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You Can Believe in Jesus Without being a Christian

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posted on Jan, 25 2005 @ 06:29 PM
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Thank you jj and Duzey,

You have said it much better than I. It should be pretty clear now how we are all Christians. I will affirm I have the same beliefs about Jesus that you do.
Duzey, A little misconception there. Catholics do pray to God. I have never prayed to the Pope. We do believe that he has been placed here by Jesus as the leader of our Church on earth.

Depending on the fact that Mary is in heaven along with many Saints, not just the ones who have been named, we ask them to pray to Jesus as intercessors, adding their prayers to ours.

jj: I do know that Protestants believe that Mary is the mother of Jesus. I probably did not word it right. How glorious it is at Christmas time to see Mother and Child honored every where. The wonderful hymns telling of the birth of Christ and the Glory of God. We all share that.

Now another myth is that Catholics are brain washed from birth. I cannot answer to birth Catholics. I am a convert to Catholicism. I wasn't converted to be married in the faith either. I went on a search because I had a big ole hole in my heart. I chose to be a Christian Catholic. St. Augustine?




posted on Jan, 25 2005 @ 06:40 PM
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Originally posted by Mahree
Duzey, A little misconception there. Catholics do pray to God. I have never prayed to the Pope. We do believe that he has been placed here by Jesus as the leader of our Church on earth.


I didn't mean that you prayed to the Pope, but that Catholics believe the Pope is 'above' them in the chain of command. Protestants do not. To a Protestant, no man is more holy than any other and to elevate a man above others is not the true teachings. Just a little misunderstanding is all. I was never a Catholic, so I'm not too sure exactly what he 'does' for the religion, aside of guidance, and settling disputes.

As my grandfather would say, 'Protestants eliminated all the middle-men'. That's why they don't have "Hail Mary's" and that sort of thing. They feel all prayer, worship and reverence should be for God and Jesus only.

worldwatcher, I'm sorry your thread appears to be in the process of being jacked.

And no JJ, I didn't mean you. I know it's Jake



posted on Jan, 25 2005 @ 06:56 PM
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Originally posted by Duzey

Originally posted by Mahree



I didn't mean that you prayed to the Pope, but that Catholics believe the Pope is 'above' them in the chain of command. Protestants do not. To a Protestant, no man is more holy than any other and to elevate a man above others is not the true teachings. Just a little misunderstanding is all. I was never a Catholic, so I'm not too sure exactly what he 'does' for the religion, aside of guidance, and settling disputes.


Yes, you have this correct



worldwatcher, I'm sorry your thread appears to be in the process of being jacked.


OK WW I'm out of here. Sorry that I bothered you. I didn't mean to get off your track. It just isn't right to make a statement that is incorrect about someones religion. That is all I was trying to correct. You can call it semantics if you want. I know that I am a Christian.



posted on Jan, 25 2005 @ 07:09 PM
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Yes, worldwatcher made a slightly incorrect statement regarding the beginning of Christianity, and it was good to point it out, I just thought that maybe we were getting to far into differences between different branches of Christianity, when the whole point of her post was that people should just accept others beliefs as their reality, and not judge them based on that.

If you wanted to start a thread about the misconceptions held regarding the differences between Catholics and Protestants, I would be happy to contribute and I'm sure many others would, as well. I just thought we were straying to far away from the original topic.



posted on Jan, 25 2005 @ 07:09 PM
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Originally posted by Duzey
They feel all prayer, worship and reverence should be for God and Jesus only.


Most sects of Christianity believe this. This was what caused the huge rift in the church during the middle ages.

Now, the status of Pope being higher than man should be addressed, although this is an internal debate, meaning one of doctrine and interpretation of scripture. Not a fundamental fault in the faith. In Luke 11:9-10, Jesus is answering a question about how to pray. This is Him speaking below.



"So I say to you, ask, and it will be given to you; seek, and you will find; knock, and it will be opened to you. 10 For everyone who asks recieves, and he who seeks finds, and to him who knocks it will be opened"


That statement was, by no means, exclusive. I'll admit, I know little about Catholic doctrine except for what I've gathered from Catholic friends. I'd be curious to know the Biblical basis for the Pope, or if he is purely a creation of doctrine.


And no JJ, I didn't mean you. I know it's Jake


...erm...huh? That's got to be one of the most confusing pairs of sentances I've ever read


EDIT: Boy, don't I look like a JungleJerk for perpetuating this after all those statements...That's what I get for running down and grabbing a bite to eat then finishing off my post. Ah well, y'all have to live with it


[edit on 1-25-2005 by junglejake]



posted on Jan, 25 2005 @ 07:12 PM
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Originally posted by junglejake
[...erm...huh? That's got to be one of the most confusing pairs of sentances I've ever read


Sorry, I just got a good chuckle out of you getting upset at LadyV earlier when she accidentally used the word jack. I wanted to avoid the same misunderstanding.


For those who missed his cough-syrup induced high...

www.belowtopsecret.com...

I know you're not really a bad guy.

[edit on 25-1-2005 by Duzey]



posted on Jan, 25 2005 @ 07:42 PM
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The new religion He began was Christianity.

actually it was Paul that started the new religion, Jesus advocated a return to
an older, purer Judiasm.




Catholics were the original Christians.

this too is inacurate as stated. The church of Rome was the first GOVERNMENTALLY ACCEPTED Christians. there were many other groups
of Jesus followers that were later branded heresies because they did not agree with the RCC, but have as good or better claim to validity.





I believe that tolerance would begin if you stopped making the assumption that Catholics are not Christian. Or else at least give me your basis for your statements.


there are many sects that claim christianity that would agree with this statement. Jack Chick and Tex Marr and their groupd come to mind off the top of my head. IMO WW simply said christian and was thinking protestant.
even there there are sects of protestants that think other protestants aren't christian.

[edit on 25-1-2005 by stalkingwolf]



posted on Jan, 25 2005 @ 07:55 PM
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Originally posted by stalkingwolf
actually it was Paul that started the new religion, Jesus advocated a return to
an older, purer Judiasm.


Erm...Not really. I don't remember reading anything in Deuteronomy about worshipping a Messiah and praying to God through Him. Plus, He (Jesus) removed the Sabbath commandment. He did advocate a return to where Judiasm used to be, but he added several new elements to it. He did not, however, create a new religion. This is true. He expanded on Judiasm, but the Jews rejected it so they came up with a new name for themselves. In all respects, Christians are really true Jews, while those claiming to be Jews are, in fact, missing half of their God's message.



posted on Jan, 25 2005 @ 08:30 PM
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He expanded on Judiasm,

true. this may be a more accurate way to phrase it.

here is something I like and may be what WW was trying to get across.

All Gods are One


Well, it had been yet another bad day in the office,
and once again it was the fault of that new girl,
Mary Anne. She is one of those Pagans, a so called
witch. How can anyone in their right mind make this
claim, knowing that it goes against God and all of the
teachings of the Bible?

She doesn't even have the common decency to keep her
satanic symbol, her pentagram necklace hidden from the
view of the decent, God fearing people in the office.
She has some nerve. I find that I cannot hate her
for this though, for I know that she has been
deceived. Satan works his evil in ways that she
cannot see. I've seen that so called Wiccan Rede that
she has tacked to the wall above her computer.
On the surface, it looks like a decent loving belief,
but all one must do is look, look closely and see that
by practicing this way, and not embracing Jesus
Christ as savior, she is on the pathway to hell.

As I've said, it was a bad day in the office. Three
times in the past few weeks I have been called in to
see my supervisor, and he has told me that I am not
allowed to preach to Mary Anne the word of God, to show
her the error of her ways. Today, my supervisor told
me that if I continue to "harass" Mary Anne, he will be
forced to terminate me. How can he say this? He
himself is a God fearing man. And, how can he be so
tolerant of the evil that he sees insinuating itself
into our workplace?

As I lay down to sleep last night, I asked the Lord
for guidance. "God, grant me a true vision of you, so
that I may better lead the faithless onto the
righteous path." "Oh, a true vision of Me is it?
Are you sure that you're ready, truly ready to see, my
son?"

I sat bolt upright in bed, and there, at the foot of
my bed, white of hair and beard, in a long, flowing
white robe, stood the Lord my God. I made to leap from
the bed and fall to my knees in front of Him, but he
stopped me with a gesture. "Kneel not before me at
this time my son. Instead, rise and walk with Me, so
that you may get a glimpse of what I truly am, as you
asked of me in your prayer."

He took my hand, and as I looked, my bedroom was no
longer there, but a pathway thru the woods. We started
to walk, and I was too awestruck for words. We took
the path to the left, and we were then inside St.
Catherine's Church, in the middle of a service. While
still standing beside me, God seemed to expand and
fill the whole of the church. I could see smiles of
contentment forming on some of the parishioners faces.
I felt blessed. God smiled upon me.

"The Catholics hold such pretty masses, don't they? I
like to stop here in this church, because not only do
they speak the words, but they live the life, thru
teaching, helping the sick and poor, not only with
handouts, but helping them learn to help themselves.
Now let us walk on."

And we were back on the pathway. We traveled a bit
further along, and then were in the parlor of a
funeral home. A young woman was kneeling before the
casket, resting her head on it and crying. I could see
by the similarity, that this dead man must be her
father. God knelt bedside her, and drew His arms about
her. "Miss him, that is all right, but weep not for
him, for now he is with Me." She wiped her eyes, and
stood with a sad smile upon her face, and said
"Good-Bye Daddy. I'll miss you." and turned and left
the room.

And we were back on the pathway. We walked a little
ways, and we were in front of a large lodge of
some kind. I could hear music and laughter spilling
out of the window. I turned to look at God, and was
shocked to see, not the flowing white robe, but Him
wearing leather and animal furs, his hair and beard
now the color of wheat, and a sword strapped across
His back. He strode forth, and I saw him approach a
figure I had not seen before. As I looked close, I was
shocked to see that it was the same face that I had
just seen dead, but looking young and strong, and
dressed in ancient looking garb, an ax strapped to his
waist. God strode up to him and grabbed him in a great
bear hug. "Welcome my son. We've been waiting for
you. Now, go inside and raise a cup or two, and meet
with your brother." And, with a hearty slap on the
back, he sent the man inside. And then we were back on
the pathway.

We walked a bit further, and then we were in a mosque.
At least I believed so, as I had never been in one
before, but had seen pictures of them. The group of
worshippers was not large, but I could see their rapt
faces as they listened to the mullah speak. He was
speaking to them of purity, both of the mind and the
body, bringing them closer to Allah. And as he spoke,
God, dressed now in the robes of the desert, walked
among them and briefly laid his hands upon each set of
shoulders. And, from their faces, I could see that
these men knew that the words of the mullah were true,
and that their spirits felt touched by God. And then
we were back on the pathway.

After we had walked a bit, we found ourselves in an
African village. People with skin as black as night,
the women with their breasts shamefully bared, were
dancing in a circle, to the rhythm of the drums being
played by a group of men. Somehow though, I was not
offended by the bared breasts, and the music seemed to
seep into my soul. God was then a mighty lion, and He
let forth a mighty roar. The villagers did not seem
to hear, but the drums increased their pounding, and
the dancers danced with a frenzy. and then we were
back on the pathway.

We walked a bit more, and were on the top of a cliff.
There sat, painted and covered with feathers, an old
Navajo man. As I watched, he seemed to change into
the form of an eagle and take flight, and we were
flying with him, soaring high into the air, seeing the
vista spread out below us. And God, in the form of an
eagle Himself, seemed to guide this other eagle thru
the air, over mountains and thru valleys, until he
came upon a group of men. As I watched, the old Navajo
man was no longer an eagle, but a young boy instead,
and he sat at the feet of these men, to listen to the
words of his elders. And then we were back on the
pathway.

We traveled a bit, and then we were in a forest
clearing. I knew this place. It was known as a place
of devil worship and evil. In the center of the
clearing roared a great bonfire, and kiwi torches
outlined a circle of sorts. Inside this circle, in a
circle themselves, stood 7 men and 6 women, dressed in
robes of varying colors, their arms raised to the
moon. Was that one woman Mary Anne? I really couldn't
be sure. And God walked among them in the circle,
touching each one. He seemed not to be an older
man now, but as he made each of three turns around the
circle, he was first a young girl, bouncing with
energy, then a woman of middle years, with a tender
smile for all Her children, and finally, an old woman,
body bent, but holding Her head up with pride. And a
woman stepped forward, and yes, it was Mary Anne, and
lifted her head to the sky. "Great Goddess, Mother of
us all, thank you for joining us tonight. Stay if You
will, go if You must. Know in our hearts You will
always be welcome. Blessed be!!"

And we were back on the pathway. As we walked along,
ahead in the distance I saw the most beautiful man.
Yes, beautiful, though I would never normally think of
a man this way. With blonde hair, and a golden robe,
he seemed to radiate sunshine. God and this golden man
nodded to each other as they passed, sharing a smile
together. "My Lord" I asked, "was that an angel?"
"Well, yes, he is known as that to some. He is also
known to some as a god himself. That was Lucifer."

And His words caused me to stumble. I couldn't believe
that we had just passed the ultimate evil. God looked
at me, and He knew my mind. And he chuckled a bit.
"Think about it logically My son. The Lucifer that you
know is a fallen angel, cast out of heaven for
challenging Me. If I am the all powerful being, above
all others, how could he do this? How could I allow
it?" "But, the Bible..." I stammered. "The Bible is a
wonderful book, as are the Koran and the Torah and
many others, but they are just books, written by the
hand of man, not written by Me. And, it's a bit
confusing as well if truth be known, but that's not up
to Me to fix. These books are wonderful, but only as
guidance, for each man and woman must think for
themselves." And, I believed He was right in this.

"Now, come forth, we must journey a little more before
you go back." And He took my hand once again. As we
followed the pathway, we soared thru the stars,
listening to the music of the heavens, we became a
little flower and a mighty oak, we became a babbling
brook, and a mighty ocean. We flitted from flower to
flower as a little honey bee, and ran across the
plains as a mighty stallion. And, all too soon, the
pathway returned us to my home. God held my hand a
moment longer, and smiled into my face, "My son, you
prayed tonight for a true vision of Me. For vision,
you must only open your eyes and see what there is to
see. Good night to you."

And then He was gone, and I was back in my bed. A
dream I thought, only a dream, that couldn't have been
real. At that time, a bolt of lightning lit up my room
thru the window, and thunder crashed thru the sky, and
I thought I heard, from seemingly far away, "Remember,
the Lord works in mysterious ways My son."

This morning as I entered the office, I went to the
machine for a cup of coffee, and standing there, I
spied Mary Anne. As I approached her, I could see her
barely cringe, and I could see in her face that she
was expecting yet another onslaught from me and my
book. She seemed to cast her eyes about for a way to
escape, but there was none. I walked up to her and
smiled. " I think I owe you a bit of an apology" I
said. "I've been a bit narrow minded of late, and I
really had no right to subject you to what I did. It's
not up to me to say how you find your path to your
spirit, and I was wrong to think that was so."
Mary Anne just stood there, not knowing what to say.
"So, I just wanted to say that I'm sorry,
and I hope you will forgive my trespass. God bless you
Mary Anne, and...uh...Blessed Be?"

You know, I always thought that it was just a saying,
about people's jaws dropping to the floor, but
Mary Anne did her best at that moment to prove me
wrong...



posted on Jan, 25 2005 @ 09:25 PM
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What a enlightening thread this is.

WW started this with a graceful post, and the story of Gods Many faces a perfect parable. When i was young used to think we would be judged by a tableful of spirits; one from each religion. Any one of them could veto the path your soul continued on.

Paul did influence the doctrines of Christianity far more than Jesus did, and what a shame that is. Jesus's teachings lean towards Buddist concepts more than technicals of Popular Christianity. God Blessed Solomon so much he could speak directly to Nature itself, which could be termed as Pagan. These overlaps continue throughout the Bible, the Koran, and all major belief systems. The line where one Belief system Ends, and another begins is what keeps organized religions in Business. for that is what they have become, Businesses.


There are incredibly blessed people posting on these threads, wonderful souls. If they call themselves Pagan, Witch, Christian, Buddist, Catholic, Muslim, Orthodox, (fill in the blank), what do i care. Their souls shine just as bright.



posted on Jan, 25 2005 @ 10:03 PM
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Originally posted by toolmaker
Paul did influence the doctrines of Christianity far more than Jesus did, and what a shame that is.


Yes, Jesus set up the foundation, and Paul build a house on it. I've always been able to relate to Paul moreso than any of the other major players in the New Testament because, like him, I was an antichrist before I became a Christian. antichrist meaning I was against anything and everything Christian until Jesus dropkicked me in the head (anyone remember the song?
)

I do have a problem with the second half of your statement, though. From a Biblical stand point, God wanted Paul to do this. That's why He came to him, that's why He blinded him, and that's why He restored his sight. So in that respect, what Paul did is exactly what God wanted to happen.

From a perspective that discounts the Bible, but still accepts that there is a God above who wants us to know him, how weak would this God turn out to be if He sends His Son/Himself to Earth, and before His throne in Heaven is warm, someone has already hijacked His faith and turned His people away from him. THAT'S a lightning bolt style smiting if I ever heard of one.

So maybe in your eyes it's a shame Paul came along to guide the church and turn it into that which is described in the second half of the New Testament, but I highly doubt it is a shame in God's eyes. That was too major of an event to allow someone to desicrate it as some claim Paul did. Heck, God came to Earth as flesh for the first time so far as any of us know. Why would he let some dude persecuting Christianity destroy that which he wanted to establish?



posted on Jan, 25 2005 @ 10:41 PM
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Originally posted by worldwatcher
Not only can you believe in Jesus without being a Christian, You can also believe in Allah, Buddha, Krishna, Brahma, Shakti, Devi without being of any particular religious persuasion.

I am really getting tired of all this religious bickering among humans. It bewilders me that more people cannot open their eyes and see that you can accept a philosophy, be tolerant and understand a philosophy without becoming or needing the religious name tag associated with it.

Look at Hinduism, it believes in One Supreme Being, yet it understands that humans need to see "God" in a way they can relate to, so a myriad of avatars are available for worshippers. The same can be said on a broader scale, if you believe in any "God" you will acknowledge his/her complexity and unmeasurable power, you will also acknowledge that every creature in this universe is a creation of "God". So how can you not accept that "God" portrayed himself in various ways to give his message to his creations. Imagine a circle with God in the center, you can approach him/her in any direction. The key to remember here, is that while there is only One God, there is uncountable paths that lead to him. No message hold more importance or significance than another, no religion is better than another. Man has corrupted the true philosophy of religion to further their own gains. As long as you follow the tenets of being a good person and the basics in regards to morals that most religions agree on, you are on the right path. You do not need ritualized worship, but if it makes you feel good, then that's the path for you. You can be an atheist and still find "God" in the end. You do not need to believe in God, if it doesn't fit your life. Just live a good life and in your next, perhaps you will no longer see the need to be an atheist.

It is time we all open our eyes and see that no one is right and no one is wrong when it comes to religious persuasion. In this life I may be a Hindu, but in my last I could have been a Christian and maybe in the next I will a Muslim. We are born into different religions or influenced by circumstances outside ourselves that cultivate what religion we choose to practice. But inside we are all the same, we are human, with a intelligence we don't yet fully understand or are quite capable of comprehending as of yet.

I was born a Hindu, I practiced hinduism most of my life, but I was also baptised in a church twice, once as a Catholic and once as a Christian, blessed and saved by a muslim mejji, shared Hannukah prayers with my Jewish friends, I see the beauty and truth in all religions. In my own family I can find the full spectrum of religious beliefs and non beliefs, yet we are related by blood. I see the fundamental message that "God" gave us all, I only wish all of humanity could see the same thing I see.

Maybe then we will realize it is not our duty to cast judgement, convert or distance ourselves from others due to the tag of religion. Maybe we will realize religion is a personal thing and can finally work towards understanding how much we are alike instead of looking at our differences.
Remember the "God in I" and start within, you will no longer need to look at others and what they believe in.

sorry for preaching, but it wasn't meant to be a sermon of any kind, just something I have always wanted to say.


I think your a little bit backwards in peace there, sonny boy. the world will NEVER be tolerant. of course u dont have to be religious to belive Jesus, or Buddha or whatever existed. but if u belive IN them, then yeah, u gotta pretty much be religious. your saying all religions are equal and beautiful?? well what if lets say the christian God (protestant) is correct, and u dont meet the requirments of being "saved from hell"? so, according to the religion u go to hell. and IF that religion is TRUE, then theres NO exceptions.
to say that all religions are equal and "beautiful" would be to say that no religion is correct, only what u belive. well if theres a God, theres an absolute(s) and what God says goes, and these people CANT compromise what they say, or else God LIED then, and God doesnt lie. so shove that little preppy talk of equality up your u no what because they belive God said it, thus u can argue it, or claim other religions are just as equal.



posted on Jan, 25 2005 @ 10:53 PM
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Only God and Jesus can judge who is really a "Christian." Just because someone says they are Christian or Hindu or Jewish or Buddhist or whatever else doesn't mean they sincerely embody the ideals of that religion.

Many "Christians" are like frothing-at-the-mouth rabid beasts that will tear you to pieces if you don't think like they do. Jesus would never do that. He was "tolerant." Over and over again, he proved through his actions that he was tolerant, gentle, kind and understanding.

Why can't more "Christians" be like that?



posted on Jan, 25 2005 @ 11:01 PM
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Originally posted by Slicky1313
well what if lets say the christian God (protestant) is correct, and u dont meet the requirments of being "saved from hell"? so, according to the religion u go to hell. and IF that religion is TRUE, then theres NO exceptions.


In the more liberal Protestant churches, as long as your not running around killing and pillaging, you pretty much get a free pass to Heaven, if that is indeed what happens after this life. And if you were running around killing and stealing, you would only need repent to Jesus to be forgiven.

Most every Protestant church I've been in takes as the main rule of thumb Matthew 7:1, 7:2. You know, that part about none of us having the right to judge any other, because only God can judge. If only one sect, be it whoever, gets in to Heaven, it's going to be a boring, boring place. But at least they will have the satisfaction of knowing they were right, I guess.

And I'm not going to worry about it too much, because according to the Jewish, all Protestants are already going to Hell. I honestly don't think 'God' cares how you worship him, only that you do.



posted on Jan, 25 2005 @ 11:07 PM
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Originally posted by brygivrob
Many "Christians" are like frothing-at-the-mouth rabid beasts that will tear you to pieces if you don't think like they do. Jesus would never do that. He was "tolerant." Over and over again, he proved through his actions that he was tolerant, gentle, kind and understanding.
Why can't more "Christians" be like that?


Aite, I'm going to start with the begining of this quote which I agree with. (Guess which part I don't
) This is very true, many people who claim to be Christians are very angry people, but I'll bet if you took a percentage, it would match that of the secular world. It just so happens the angry ones tend to be louder and get more attention. Plus, and this is the sad part, when you meet a Christian that is tolerant, gentle, kind and understanding, it doesn't stick out in your mind. When you meet someone claiming to be a Christian who's a complete prick, that sticks in your mind.

As for doing things Jesus didn't do, well, Jesus was perfect and, by golly, I sure as heck am not. I do things Jesus wouldn't ever do, and I do things Jesus said not to do. I see they're problems, and am trying to correct them, but it's a huge pain in the butt. I recently quit smoking (new years rez, still holding). To anyone who thinks smoking is the most addictive habit out there (it is more addictive than heroin), try quitting pride. HOLY COW!

But I digress. Jesus was "tolerant"? He was tolerant of those who kept the law or tried to keep the law. But look back to the passage where he happens into the temple and sees the money changers. I dunno, wreaking up a temple because they're not doing what your Father said they should do seems pretty gosh darn intolerant to me. Jesus was very intolerant and very judgemental. However, he would not rebuke people the way many do today. Though he thought you were wrong (intolerance), he would explain this using compassion and kindness, and often a parable. However, He was, in no way, tolerant of those violating God's law. Jesus Christ knew there was good and there was evil, and ignoring the evil isn't going to help anything. He would address and rebuke it, but the harshest thing he would do to an individual is to call them a fool.

So no, Jesus wasn't tolerant, but he was compassionate. You can be both. He saw good and evil, and said he was here for the evil, not the good.



posted on Jan, 25 2005 @ 11:11 PM
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And since we're discussing the differences between Judaism and Christianity (probably in more detail that ww ever wanted to know
), I thought I should point out that there are in fact, Messianic Jews. They are Jewish, but believe the Jesus Christ was the Messiah. I'm still trying to understand their beliefs fully, but I just thought that was so cool when I found out.

How's that for religious tolerance? If we can have Jewish people who believe Jesus Christ was the son of God, then surely we can agree to disagree? or at least not trample all over each others beliefs.



posted on Jan, 25 2005 @ 11:21 PM
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Originally posted by Duzey
In the more liberal Protestant churches, as long as your not running around killing and pillaging, you pretty much get a free pass to Heaven, if that is indeed what happens after this life. And if you were running around killing and stealing, you would only need repent to Jesus to be forgiven.


Ahh, but now we must address the concept of repentance. It doesn't say just ask for forgiveness, but to repent. Repenting means to ask for forgivness, and then to move in such a manner as to remove the sin you consistantly commit out of your life. Yes, you repent to Jesus, and even if you killed 1.5 trillion people you're still forgiven. I heard a great song today on K-LOV about this, What Sin. All about forgiveness and Jesus replying, after your repentance, "What sin?".

As to the criteria to get into Haaven, JEsus states it pretty clearly in John 3:18:



"He who believes in [Jesus] is not condemned; but he who does not believe is condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God."


the criteria is pretty straight forward from the Christ's mouth. Steal all you want, if you believe in Christ you're still saved. Yet, when you truely believe in Christ and love Christ, you will have no wish to steal. John 14 clarifies that point for y'all.


But I must sleep now. See y'all tomorrow.

Rock, rock on!
JJ



posted on Jan, 25 2005 @ 11:24 PM
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Duz, check out www.jewsforjesus.com... . The thing is, the way the world is set up now, there are no Jews who believe in the Messiah. That's the primary difference between a Christian and a Jew. As soon as you start believing Jesus was the Christ, you stop being a Jew and become a Christian. They can still call themselves Jews, but it's an inaccurate assertation if they're referring to faith.



posted on Jan, 25 2005 @ 11:28 PM
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Originally posted by junglejake
Repenting means to ask for forgivness, and then to move in such a manner as to remove the sin you consistantly commit out of your life. Yes, you repent to Jesus, and even if you killed 1.5 trillion people you're still forgiven.


Well, it would be more of a sure bet if you repented a couple of days before you died. Like most everything in life, it's all about timing.
Just say 'I'm sorry, I accept Jesus into my life' and then don't kill anyone for the next couple of minutes. I was brought up with very liberal beliefs, as you can see.



posted on Jan, 25 2005 @ 11:39 PM
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Originally posted by Duzey
Well, it would be more of a sure bet if you repented a couple of days before you died. Like most everything in life, it's all about timing.
Just say 'I'm sorry, I accept Jesus into my life' and then don't kill anyone for the next couple of minutes. I was brought up with very liberal beliefs, as you can see.


Hehe, well, that's Bart Simpson's plan. The only problem is that, well, tomorrow when I'm driving to work I could get myself all dead-like. Death typically isn't expected for folks in accidents. I don't plan on dying tomorrow, but it may happen. If I may quote Steven Curtis Chappman:



I’m living the next 5 minutes
Like these are my last 5 minutes
’cause I know the next 5 minutes
May be all I have


That's the way I try to live my life. Along those same lines, there's more:



Every moment God is giving is precious
Every heartbeat every breath I take
We’ll never have them back once they’ve left us
There will never be another right now
...

This is the day this is the hour
This is the moment the lord has made


To repent on your deathbed is to not accept the moments beforehand God put before you. Every breath we take is precious, so right now I'm going to use that breath to serve the Lord as best I can. Rock, rock on.



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