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Fake News, Trump, Deny Ignorance and ATS

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posted on Nov, 18 2016 @ 11:06 AM
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originally posted by: Ohanka
Presumably fake news refers to CNN, ABC, MSNBC etc. etc.


First off, "cable news" is really more partisan infotainment than anything else. Secondly, I'd still put all of them, even Fox — whose top show is the punditry of Sean "I never claimed to be a journalist" Hannity — up against any popular "alternative media" source.

The biggest fraud of them all is that the alternative media is in any way, shape or form better when they are in fact worse across the board with a very few exceptions.

EDIT:

I probably should exclude Sean Hannity specifically as he's pretty much the "alternative media" on prime time mainstream "cable news."
edit on 2016-11-18 by theantediluvian because: (no reason given)




posted on Nov, 18 2016 @ 11:09 AM
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a reply to: Indigo5

Of course we support our members. I'm a ATS moderator, but that's 2nd. I'm a member first.

However, keep in mind: Just because someone declares something does not make it so. This is why we (staff) discuss things first and do things by consensus, and is also why we do not always act quickly.

Mistakes are made mostly when things are done in haste.

I know some out there think we should take care of things quickly and just on their say so. But that's not how staff here works.

As a staff member I expect my fellow staff to question everything I say too. If I think something needs to be removed, but others disagree, that is a GOOD thing! It means that we can act as a sounding board for whatever it is we are going to do. I would much rather have my fellow staff members agree with me on something before I take action. However, I'm grateful that they are also there to disagree with me if they do. This ensures that we are doing things as fair as we can.

I know some on here think we lean one way or another as far as politics go. It's really funny when they think that because nothing could be further from the truth! We are so diverse back here that there is no way we could be biased, except for ATS itself. That is one thing we all back here are biased about: We love ATS very much and will do anything to help this site.

So just remember: if it seems we are taking a long time to do something, it's not because we're ignoring it, or that we are biased one way or another on it. It's most likely because we are discussing it, and we are scattered all over the US and the world. Takes time.



posted on Nov, 18 2016 @ 11:15 AM
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Deny ignorance ? yes ...Deny fortunate results ?.....NO....The political arena is ALL one big GAME BOTH sides play. Fake news was used and promoted by both sides as a weapon.
HE STATED:
"I thought they’d fact-check it, and it’d make them look worse. I mean that’s how this always works: Someone posts something I write, then they find out it’s false, then they look like idiots. But Trump supporters — they just keep running with it! They never fact-check anything! Now he’s in the White House. Looking back, instead of hurting the campaign, I think I helped it. And that feels [bad]."
One side's game blew up in their face and actually HELPED the other side....I'm sure there can be an example found of a game the other side played that had the same results too....
Perhaps there's a moral to this story for both sides to face....

"I would prefer even to lose with honor than to win by cheating.
Sophocles



posted on Nov, 18 2016 @ 11:23 AM
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a reply to: Vechthaan


I think the biggest irony of the sentiment that fake news "won Trump the election" is that if people really understood what and who they were voting for (full transparancy on both sides), Hillary wouldn't even be running, she'dd litterealy be thrown in jail.


And Donald Trump wouldn't be? Lol. There was ZERO transparency from Trump. He just kept yelling about how "unfair" the media was as he spouted lie after lie and completely dodged any vetting at all.


But if by now, you still don't understand the implications of this election


I think it's you who is deluded about the implications of the election much like you're deluded about your sense of being part of some consensus of "99%" of people. Exchanging corruption for worse corruption isn't an improvement anymore than exchanging the bias, sensationalism and misinformation in mainstream media for the far worse bias, deliberate disinformation, far more extreme sensationalism and outright fabrication of "alternative media" is an improvement.

Worse yet, the stampede toward ignorance drove the herd right off the cliff into outright fake news that abandons even the most miniscule modicum of integrity. We're not talking "spin" anymore, we're talking big, bold lies.
edit on 2016-11-18 by theantediluvian because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 18 2016 @ 11:29 AM
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a reply to: eriktheawful

ATS is the only forum I post on.

It is due to the standard of veracity that the forum has held to.

There is without a doubt a tidal wave of dishonesty and propaganda washing over our country right now.

We have a President elect who has dismissed protestors as paid-professional agitators, has accused his opponent's father of helping to assassinate Kennedy based on a tabloid and at the same time threatened to legislate a loosening of libel laws so he could legally suppress "unfair" stories about him....and that is our President.

Behind him is an Alt-Right movement who regularly strategizes on Reddit and other boards how to construct fake stories and stats to further sew division and intolerance. I have visited those boards and it is frightening in how they gleefully trade ideas about lies to broadcast in support of their agenda.

Then you have pure capitalists in Europe who simply are making click-through money with fake news that the public wants to hear.

And a US citizenry that is being told by their President not to trust "mainstream media" as defined as any media that challenges he or his message.

Are we are flirting with an era where truth and facts are "alternative"...

I guess I am hoping the ATS community, despite what I have seen this past election, becomes a lighthouse in the storm.



edit on 18-11-2016 by Indigo5 because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 18 2016 @ 11:36 AM
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originally posted by: SaloonSal
Deny ignorance ? yes ...Deny fortunate results ?.....NO....The political arena is ALL one big GAME BOTH sides play. Fake news was used and promoted by both sides as a weapon.


Define fake? Trumps words?

False equivalence again in service of defending lies.




HE STATED:
"I thought they’d fact-check it, and it’d make them look worse. I mean that’s how this always works: Someone posts something I write, then they find out it’s false, then they look like idiots. But Trump supporters — they just keep running with it! They never fact-check anything! Now he’s in the White House. Looking back, instead of hurting the campaign, I think I helped it. And that feels [bad]."
One side's game blew up in their face and actually HELPED the other side


If you are arguing that his attempted mockery was in bad taste or had no place in political discourse, I would agree..

It was never his intent to have the story accepted as fact. He thought it was satire.

But NO, Both sides did not embrace, propagate, share, re-tweet and cite Fake News to lie to their voters through social media and from the podium.



posted on Nov, 18 2016 @ 12:04 PM
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"SIDES" is not the word "Candidate" ...But as reference to VOTERS (THE PEOPLE) on both sides of the political battle..NO WHERE DID I INDICATE THE CANDIDATES

"It was never his intent to have the story accepted as fact. He thought it was satire"
Now tell me again exactly WHO is guilty of "False equivalence again in service of defending lies" ??????



posted on Nov, 18 2016 @ 12:20 PM
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Few seperate incidents.

www.breitbart.com...

nypost.com...




All these reports of hate crimes after Trump wins election, all so far turn out to be hoax's as usual. The left just can't let it go and accept the election can they?



edit on 18-11-2016 by iTruthSeeker because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 18 2016 @ 12:41 PM
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a reply to: Indigo5

I think we need to start with the premise that the GOP did not heed the warning by William F. Buckley, Jr. 50 years ago to never give power to their John Birch Society fringe nonsense conspiratorialists. (note, the left equivalent was never allowed inside the Dem party). Alex Jones (infowars, prisonplanet) seems to be the main purveyor of this paranoid craziness, and of him Trump has said, “Your reputation is amazing. I will not let you down.”

We are now not just in a post-truth era, but will soon be a nation under the control of a GOP that was taken over (after years of funding media and politicians) by the Koch Bros, whose extreme economic and John Birch Society ideology is now mainstream. (The senior Koch helped fund the JBS in the 1950s).

The fake info voters have spoken. We now know what we are up against. There is no reasoning with these people. They are the true believers of unreasonable, irrational nonsense... and truly believe they are right.



posted on Nov, 18 2016 @ 01:10 PM
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originally posted by: iTruthSeeker
Few seperate incidents.

www.breitbart.com...

nypost.com...




All these reports of hate crimes after Trump wins election, all so far turn out to be hoax's as usual. The left just can't let it go and accept the election can they?




THE VIDEO YOU JUSTED POSTED TO DISMISS MY OP...???

CLAIMING the two students who spray painted Swastikas were actually Liberal, Jewish, Hillary Supporters???

FAKE NEWS...




Mike Huckabee apologized for posting a false news report blaming “liberal, Jewish” students for an alleged hate crime that involved a mention of President-elect Donald Trump.

The story, appearing on the Conservative Tribune website, blamed an attack in March at Northwestern University on “liberal, Jewish Northwestern students” seeking to smear Trump and his supporters.

Daily News columnist Shaun King exposed the story’s false claims on Wednesday, and Huckabee removed the post from his Facebook page, and apologized on his website.

“They accused me of spreading false information and hatred, and demanded an apology,” Huckabee said of the Daily News. “And they’re right, I do owe readers an apology."

www.jpost.com...



posted on Nov, 18 2016 @ 01:11 PM
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a reply to: eriktheawful

Not to belabor my point...but see above..Ironic.



posted on Nov, 18 2016 @ 01:14 PM
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In their hate for mainstream media, conservatives rushed into the arms of a just as much if not more corrupt media. The lies are just pointed in a different direction.



posted on Nov, 18 2016 @ 02:47 PM
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a reply to: underwerks

What's interesting to me is that the "established" media arm of the Republican party conservatives, Fox News, has been usurped by media even further along the right, the fringe, the alt right. Bannon's Breitbart, Alex Jones's media. Not what one would normally include in "mainstream", let alone journalism. It is not necessarily "corrupt" in the sense of money, but a distorted media.

But now, this fringe distorted, fact free media is being pushed as the new normal established media. It is the media of the reactionary right! (And by definition, reactionaries hate liberals and all things liberal.) The only thing I can compare it to would be as if the American Communist Party took over the Democratic Party and wanted their own media as the established media. .... lol of course, there was no Koch sugar daddy to do that on the left.

As one can easily find now, here and elsewhere, there are reactionary Americans who truly hate (or people who have been told to hate) liberals and all things liberal. (They will call John McCain liberal!) They will read and repeat John Birch Society conspiracies as if they were truth, they will hold fast as a flat Earther to their viewpoints. There is no arguing or reasoning with this mindset.

John Birch Society Ascendant in Trump’s Speech to Evangelical Christians

Oh, Buckley pointed out their illogical reasoning, the Birch fallacy

"The fallacy is the assumption that you can infer subjective intention from objective consequence: we lost China to the Communists, therefore the President of the United States and the Secretary of State wished China to go to the Communists." ...and the JBS went on to label Eisenhower a Communist.



posted on Nov, 18 2016 @ 03:45 PM
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a reply to: Indigo5

Same here.

When I saw the delusional Ford tweet by my POTUS-Elect, I can only consider that we will all be subjected to more delusional and fact-free announcements going forward, whether it be in a tweet, press release, or speech. And these false proclamations will indeed be clickbait for fake news sites, and also forwarded from legitimate news sites if reported as is, without countering the delusion or lies, or at worst cut and pasted without the countering.

If sound is harnessed in a certain way, it can kill. If words are used in a certain way, they can destroy a democracy.

‘Language: A Key Mechanism of Control’

What happened 20 years ago paved the way for this loosening of what it means to be truth.



posted on Nov, 18 2016 @ 03:57 PM
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Same old liberal MO. Don't agree with the liberal talking points then your an idiot, liar, bigoted, anti semetic, xenophobic, blah blah blah.

Yet the lame stream media who has major methods of distribution has propagated all kinds of lies and dis information.

Here is how it goes:

Obama says it
New York Times regurgitates it
All the other online and news orgs jump on the band wagon to re inforce it.

If you ask me it's amazing Trump won considering the liberal machine that is in place!

Good riddance to all that nonsense!

Funny cause on another post I read people can't download the brietbart iphone app as it just magically vanished!

It is amazing the reaching going on by the left about now!



posted on Nov, 18 2016 @ 04:26 PM
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originally posted by: Indigo5

originally posted by: apydomis
So people voted for trump because of lying news outlets?


"people" is a big word when talking about 61 Million people.

But put it this way...if just 1 out of every 100 Trump voters didn't vote or voted for Hillary...she would have swept the electoral college.

So yes...given the diversity of intelligence in our population, and the way in which these fake stories indisputably motivated people (the very reason Corey L. Kelly Anne C. and Trumps sons tweeted them to followers) and razor thin margin...it is not a reach at all to argue fake news played a significant role in his election.


Hmmm, but you could also say the same about Hillary couldn't you? I mean the Wikileaks deal was very big. There was a lot of corruption and collusion exposed in those emails and most outlets ignored them entirely. If even 1 person out every 100 who voted for Hillary decided not to in disgust or voted Trump ... Hillary might not have won the popular vote.


We can play would have, could have games like this all day, but in the end, it was issues and Hillary's out of touch demeanor as well as her being a representation of the status quo that ultimately lost her the election, not fake news.



posted on Nov, 18 2016 @ 04:56 PM
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originally posted by: apydomis
So people voted for trump because of lying news outlets?


Pretty much.

Pope Francis Shocks World, Endorses Donald Trump
900k shares on Facebook.

FBI agent suspected in Hillary email leaks found dead in apartment in murder-suicide
The link is dead now though, you can find all sorts of other articles about the fakeness of that article. 567,000 shares on Facebook.

WikiLeaks CONFIRMS Hillary Sold Weapons to ISIS… Then Drops Another BOMBSHELL!
789,000 shares on Facebook.

Rupaul claims Trump touched him inappropriately in the 1990s

I mean...this is just 4 stories. There have been dozens, if not hundreds this election cycle. Some of them are very, very proud of their work; Fake News Site Southend News Network Claims Full Responsibility for Donald Trump Victory



posted on Nov, 18 2016 @ 04:58 PM
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a reply to: links234

Why would people vote for Trump if he touched Rupaul inappropriately?



posted on Nov, 18 2016 @ 05:06 PM
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a reply to: ketsuko

That was an anti-Trump example. I was trying to be fair. Do you want me to take it out?



posted on Nov, 18 2016 @ 05:31 PM
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a reply to: Indigo5

What I find ironic is the fact that if the Clinton News Network and all other branches of the M.S.M. had reported the truth Clinton would have never been the Dem. candidate.

We are supposed to believe that just because Facebook ( another branch of the M.S.M) says that their news is more accurate than some on the right we are just supposed to believe them?

On a brighter note: Don't worry there is a mourning period for any one that loses something ( In this case the election). It will pass in time. Unless the Clinton machine finds a way to bypass the will of the states.

Maybe Mark Zuckerberg needs a coloring book some play-doh ,or a puppy to make him feel better.

As a side note. The link isn't from one of your so called fake sites.

linkl

Zuckerburg is working with the Clintons. Why should we care what he thinks. If he continues to push his agenda Facebook will become just another MySpace.
edit on 18-11-2016 by Diisenchanted because: edit to add

edit on 18-11-2016 by Diisenchanted because: edit to add



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