City vs Rural in election

originally posted by: burdman30ott6

originally posted by: kruphix
I think it is more of a case of Rural people being out of touch with modern society/culture.

It's no fault of their own, but major population centers are where culture and society develop...it takes awhile for it to filter into the Rural areas.

Condescending and Arrogant much? The social and cultural values of rural America are already well developed and require no filtering down from the urban hells dotting the landscape.

It's not condescending to speak the truth.

Like it or not, this is the way of the world. If you think rural America is exactly the same today as it was 20 years ago...you are just plain wrong.

Rural America progresses just as all society does, it just does it at a much slower pace and with a lot of reluctance.

a reply to: imjack

You're incorrect, as I have already stated. That said, I'm not too concerned with warped views of equality, which is what the modern usage of the word usually is... warped.

a reply to: kruphix

One man's progress is another man's regression..

originally posted by: burdman30ott6
a reply to: imjack

You're incorrect, as I have already stated. That said, I'm not too concerned with warped views of equality, which is what the modern usage of the word usually is... warped.

Every vote counts arguement = warped reality

a reply to: spiritualzombie

Their quasi racism isnt hate so much as it is a natural ignorance from simply being around mostly white people.

I had to smile at this.

I live in the country and you have it kinda right. The area I live in is quite diverse, and I haven't heard of any cases of overt racism, but I think it has something to do with the people not seeing their neighbors as a particular race.

Now when they speak of people on TV or in the city, they may talk about a Black fella, a Hispanic fella, or even a Oriental fella, but when they speak of their neighbors, it is my neighbor across the street, or my neighbor 2 streets over in the gray house.

It is really funny how people's minds work sometimes.

originally posted by: kruphix
It's not condescending to speak the truth.

Like it or not, this is the way of the world. If you think rural America is exactly the same today as it was 20 years ago...you are just plain wrong.

Rural America progresses just as all society does, it just does it at a much slower pace and with a lot of reluctance.

The small towns I've lived in for the last 14 or so years have been interesting. They're about 10 years behind the times in terms of technological adoption. I can still go wardriving on the streets to find open/WPA encrypted networks, and we're just now getting traffic light cameras with the attached debates as to their merits. It's like going back in time 10 years.

a reply to: NightSkyeB4Dawn

My town is 99% white, there's no racism because there's no one to be racist against.

a reply to: Aazadan
It used to be that way here but the new society and the new times, are rapidly encroaching on the quiet, laid back pastoral landscape. Orchards and fields of life stock are being replaced with gated communities. Well water is being replaced with forced conversion to city water. Dirt roads are being paved over, and neighborhoods are being invaded by trespassers that find it closer and easier to visit the woods. Why they don't for one second consider that the woods belong to someone, and they are camping out on someone's private property completely eludes me.



Aazadan, my town is predominately white also. I think the reason there is no reported cases of overt racism in my little section, is because the numbers removes fear of the minority. There is great suspicion of the stranger, regardless of color, but neighbors are just neighbors and security blankets, because in the country, neighbors look out for each other, even if they don't like each other.

a reply to: kruphix

It's no fault of their own, but major population centers are where culture and society develop...it takes awhile for it to filter into the Rural areas.

Sort of like test tubes and tissue cultures are where Anthrax develops... it takes a while for it to infect actual populations.

I'm sorry, but I have seen your version of 'culture and society' and would appreciate it if you kept it to yourself. The OP is right: laziness is a major component of the divide, and he should have mentioned ignorance as well. I've seen it happen my entire life. Someone from the city will buy a house out here and move in. They're so happy to be living next to nature, with clean air, open spaces, and friendly neighbors. Then they realize there's no pizza delivery. The nearest store is 5 miles away and all they sell is basics for farmers and soft drinks. They have to mow an acre of grass on the weekends. There's a snake in the backyard and a skunk in the driveway. The neighbor is target shooting and the cops don't care. There's a deer processor three houses down with this big bloody area in his yard and loud pickups keep bringing Bambi's mother, brother, cousins, nephews, aunts, and uncles in. The neighbor's dog just peed on their fence. The neighbor got mad because they called the cops on him for target shooting.

A few months later, the house is up for sale, the slickers went back where they came from, and all is peaceful again. Then the for sale sign comes down and another family of slickers move in. Lather, rinse, repeat.

Once in a while someone real will move in. Within a few months they're part of the community.

Here's some of the social progress you are so proud of, from someone who has seen the disease you're so proud of:

• Crime where there was none before.
  
• Interference with how people live their lives, on their property, in their community, by someone who chose to come to that community.
  
• Increased police work because they have to respond to complaints about things that were never a problem before.
  
• General animosity and suspicion toward newcomers.
  
• A lack of cooperation between people because of the last point.
  
• Widespread drug use.
  
• Dwindling farm land because slickers can't seem to live anywhere that crops don't grow.
  
• Interference with how others live (you can't raise pigs anymore because I don't like the smell around my new house).

Those are not good things in my book. Please, keep your social disease progress to yourself. We don't want it.

TheRedneck

a reply to: TheRedneck

Couldn't have said it better myself.

Nothing makes me angrier than folks moving to the country and the first thing they want to do is pave the roads, bring in gas stations, and a bunch of retail businesses.

I can understand them liking the convenience of proximity to life in the city. If that is what they want, then they should buy in the city. Not move to the country and convert it to the city.

City folks have a lot of misconceptions about the country. Their childhood memories are either faulty, or the purity of life in the country in comparison to life in the city, has been lost over the years.

They forgot about pulling fruit straight off the tree, biting into it, spitting out the worm and finishing the fruit. They forgot about pulling a tomato off the vine and wiping it on your shirt, to clean it before eating it. They forgot about walking the dirt roads at night with the only illumination coming from the stars and the moon.

Grant you, there was a lot less to be afraid back then. The stuff that is considered normal today wasn't even dreamed of back then, so I can understand some of their confusion, but they should remember enough to know that there is great differences between city and country life, and they should choose, not change.

originally posted by: NightSkyeB4Dawn
Couldn't have said it better myself.

Nothing makes me angrier than folks moving to the country and the first thing they want to do is pave the roads, bring in gas stations, and a bunch of retail businesses.

I can understand them liking the convenience of proximity to life in the city. If that is what they want, then they should buy in the city. Not move to the country and convert it to the city.

Why can't people want both? A home with some land, a yard, and quiet, but a 15 minute drive into town to get things.

Paved roads, fast internet, cable TV, these aren't things that shouldn't be available in only the city.

a reply to: Aazadan

We have paved roads. We also have gravel roads and dirt roads. It depends on how many people drive them.

We have cable TV... sorta. I have a dish in my yard to get satellite TV. Actually I have two, since my TV's are separated by something like 500 feet. DirectTV decided it was cheaper to add a second dish than pull lines.

I have fiberoptic cable running to my house, supplied by the local power coop. I get 30Mbps symmetrical. I also have two standard wifi signals and one high-speed signal.

The only difference is, I don't have neighbors within a few feet of me. To get to my closest neighbor, I have to cross ten acres of hay field. To get to my closest neighbor the other direction involves about a quarter-mile trek through virgin forest. So if I want wifi, I have to provide my own wifi. I have to find someone who will run the cable and set up a more powerful router to reach where I need it, and possibly even set up a few repeaters. It costs more. The same with TV... I pay more than my slicker counterparts because I need stronger equipment.

Technology has brought these luxuries to us even out here in the sticks. But it hasn't brought with it all of the problems associated with city life: the crime, the suspicion, the drugs. Those are carried by that infestation known as people, not by technology.

TheRedneck

a reply to: TheRedneck
Yeah it is pay as you go out here too.

I had to buy my own telephone and electric pole. I get no cell phone signal, even with Verizon. I had to buy my own satellite dish. Hughesnet is expensive and comes with a whole set of problems all its own, but it is all that is available. No cable or fiber optics are available in my area.

There are rural areas that are more urban than country, and then there are areas like where I am, that is pure country. My neighbors that have horses, don't want paved roads. We maintain our own roads so we get a bit miffed when people use them for recreation.

It takes 15 minutes to get to a paved road from my house, and the nearest store is about 25 minutes away, if the weather has been good. People can have what they want, and they should be able to live where they want. I just think it is no fair to move to an area where the people enjoy a rural lifestyle and then try to change it into an urban one.

a reply to: NightSkyeB4Dawn

People do it because they like having space. Cities mean having a tolerance for people and a lack of privacy. Eventually, a lot of people want something other than that. Even small towns don't really offer much of either... so they move out to the country. But, they still want modern conveniences, and as someone addicted to modern conveniences I don't think they're wrong to want them.

I'm more of a city person myself, but I've lived in small towns for the last decade+. I think a lot of people who move to rural areas would be happier living on the edge of a small town. You can have a decent amount of property, still be close to an urban setting, and have pizza delivery.

a reply to: Aazadan
Everything is changing. You can't stop progress.

My brother lives at the top of a mountain. When I used to visit I would look down and see nothing but forest. Now when I look down and all I see is streets and buildings. He is now stuck up there with what little wild life that survived, they have no place left to go.

I am watching the city move in on me like a rising tide. I live at the end of a road that dead ends at a huge canal. The wildlife have no place to go. We have to tough it out together. Looking at the planning map for future construction. We will be surrounded with 4 different gated communities and a huge village within 10 years.

I will be gone in 2.

a reply to: NightSkyeB4Dawn

We have paved roads here, mostly. I attribute that to how many folks are moving in. It's not all slickers either; a lot of it is just families growing. Side roads are still mostly gravel, though, and a lot of the driveways are dirt.

I get Verizon in most places in my house (I have to be careful on one side of my recliner), but there is a dead spot once you reach the blacktop. The fiber was something the coop came up with; we have areas you have to pump sunlight to that have high-speed Internet! Pizza delivery is actually available if you drive to town... they'll meet you at a big church.

I'm lucky; the population expansion has skipped me. We own 90 acres, and every neighbor owns a good chunk of land as well. There's not enough money to buy a single square inch of it.

I just think it is no fair to move to an area where the people enjoy a rural lifestyle and then try to change it into an urban one.

It's not just unfair... it's self-defeating. There's a reason the country has the charm it has. Remove that reason and you remove the charm you came for in the first place,

TheRedneck

I disagree with some of your list...

originally posted by: 19KTankCommander
1. Free handouts/ programs ect

Hang on there... there's a lot of free things in urban areas though you may not be aware of them, including county health clinics (I wrote code for one), ag extension agents and courses (etc), food stamps for the urban poor, Meals on Wheels and a lot of other things including programs unique to urban areas. I don't think that one area is advantaged over the other in the "free handouts" category - IF you know where and how to find the information.

3. Not keeping up with news (due to #2)

Disagree on this - city workers often brows the news at work and have those long commutes when they may be listening to morning news/morning programs and evening program and if you eat out or go to a bar, there's always a tv running. I would say that city dwellers have a bigger variety of news sources (in the past - not so much now) and are less likely to read/listen to Fox News. So their news focus may be different.

Keeping up with the Jones across the street

That's a family culture thing - not dependent on city or urban areas.

6. (no offense to anyone) Don't really know the meaning of hard work ( Farming, Logging ect)

I think that the people working two and three jobs would disagree with you - as well as construction workers, utility workers, police, firemen, hospital workers, and a whole bunch more.

And let's not forget that "rural" isn't all farming. There's shopkeepers (like the ones here in the city) and restaurant workers, etc, whose jobs are a bit slower paced than at popular places in the city.

7. 9-5 Job

Plus commute and ... oh wait! A meeting that runs overtime, and what about that document that the boss will be howling over tomorrow? And (teachers) prepping lesson plans and grading and... (etc)

8. Luxury of having everything at their disposable with in a short distance

Errrr... not to be offensive but where do you live? Here in Dallas, it can be an hour's drive to get to the other side of the city, and with traffic it can be 20 minutes to the nearest grocery store. We do have more and larger available to us but that doesn't mean it's a "short distance."

9. (again no offense to anyone) Liberals, don't shoot the wolfs, bears ,deer ect, they really don't see what damage they can do living rural

Well, if you take over the land and don't give the animals any place to live, they soon start invading the neighborhood. New York City might not have bobcats but they're not uncommon in southern suburbs and there are coyotes in the middle of Chicago. What we see, however, is that there needs to be space for the wild things AND there needs to be balance. Let the wolves live to take care of the excess deer - but manage wild spaces so that the cougars and bears stay away from humans.

10 Everyone just believes the local news and papers with out researching further

Uhmmmmm... this is a universal problem. I haven't seen any indication that rural people research more obsessively than anyone else.

I *would* say that rural people do NOT regularly come into physical contact with the wide variety of cultures and attitudes that we run into here in the cities. The internet closes this gap to some extent - but my graduating class (who live in mostly rural areas) have not come into as much contact with many Muslims, Buddhists, atheists, Pastafarians, etc (not to mention people from all over the world) as I have. They're less likely to have Muslim friends (I have several) or Black friends or Hispanic friends or Asian friends (we're all Caucasian.)

They have fewer job opportunities than I do. That doesn't mean jobs are easier to come by... just that there's more of them.

a reply to: Byrd

You totally nailed it. I agree with all your points and I have a lot of experience in both rural midwest and large city (Los Angeles).

I'll just add that from my own experience in these difference places, perspective appears very limited in the middle states-- and that's where we see all the Red.

Whereas along the east and west coast, where you have a lot more mixed cultures and where people have friends who span many different religions, ethnicities, cultures, and traditions; a more widened perspective of people, we see Blue.

a reply to: Byrd

While you do have good points, I will disagree with a couple of your responses:

That's a family culture thing - not dependent on city or urban areas.

While it may be true that jealousy exists as a part of human nature and not just a singular social aspect, it does appear to be more pronounced in the city. I guess maybe "keeping up with the Jones across the street" loses some of its priority when "across the street" is a quarter-mile away. Plus, there seems to be a higher priority placed on practicability in the country: what can you do with what you have, as opposed to what do you have. A couple examples:

My cousin runs a large farm. He has tractors you can drive a pickup under, his own fleet of semi's (grain haulers), private truck scales, several shops to do repairs in, and hires a large crew during growing season. I admire all that and would love to have a tractor, but I don't want the ones he has. I don't farm and don't want to farm. So there's absolutely no desire to "keep up" with him.

About a mile from me, a rancher has several hundred head of cattle, a few hundred acres fenced in, and some really nice equipment. I'd love to have a backhoe like he does, but I also realize that after a couple months of using it, mine would sit idle. His gets used all the time for repairs. There's no jealousy there.

I think a lot of it has to do with the 'mind your own business' attitude. There's always more than enough to do for oneself, which leaves no time to try and manage other people's affairs.

I think that the people working two and three jobs would disagree with you - as well as construction workers, utility workers, police, firemen, hospital workers, and a whole bunch more.

You obviously have never ran a large farm.

We may not move as fast as city folk out here, but we move more, and we have to do what has to be done. A farmer's day begins before sunrise... checking the equipment, attaching the tools... and ends after sundown only when everything is packed up and put away. No one is watching the clock; they're watching the sun. The tractors need to be in the field as soon as it's light enough to see and they don't stop until it is too dark to see. In between, if there's a breakdown, it is fixed on the spot. And trust you me, parts on a tractor are not light. We also have our fair share of construction workers out here, and almost everyone does some of their own construction work. I built my shop with my own hands, helped only by my wife and two young kids. That includes setting a massive box beam on top of it. Concrete work, roofing, and even carpentry are hard work, especially without a crew of strong backs.

In the city, you simply hire more people to handle the harder jobs, and my experience has been that construction workers don't work multiple jobs. Fast food workers, teachers, store clerks... they may work multiple part-time jobs. Plus, the attitude toward a job in the city is you put in your time and go home, whereas out here you finish the job before you stop. The clock will roll around again, but that sun and the seasons... they don't stop for you to call it a day.

Walk a mile in my shoes... then tell me who works harder. And I'm one of the 'lazy' ones out here. I don't farm.

TheRedneck

originally posted by: Aazadan

originally posted by: burdman30ott6
When was the last time you picked up a fishing pole

25 years ago when my dad took me fishing. I've since grown to dislike it. It probably doesn't help that I don't like fish.

whittled a stick

Never. I don't do things just to do them. I am perfectly content to sit and do nothing other than be alone with my thoughts.

filled a hunting tag

Never. Killing is wrong.

picked wild berries

Never.

nursed a beer sitting by a bonfire in your back yard

Never. I don't drink. Occasionally I get some hot tea and watch the birds in my back yard though. I assume that's a similar experience. I like watching birds. Birds are awesome.

or went for a quick hike after work?

I have no idea honestly, unless you count dog walks. I enjoy watching dogs find wonder in every blade of grass, fence post, and other object they come across outdoors. Dogs are really cool animals, more so than birds even. But back on topic, I have a pretty busy life. Between school/homework about 90 hours a week are accounted for, the rest is sleeping time.

originally posted by: Tardacus
but lazy people don`t care about doing those things

I don't know about that. I'm the laziest person I've ever met.

While it's not a good thing what's happening in Chicago, those people aren't lazy. They're going around inventing reasons to kill each other, and then doing so. It takes work to be a criminal. Murders, thefts, fencing, banking, drug running... it's non stop work.

Lazy sounds extremely boring, ignorant and destructive. I'll take rural any day of week. It's a beautiful life. Of course, you don't have to be in rural to live rural. It just takes a little extra effort and imagination.

Warning though, not for those of the 'lazy' persuasion as it may cause excitement, enthusiasm and a new lust for living.