repugnant idol worship that detracted attention and faith from the Most High.

Why do we work for things that spoil? The old testament was a great foreshadowing of what is to come - and it seems as though our times are requiring a new exodus. An escape from the material minded enslavement of Egypt into the Promised Land.

"Just as Moses lifted up the snake in the wilderness, so the Son of Man must be lifted up, that everyone who believes in Him may have eternal life." John 3:14-15

It is our duty to stop feeding the malignant system of Babylon that is leading the people astray. we who received this calling are compelled to forego a new service-based independent society where the ideals of the Christ can be perpetuated so that our Passover into the New Kingdom will be without distraction. Be strong - Pharaoh is reluctant to let his slaves go.



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