Will USA vice president-elect bring 'controversy about evolution' into schools in USA??

originally posted by: knoxie
dumb down America - yay.

Putin is laughing his ass off.

Laughing all the way to the bank.

originally posted by: cooperton
of course they should. The best thing that happened to spirituality was when religion was being questioned - when people believe in things they don't understand, they suffer. Similarly, when people believe in theories that are incorrect and pervert their view on reality, they suffer.

The fact that any of you think that evolution shouldn't be questioned is evident of how the ominously dogmatic this theory has become.

I am not worried though, the truth will shine through eventually.

Topic is not if evolution should be questioned (by now you should know from many links here on ATS that it was questioned, tested and proven as working model ), but if there is controversy about it - which in scientific circles - there is no controversy.

How do you know you are not descendant of microbe from billion years ago? Did you read about it in some book, perhaps?

originally posted by: SuperFrog

Topic is not if evolution should be questioned

Yes it is. that is what your source was saying VP Pence would do - make it so that the curriculum involves questioning the theory of evolution.

(by now you should know from many links here on ATS that it was questioned, tested and proven as working model ),

If it was proven it would not still be a theory. Mutation through DNA could not be responsible for the development of the immense complexity of epigenetics, neural systems, or any organ system for that matter. Piece-by-piece mutation cannot create interdependent systems because the whole has to be intact, otherwise it is insufficient and does not work. For example, if you intend to make a clock, placing one gear on the floor is not going to have any funcitonal purpose - all pieces need to be present for it to work.

there is no controversy.

The unscientific inquisition has ensured that no dissenters of evolutionary theory ever gain popular ground in their priesthood. That is why It would be great if VP Pence made it so that these ideas were questioned.

How do you know you are not descendant of microbe from billion years ago?

Because an origins model that relies on matter for its basis does not make sense regarding the perceptions I have experienced. A world of Spirit exists and could not have evolved from the random workings of matter.

mes should be questioned, in the very same classrooms where those questions are supposed to be answered. you cant learn if you don't ask questions right? go ahead, try and poke a hole in it. it is not the leading theory for nothing. no better place to get your facts straight.

originally posted by: cooperton

If it was proven it would not still be a theory.

We went through this many times, and no need to repeat - you know by now what theory mean in science.

originally posted by: cooperton

originally posted by: SuperFrog

Topic is not if evolution should be questioned

Yes it is. that is what your source was saying VP Pence would do - make it so that the curriculum involves questioning the theory of evolution.

(by now you should know from many links here on ATS that it was questioned, tested and proven as working model ),

If it was proven it would not still be a theory. Mutation through DNA could not be responsible for the development of the immense complexity of epigenetics, neural systems, or any organ system for that matter. Piece-by-piece mutation cannot create interdependent systems because the whole has to be intact, otherwise it is insufficient and does not work. For example, if you intend to make a clock, placing one gear on the floor is not going to have any funcitonal purpose - all pieces need to be present for it to work.

there is no controversy.

The unscientific inquisition has ensured that no dissenters of evolutionary theory ever gain popular ground in their priesthood. That is why It would be great if VP Pence made it so that these ideas were questioned.

How do you know you are not descendant of microbe from billion years ago?

Because an origins model that relies on matter for its basis does not make sense regarding the perceptions I have experienced. A world of Spirit exists and could not have evolved from the random workings of matter.

...huh, well in that case, all religious schools should adjust their curriculums to include a class taking a real hard critical look at creation stories and divine phenomena. to keep it educational and whatnot.

originally posted by: 11andrew34
As crazy as your boogeyman theory is here, sadly it is exactly what has been holding up reforms for decades. Ironically, your idea is unscientific. No evidence supports that it will happen. No evidence supports that it has happened wherever school choice reform has happened.

Look for example at college education, where school choice is 100% of the market. No, Notre Dame and Brigham Young do not teach that evolution does not exist etc. So even most schools with some significant religious affiliation are not the nightmare you are concerned with. Would you be willing to close most colleges just because of a few outliers like Liberty University (the Jerry Falwell one, iirc)? There's really nothing to be afraid of. There are already standards even for home schooling and opening up the market for schools will not exempt anybody from accreditation issues.

I'm not talking about college, I'm talking about publicly funded schools for children. These are the schools that build the foundation of knowledge and critical thinking skills. What are you going to do when some 30% of college applicants are taught intelligent design over evolution as scientific fact, and want to pursue a career in science?

We have academia for a reason. I don't think it is wise to let community leaders decide what to teach children as far as science goes. I would give them an option to have a religion class that teaches about various religions. If you give them the power to arbitrarily decide what counts as science it creates a major issue.

What your irrational fears are standing in the way of mostly is allowing young, brilliant teachers from good schools to get together with a few like minded colleagues and start their own schools that get better results by providing kids with access to the latest and greatest in education reforms and advancements. They can have more say on spending as well as pedagogical philosophy and practice. With a school choice system in place, they can take initiative and make real progress for improving things for kids.

IMO, it's bad enough that colleges are businesses purely out for profit. Turning children's school into a business could be disastrous, and it's not irrational fear. If the goal is simply to get more students, I could see schools actually getting worse because the standard of education will diminish. I could see schools pandering to the parents' religion to attract more students. The schools that don't pander to religion will fail, even if they have better educational standards, because you have a majority that is religious.

Honestly, I'm just worried Pence might try to push legislation through that tries to ban evolution or teach "alternatives" in school if he becomes president. I haven't really studied the school choice concept.