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There is Absolutely No Evidence of Widespread Voter Fraud

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posted on Oct, 23 2016 @ 08:16 AM
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originally posted by: searcherfortruth
a reply to: GodEmperor

Why would there be a need for voter fraud when the elections themselves are rigged, redundancy at it's finest.


How are elections "rigged" exactly?




posted on Oct, 23 2016 @ 08:21 AM
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a reply to: Gryphon66




RICHARD HASEN: Well, the kind of fraud that we do occasionally see in this country is absentee ballot fraud. That occurs because voting takes place outside the presence of election officials. Usually, it involves buying votes or stealing ballots out of people’s mailboxes, and then voting them in a particular way.

But we haven’t seen that on the kind of scale that could affect a presidential election. And that’s not the kind of fraud Donald Trump has been talking about. He was talking about the lack of voter I.D., strict voter I.D. law in Pennsylvania and that would allow someone to go into the polling place, and he literally said, vote five or 10 or 15 times.

PBS

I do see the potential for abuse for in-person voting, especially with the lack of voter ID laws. There may be instances in every area of this type of fraud, and they all add up, so take that into consideration. What strikes me is the narrative that overlooks absentee voter fraud, which have impacted actual election results lending towards illegitimate victories.



posted on Oct, 23 2016 @ 08:25 AM
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Not difficult to fix voter fraud. What is difficult is the political willpower to fix it. Every person in the US military places their index finger on a small scanner before being issued their ID card. That process could be used in every booth. No ID would be required. The booth would pull up your information. The voter then confirms their identity and votes.

Absentee, the form could come with a small ink kit for a couple of prints. There would be another process for people without fingers. A facial scan that could be done online or a government worker could meet the person and perform the scan anywhere. I was doing that in Afghanistan with a small device on my missions.

So easy to fix this mess and much cheaper long term. It would cut down on investigations, reduce sampling efforts.

Without political willpower though never going to happen. They don't want to fix it.



posted on Oct, 23 2016 @ 08:25 AM
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a reply to: GodEmperor

That's election fraud.

You've conflated election fraud and voter fraud throughout.

Voter ID does nothing to correct election fraud.



posted on Oct, 23 2016 @ 08:26 AM
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a reply to: LifeMode

Why not just put an RFID chip in every citizen?

I'm sure that'd be useful in many ways.



posted on Oct, 23 2016 @ 08:28 AM
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originally posted by: searcherfortruth
a reply to: GodEmperor

Why would there be a need for voter fraud when the elections themselves are rigged, redundancy at it's finest.


It's rigged, in general, towards the two establishment parties, and weighted against all third parties.

During elections, there is a fair amount of cheating between the two establishment parties, and it appears whoever spends the most money wins the cheat vote.



posted on Oct, 23 2016 @ 08:37 AM
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a reply to: Gryphon66

Voter ID would alleviate election fraud as well.

It's easier to commit fraud through the absentee voting, I don't really see why there cannot be a system in place to verify the ID of an absentee voter.

It's impossible to determine in-person voter fraud in states with lax voter id laws. That is not acceptable. There is no evidence of widespread fraud, because there is no way to measure it, but there are examples:



Studies finding significant voter fraud

According to the National Review, undercover agents with New York City Department of Investigations "showed up at 63 polling places [in the fall of 2013] and pretended to be voters who should have been turned away by election officials."

“In 61 instances, or 97 percent of the time, the testers were allowed to vote. ... Given that someone who is dead, is in jail, or has moved isn’t likely to complain if someone votes in his name, how do we know that voter fraud at the polls isn’t a problem? An ounce of prevention — in the form of voter ID and better training of poll workers — should be among the minimum precautions taken to prevent an electoral miscarriage or meltdown in a close race.

Ballotpedia

While it may not be possible to measure voter fraud, it does occur.
edit on 23-10-2016 by GodEmperor because: content



posted on Oct, 23 2016 @ 08:42 AM
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a reply to: Gryphon66

i havent actually asked them that specific question and i wont make any assumptions about that specifically. But i do know they have people on the inside of DMV and other gov departments that get them fake SSNs, drivers licenses and pretty much any other kind of document they want/need and thats just the tip of the iceberg. They also have connections to all kinds of local crime rings that steal stuff from department stores and resell it, things like that.

Heres the funny thing: theyre really good people, like, as family and friends....you would never know they were into this other stuff. Like i said, i basically consider it soft crime....none of them are heroine or meth addicts or killing people....but they do like to find loopholes in the system and exploit the hell out of them. Cant really blame them right?



posted on Oct, 23 2016 @ 08:42 AM
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a reply to: GodEmperor

Voter ID has nothing to do with election fraud. You're reaching.

Supposedly, absentee ballots are checked against the voter rolls just as in-person voting would be.

The issue here is corruption INSIDE the election commissions.

Your assertion that it is impossible to examine voter fraud in States with "lax" voter ID laws is absurd.

The issue of "widespread fraud" has been investigated many times over the last decade and a half, most proiminately by the Bush Justice Department. You keep repeating that the issue hasn't been or can't be examined because that supports your claim here, but that is not factual at all.

It is possible to measure voter fraud, it does occur, it doesn't occur in numbers to affect national or even state-wide elections, and, as your links have shown, it becomes blatantly obvious at the local level and is corrected.

You're pointing to a pig-in-a-poke.

EDIT. THe same "Ballotpedia" article cites the studies from Brennan that show a) voter fraud has been investigated many times and b) has never been shown to be a significant factor in national elections.

I wonder why you didn't cite that?
edit on 23-10-2016 by Gryphon66 because: Noted



posted on Oct, 23 2016 @ 08:45 AM
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a reply to: tribal

So you were just chiming in with a generic statement on the dishonesty of your family?

Okay.



posted on Oct, 23 2016 @ 08:52 AM
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a reply to: Gryphon66

The first example I linked, happened for at least 12 election cycles, so only 1 of the 12 instances in that case was caught.

By acknowledging that fraud is more predominantly happening from within, there is no way to accept the integrity of any conclusions on the extent of voter fraud.



posted on Oct, 23 2016 @ 09:00 AM
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originally posted by: GodEmperor
a reply to: Gryphon66

The first example I linked, happened for at least 12 election cycles, so only 1 of the 12 instances in that case was caught.

By acknowledging that fraud is more predominantly happening from within, there is no way to accept the integrity of any conclusions on the extent of voter fraud.


Why do you continue to conflate voter fraud with election fraud?

They are two completely different issues.

Your claim fails significantly on the assertion that there's "no way" to measure or invesigate voter (or election) fraud.

You're giving multiple examples, yourself, of investigations that have turned up both.

What you are failing to do is to show that either are significant on a national or state level.



posted on Oct, 23 2016 @ 09:06 AM
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Media, Science, Religion are all of the Matrix. It's laughable that my fellow Proles keep quoting these sources as legitimate. The are not. They lie. They only wish to perpetuate this crumbling system.



posted on Oct, 23 2016 @ 09:09 AM
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originally posted by: HUMBLEONE
Media, Science, Religion are all of the Matrix. It's laughable that my fellow Proles keep quoting these sources as legitimate. The are not. They lie. They only wish to perpetuate this crumbling system.


I'll bite.

Then how do you determine truth?



posted on Oct, 23 2016 @ 09:21 AM
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originally posted by: searcherfortruth
a reply to: GodEmperor

Why would there be a need for voter fraud when the elections themselves are rigged, redundancy at it's finest.


It's so the election numbers fall in line with the "selection" to avoid any civil unrest over a fraudulent election.
edit on 23-10-2016 by Nucleardoom because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 23 2016 @ 09:22 AM
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How many examples of fraud do you need for it to be considered widespread?
One is to many in my opinion.



posted on Oct, 23 2016 @ 09:24 AM
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originally posted by: Bluntone22
How many examples of fraud do you need for it to be considered widespread?
One is to many in my opinion.


When an election could be compromised?

That'd be my guess.

If "one" is too many, how do you combat voter fraud in your rather exacting standards then?



posted on Oct, 23 2016 @ 09:30 AM
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originally posted by: Bluntone22
How many examples of fraud do you need for it to be considered widespread?
One is to many in my opinion.


This is exactly what I was thinking when I read this gem:



originally posted by: Gryphon66
No one "on the left" denies that voter fraud exists, only that the numbers of actual voter fraud (as opposed to election fraud, mistakes, misunderstandings, etc.) are insignificant especially on the national level.


No amount of fraud is insignificant or should be tolerated at any level.
edit on 23-10-2016 by Nucleardoom because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 23 2016 @ 09:33 AM
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a reply to: Gryphon66


Require state bmv printed photo IDs would be a good start.



posted on Oct, 23 2016 @ 09:33 AM
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a reply to: GodEmperor

I'll give you a local example. One of my friends was running for county commissioner. He's a good guy, clean, new to politics. He was approached at a fundraiser by a union guy. This gentleman proceeds to ask my friend if he want to win the election. My friend says of course, that's why I'm running. The union guy then implies he can deliver enough votes to guarantee his win with some pretty major strings attached to it. My friend being new to politics declined the union guys offer.

Come election day my friend trounces his opponent at each precinct but he doesn't look happy. I ask him why and he tells me he is going to lose. I said how, you are doing so good. Absentee ballots he says, just watch what happens with them. There were so many absentee ballots and they skewed 75/25 to his opponent. He ended up loosing, even though he won the walk up election part.

Early voting and absentee voting are where the attention should be on preventing fraud. Notice how both the media and political parties don't even mention it. That's where the abuse of the system is.



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