Is it cheating?

originally posted by: muzzleflash
Islam, as psychotic as it is, becomes very attractive to millions of people because it is extremely harsh on this issue specifically.

Yes with a very one sided attitude slanted well in the 'favor of men'.

I could be persuaded to agree with you IF the male in the

equation had the same harsh punishment .... It appears Islam thinks

a woman commits adultery on her own

They seem to have no comprehension that *It takes two to tango*

and the male gets away scott free!

a reply to: Snarl

If it were a wife there would be more weight to the argument of trying to work through it. This is a fiancé though, it is not as heavy to end the relationship.

Assassin, I have a question. How did YOU meet her? Was she flirtatious and aggressive with YOU? Was she in a relationship when you met her?

a reply to: Assassin82

I can understand why she is intimidated by his high rank, but she can report him. As for cheating, if she responded to the 'homework assignment' then yes, it's cheating. Actually that e-mail should be proof that he is harassing her if the attention is unwanted.

originally posted by: raymundoko
a reply to: Snarl

If it were a wife there would be more weight to the argument of trying to work through it. This is a fiancé though, it is not as heavy to end the relationship.

Assassin, I have a question. How did YOU meet her? Was she flirtatious and aggressive with YOU? Was she in a relationship when you met her?

Was introduced through a mutual friend. We texted back and forth for about a week. First date was over breakfast. Second was dinner and putt putt golf. Then I went in a 3 week cross country road trip and won her over by sending a picture of a different flower everyday from every state I visited. There's never been any doubt in her loyalty or respect of our relationship until this.

And she wasn't overly flirty until our first date after I came back from my road trip. That first few weeks was mostly a "get to know each other and become friends first" timeline.

Here's the some issues for everyone defending this woman.

1) She didn't tell him beforehand he accidentally found out himself

2) The only reason she told him/confessed was that she got caught red-handed


Many people these days are in open-relationships, whether they work out or not is a whole different story, so if they don't mind sharing, then I don't see an issue here.

But for an unstable monogamous relationship, the alarm bells on this one are on high alert.

Heck 60%+ marriages fail these days, so I'm not sure exactly what the answer is. It appears people have better odds in Vegas playing craps, than getting married these days. ]

You're looking for people to validate your negative feelings. Thats a bad sign. Make her prove it. If she can't then leave her. I would, but not everyone has the opportunity to meet new women on a consistent basis.

Tbh, just leave her. It's not worth it. You'll find someone better who has the ovaries to stand up for you and herself. Who would want to be with a spineless person anyways? She blew it when she didn't shut him down immediately.


OP...seriously leave her before she breaks your heart. You'll come off looking like a real man if you put your foot down and find happiness with someone else. She'll learn her lesson and be a better person when she realizes she has to be a stronger woman.

a reply to: Assassin82

You may have nipped this in time. She was playing with fire and she was baby stepping into a full blown mess. Maybe you opened her eyes in time to where this would all lead. I would give it another chance, the enjoyment of his attentions is the worst of it but she may have been blind to the actual potential size of her transgression.

a reply to: SeaWorthy

I really agree with you saying give it another chance. Sometimes life just takes us blind and we are caught up in the moment.

Freely forgive. Good things will happen.

SeaWorthy

a reply to: Assassin82

I have empathy for you, and I think you'd be better off on your own. Yes, it's cheating. Reverse the roles and let me ask you - how would she react?

There's also evidence of a coverup. Her claim that she can't turn a male boss in for harassment is beyond ridiculous. If you are born with male genitalia, you have almost no recourse against claims of sexual harassment and you are almost certain to lose your job, especially if you are a supervisor.

I would notify her agency of the matter, because I guarantee you that they don't want this. Then tell her to fully confess, and start over when she does. Do whatever "starting over" means for you.

a reply to: BuzzyWigs

When we first met, she was at the tail end of getting out of a verbally abusive relationship. Meaning, it had been several months since she ended it with him and she was finally ready to start dating him. The relationship before that she claims was a physically abusive relationship.

Possibly, yes.

But for you to decide it is so is not appropriate.

And then --- let's look at this one sentence of yours:

it had been several months since she ended it with him and she was finally ready to start dating him.

It had been several months.....him.....and then finally ready......dating him.......

Just saying.
I understand what it's like to be typing in a hurry and be all "oh wow I gotta correct that typo"....

I believe her...she had no self esteem and that would explain why.

According to whom? She had no self esteem according to.........?????

She'd been beaten and yelled at her adult life and probably never had someone to help build her up.

Probably? How do you come to that conclusion? She "probably never had someone to help build her up"???? How do you make that judgment?

Beaten and yelled at "her adult life"? What do you know about her pre-adult life?

But.... let's just let it lie there........

probably never had someone to help build her up

Possibly.... but then again, you have to go all the way back to her family of origin, her earliest memories, her family system.

You need to understand that this sort of pattern is not just "oh, I was used to my old car, but now I'm in a new car and I have to test out the brakes, visibility, etc". "Probably that - because she doesn't realize it, but her old car was stupid and broken...." ???????????

Really? You get to decide this? No.

No.


You get to consider the various scenarios, and that is fine. But do not jump to conclusions when you have no idea. It takes at least five years of daily contact and experience to truly understand how someone operates.......

It is not just "probably". No. "Probably" does not work....you can't just gloss over the issues. Not if you want to work it out.



Of course --- you can (and might) do that....but it would be negligent, and self-justification to do so.

No one can stop you, though! You decide. Is it all her? Is it all her because probably and no hero before?

Sorry ----- now I probably pissed you off again. I'm just typing my stream of thought......if you want me to delete it all, I can do that.

a reply to: eletheia

You're right.

Both parties should be held accountable.
You are absolutely correct.

a reply to: Assassin82

Alright I thought it over today while in transit somewhere.

I'd say there's a 90%+ chance she actually already banged him. Theres too much evidence already.

Sending a video like that could land someone in jail, he must have dirt on her.

She hid it plus defends him from turning it into legal action?

Ok here's what you must do. Go find out who you report sexual misconduct to and freak the hell out n file complaints!

Do not contact this horrible man. Let the sexual misconduct agency do that.

Show them that email.

Don't protect the lady. She's banging some jerk why would you protect this? Create a # storm, don't let it go, don't forgive until disciplinary actions are taken against this guy.

Please don't let immorality go unpunished. You're such a nice guy and deserve so much better. It's so unfair. Crush this guy. Be patient, meticulous, and thorough. And keep it all legal. Take his career for taking your lady. It's a start.

a reply to: Assassin82

Was she ending a relationship when you met her or was she completely out of it?

originally posted by: muzzleflash
Take his career for taking your lady. It's a start.

I do like the way you think ... but beating the ever-loving-crap out of the boss is the course of action that is most satisfying and the most likely to end the scenario on an appropriate note. An active duty Air Force employee could very easily catch a government civilian in the parking lot. The likelihood of a prosecution over it is virtually nil. I'd make sure the guy was in the hospital for a couple of months minimum.

Seems like a tough situation.. Rather interesting all the same though.

I'd try to find out what that homework assignment was, exactly. Maybe even ask to see the email if that's how it was given. If it was something like "find some links on how bosses and their secretaries can communicate more effectively," her response is a bit different than if he asked her to find porn that mimics their situation. Either way though, sending that link seems to be upping the ante.

Its really tough to say anything with certainty, there seems to be a lot of missing pertinent information. It could even be the email you found was just one scrap she forgot to get rid of in a much more involved relationship.

That's a lot of assumption however, and I think you probably need to find actual answers before listening to anyone here. Lots of stuff just doesn't quite add up.

Usually, Id think victims of sexual harassment don't want to handle the situation by sending their harasser porn that directly mirrors the situation. That's got to be in the top "things not to do" when being harassed.

Do you know if her boss knows she is engaged?

a reply to: Assassin82

I think its great you are self reflecting on this situation and how you can be "better" not just for her but for yourself.

When you state your 11 yr old is your first priority I on one hand commend you but on the other wonder where your partner fits in. Is she then said to be second priority? If she doesn't feel like she is number 1 to you maybe she is looking to be number 1 to someone.. maybe even her boss. If not her boss she will seek to be number one priority to someone.

My fiance and I have 4 kids. 2 are his and 2 are mine and roughly same age. We have let the "kids" know we are number one and they are number 2. My kids don't need to come before my relationship because then they will play their cards on that and win with the upper hand. I also want to add the ONLY reason they have dropped to the 2 spot is because my life long partner is WORTH being number 1 and needs to be treated so because in a few years when the kids are gone we have learned how to put each others needs before others and not allowed our kids to run our relationship. If she isn't worth the position of number 1.... well.... she's not worth marrying.

If you feel as though you can get over this issue please move forward with caution and if this relationship isn't all you've dreamed of, move on. The fairy tale exists all you have to do is create it and not settle.

a reply to: MamaJ

If you made your kids priority two before you were even married, especially after one divorce, then your advice is awful and nobody should listen to you.

Making sure children are in a home with a healthy and happy family, even if a single parent, is the most important thing you can do. By doing that you are making them them the number one priority. By making sure there are boundaries where they know they are the children and you are the adults you foster a healthy working family. You are still, by default, make them the number one priority when you do that.

You want to throughly vet a partner and ditch them if they will bring drama into the life of your child.

originally posted by: MamaJ
a reply to: Assassin82

I think its great you are self reflecting on this situation and how you can be "better" not just for her but for yourself.

When you state your 11 yr old is your first priority I on one hand commend you but on the other wonder where your partner fits in. Is she then said to be second priority? If she doesn't feel like she is number 1 to you maybe she is looking to be number 1 to someone.. maybe even her boss. If not her boss she will seek to be number one priority to someone.

My fiance and I have 4 kids. 2 are his and 2 are mine and roughly same age. We have let the "kids" know we are number one and they are number 2. My kids don't need to come before my relationship because then they will play their cards on that and win with the upper hand. I also want to add the ONLY reason they have dropped to the 2 spot is because my life long partner is WORTH being number 1 and needs to be treated so because in a few years when the kids are gone we have learned how to put each others needs before others and not allowed our kids to run our relationship. If she isn't worth the position of number 1.... well.... she's not worth marrying.

If you feel as though you can get over this issue please move forward with caution and if this relationship isn't all you've dreamed of, move on. The fairy tale exists all you have to do is create it and not settle.

My son has been through a lot. I've gone through a personal hell to keep him safe and make sure he and I have and maintain the relationship we have. It's cost me everything and I would do it all over again in an instant if I had to. I'm going to make sure he's given every opportunity possible to be who he wants to be in this world. And it takes a constant effort on my part. She's known the bond and relationship he and I have and she's always told me she admires and respects that. I've never had to sacrifice her and I's relationship to make sure he's taken care of, or felt how much I care about her.

However, maybe what you say has some weight worth considering. Maybe she wasn't getting the attention she feels she deserves and knows that asking me to take away from my son is more than she can do, or I would want to hear. If that's the case though, then any step forward between her and I, is a step I can't take. Because I've given her everything I possibly can while still keeping him safe and our relationship secured. In our conversations over the past week, she's reiterated that my son has nothin to do with any of it. So it's something I'll continue to think over but table for now and readdress a little later.

I can't believe how many people have taken the time to chime in. I never would have thought that I would get such a response. So thank you all, for providing your advice, lessons learned, and thoughts out there in regards to all this.

I'm moving forward with the current premise that this betrayal was a combination of some sexual harassment on the boss's part, some weakness in her part, and me being naive to the possibility that this could happen.

I have no doubt that the boss is guilty of sexual harassment. And she's going to address that within her office...which she's already started the process of. She's admitting that over the past month she's been more aware of his advances and in a moment of weakness she found the attention more than what I was giving her and she liked it. The attention I have been giving her is a result of me taking a brutal medication that made me feel half dead, and switching over to a 12 hour night shift. Things changed and neither of us communicated ourselves very well throughout it. I was naive to think this could happen over that time.

She's also adamately claimed she wants to improve her self esteem because she knows that it makes her feel weak and powerless in confrontation and under pressure. So I'm going to help her with that. I'll support her want to improve. I'll support her through the sexual harassment process and I'll address any potential downfalls with myself that may have contributed to her doing this.

I do still love her, though trust and loyalty have to be repaired. Everything is on hold right now. I'm going to continue to look for any possibility that there is more to it or that she's lied to me. She will have to prove to me I can trust her again. She's giving me full access to everything that has happened and that will happen to help with that. So, we'all see. If she can't prove it then I'll move on. If she can, then we'll be ok.

The answer to my original question of "is it cheating", appears to be one of opinion than fact. I've read a lot of different opinions...most seem to think it was cheating. My personal conclusion is that it was, but the root cause of which can be addressed and as adults we can move through this. There are checks and balances that need to be put in place for us to make sure we can get through it. There will be a time when I have to say "ok, this isn't going to work" or "ok, I forgive you and it's over and I won't hold it over your head". Time will tell. But patience, love and understanding must prevail.

Thank you all again, I really do appreciate it!