Former abortionist: Abortion is never medically necessary to save the life of the mother

a reply to: Pardon?

Hey pardon, I know you don't care about rules but try to stay within topic or don't post all your BS at all trying to derail the thread.

a reply to: ladyvalkyrie

Well, first congratulations on your new addition to your family. However, you are trying to dismiss this "that the medical judgment may be exercised in the light of all factors - physical, emotional, psychological, familial, and the woman's age. - relevant to the well-being of the patient. All these factors may relate to health.
...
www.usccb.org...

But you want to claim that no woman would make up any claims late in their third trimester that "their health" is being affected by their pregnancy to get an abortion? The law, Doe v. Bolton, makes it so that any woman, or their doctor can make up any excuse to claim the health of the woman is being affected to get an abortion. That was the reason for the case Doe V. Bolton.... Because they wanted to overturn the decision of Roe v Wade that there had to be real consequences risking the mothers life to get an abortion during the third trimester. But you want to deny this?...

Then, on the same sentence you claim that "nobody gets an abortion for sh*ts and giggles" and then you give two, of many other reasons why there are women who do get an abortion late in their pregnancy. Some women do not realize they are pregnant until their due date...

You are going to sit there and tell us you know for sure none of those women would get an abortion late in their pregnancy simply because they have swallowed fully the progressive kool-aid and don't see their soon to be born babies as human and don't care if they are killed?...

There are women who murder their kids, some even have thrown their newborns still alive into the trash and you want to claim it doesn't happen among any of those women who get an abortion late in the third trimester?... That there are no women who get an abortion late in their third trimester simply because they don't see their babies as humans and don't give a sh*t about them?...

a reply to: ElectricUniverse

Obviously you're pro-life. Slow clap for you.

The fact is, you - or anyone else- could not possibly know the reasons behind a woman's decision because the reasons vary from case to case. There are women who NEVER thought they could have an abortion suddenly faced with a heart wrenching decision.

My point about a woman not knowing she's pregnant was aimed at cases like my friend, who TWO TIMES didn't find out she was pregnant until around 4 months. So cases like that should get the same options of others who found out sooner. If a woman doesn't know she's pregnant until she's in labor- which sounds crazy but it does happen- NO ONE is going to 'abort' that baby. At that point they deliver it and she can decide to keep it or give it up for adoption.

NOBODY is chopping up viable-outside-the-womb fetuses. Sorry to disappoint you. Abortions are either due to medical issues or life issues that a woman is having to suffer through that you and your ilk cannot possibly fathom. Why don't you try to be a good Christian and try to be loving and understanding? Wash the feet of the lepers instead of shunning them? ('lepers' being women choosing to have an abortions) WWJD man. WWJD?

a reply to: thesungod

Man, I am so sorry about what happened with you, your wife and your son. What an awful, awful position to be in. I've been pregnant 3 times- all planned and very much wanted. I would have been a complete wreck if I had found out some bad medical news like that several months in. But I would have made the same decision you did. It was the right one.

With my most recent the Zika scare was in full effect. God, I was doing everything I could to avoid mosquitoes! (I'm in Texas, so being in the South it was a legitimate concern)

Anyway, my prayers are with you and your family. No matter how long ago that was y'all still deserve lots of peace and happiness to make up for that horrible situation.

a reply to: ElectricUniverse

Do you want it illegal?.

a reply to: ElectricUniverse

Oh, and BTW....my friend who didn't find out she was pregnant until halfway through the pregnancies did NOT have abortions. She kept both babies. And she's been in abject poverty ever since. Her oldest has had seizures all his life and a couple of years ago had surgery to remove a brain tumor. His health problems make it impossible to work, she's been fired from multiple jobs for taking too much sick time to take care of him. She has yet to see a dime of child support. So she has an 11 yo and an 8 yo....that's 19 YEARS of unpaid support. Of course she loves them and doesn't regret her decisions, but her life has been hard as hell these last 11 years. Maybe it's understandable why some women wouldn't want to voluntarily sign up for a fate like that? Would you want to live like that?

originally posted by: TheKnightofDoom
a reply to: ElectricUniverse

Do you want it illegal?.

Yeah he does. He's on a crusade to save all the precious little babies. 🙄

He's trying to use this 'they're chopping up babies' crap to sway people who may be on the fence. And it's pathetic.

Never mind about women and what they may be going through. Never mind about the thousands of children who need to be adopted at this very minute. Never mind the millions of kids who are going hungry because they're parent(s) can't afford food or too addicted to drugs to properly care for them. Never mind the millions of dollars spent to support people like my friend who kept her 'oops' babies but can't support them on her own. Forget about all the infinite variables in this equation...pro 'lifers' are out to save the little babies and demonize anyone who may think more rationally than that.

originally posted by: GreenGunther
I just don't understand when babies lives became so expendable to us?

It's not new.

Psalm 137:9
How blessed will be the one who seizes and dashes your little ones Against the rock.

Leviticus also only places value on babies over 1month old.

The real question is when did women's lives become less expendable?

a reply to: ladyvalkyrie

How does he intend to enforce the law?. How is he going to force women o carry out the unwanted pregnancy?.

Well no
You seem to miss the whole percentage thing here.
"The ammount of woman having abortions to save their lives" vs "the ammount of woman having abortions just because".

Compare those 2 and you'll see we view babies lives to be a lot more expendable.
I've also noticed post referring to the 'patient' but never mentioning which patient.
The bias is clear, most people view unborn babies as expendable.

In these situations there are 2 patients - mother and infant.
Whilst most only see the mother as the patient. We've been desensitized and everyone seems ok with it.
Guess I'll join the bandwagon.

a reply to: ladyvalkyrie

Yes, there are a lot of variables - not infinite though - and I believe that the law regarding abortion should be created around those variables. Money should not be one of them, money is a man made concept and killing anything for a man-made concept is murder.

I would just like to live in a world where people don't kill their own children because they were lazy.
The vast majority of abortions are happening because people are lazy/stupid. Isn't that sad?

originally posted by: GreenGunther
I would just like to live in a world where people don't kill their own children because they were lazy.

At least it gets them out of the house.

The problems with these "lazy" people is that they're also too "lazy" to study medicine, resulting in botched attempts and painful deaths.

originally posted by: ElectricUniverse
a reply to: Pardon?

Hey pardon, I know you don't care about rules but try to stay within topic or don't post all your BS at all trying to derail the thread.

It is not BS, it is the simple truth and it is also within the lines of this thread/topic.

Considering how many twists and turns you have made in this thread yourself, it is within the topic, I also believe there may be a rule about moderating...? And that it is best to use the "report" function...yes?

Also how many of these 10s of thousands of babies, toddlers, adolescents, preteens, teens would you be willing to adopt or foster (after undergoing mental and physical health examination procedures required) and bring up on your own and do not use the excuses of lack of money, health, housing, stability etc.

I want that answer in your own words without any links to any websites or youtube videos and other irrelevant "stuff", because that would apply to everyone else with all of these children who are without parents or carers all of their lives who were not aborted but could do with parents now, and imagine all of the others who were aborted...

What's the point of all of your links if you cannot use your own words.

a reply to: ElectricUniverse

so why did they let Savita Halappanavar
gawker.com...

Valentina Milluzzo,
www.theguardian.com...

lay there and suffer instead of inducing labor?

and why is it in that in Brazil,

"There are cases of girls that come with ectopic pregnancies and they are left to bleed to death because here it's not allowed to terminate the pregnancy," Rodriguez said. "To me that's a criminal act."
www.cnsnews.com/news/article/ill-woman-denied-abortion-recovers-after-c-section

then there's Beatriz,
www.aljazeera.com...
and Alicja
www.rt.com...
who's lives have been permanently diminished because of their pregnancy.

If I wanted to waste my time, I could dig up more stories, but it does seem that in those countries that have strict abortion laws, women do tend to die more often from pregnancy related complications that could have been resolved if only those laws were that strict.
and then there's all those preteen rape victims in those countries, some carrying twins, who are force to go through their pregnancies, even when they have a whole staff of medical experts saying how risky the pregnancy is, and well, those kids and their medical staff are met with about the same kind of resistance as you have shown here...
they are lying, exagerating, whatever.

tell me something, did my post mentioning those jelly fish babies peak your curiosity enough to google them? probably not, so I will tell you the story.... back in the 50's when the russia and us were in their race to perfect their nuclear weapons, the US had this group of islands that the UN entrusted to them to take care of, ya know look out for the primitive villagers and help them develop into a more modern nation.. well, the US interpreted that to mean use their islands for nuclear tests. so they picked out on island and relocated all the villagers to nearby islands for their target. then they experiments with their atomic bombs, trying to get the biggest bang for their buck so to speak. well, their was one, that far exceeded their expectations, and ended up putting out a blast that was 1000 times the power of those bombs that were dropped on japan. the radiation spread far wider than they believed it would, radiated the villagers in the nearby island, the US scientists that were conducting the experiment, the servicemen that were involved, as well as some important vips that were on board the ship that was used to observe the event.
the dna of those villagers that were exposed was permanently corrupted and it is passed down from generation to generation, entire villages has agreed to not bare children to end the suffering, and if I am reading the stories right, the women still have jellyfish babies, who have no bones, or eyes and translucent skin. they are like gelatinous blobs that you can clearly see a human like brain through their skin, a heart, and the blood flowing their their veins. when I referred to these babies, as well as some of the other deformities that are seen on the island as monsters, I didn't just pick this word myself... this is how the women who bare these children refer to them.
so you say that every embryo that is conceived deserves all the human rights given to the born, and deserves to be brought into the world, and everything should be done after is comes into the world to preserve it's life.
what about these jellyfish babies, do you see them as human? if one were to be born in the US, would you mind if we took a little more of your money in the form of taxes to preserve it's short life? right now, they only life a day or two, but as far as I know, no one has tried to do much to keep them alive. so well, you think maybe we should start researching to find a way to enable this poor little baby to live a few more months, or years. or heck, maybe a whole lifetime?
More than likely we won't see any jelly fish babies born in the US, unless of course, the nations decide to go nuts with the nukes...of which I see both hillary and trump as being about equally capable of doing. but, we might see some of the monsters we've created in the middle east, ya know the cyclops, the octopuses, the turtlebacks. and, well, even you might end up questioning just when is a human embryo really human.

a reply to: ElectricUniverse

Let's examine your logic here.

Prompt delivery of an unviable child is a what? An abortion.

A prompt caesarean section of an unviable child is a what? A hysterotomy abortion.

Not all premature children survive at the same rates at the same time. For example my son at 6-7 months was perfect except for lung development.

Point blank you are ignoring that I gave you an illness that kills pregnant women in late stages of pregnancy unless the child is removed viable or not. Most of the time they are viable, sometimes not.

This 100% debunks your "abortion is never medically necessary to save the life of the mother" nonsense. Ignoring it doesn't change that fact.

it would be funny, if it wasn't so bad...

a reply to: ladyvalkyrie
I've had three pregnancies myself. All healthy, thank goodness.

Given the hypothetical scenario you described, I would abort as well. The child is going to die anyways and like you said, why carry on with it.

It's a slipppery slope but it's definitely up to the woman to decide

a reply to: ElectricUniverse

This is the stupidest article of all time. I am not even going to read it because in less than 2 seconds I can think of reasons where it would be totally necessary.

Fetus attached and growing on side of Fallopian tube.

This thread has now officially been debunked in less than 5 seconds.

The end.

a reply to: DumpMaster

it has damaged the Fallopian tube, so, well, if you remove that part of the tube, it's not an abortion....
at least this is how the catholic hospitals are getting around their moral opposition to abortions, even when medically needed.

a reply to: dawnstar

What?... Your first argument was that most abortions on the third trimester are for saving a woman's life. Now you have changed your argument completely trying to make the thread about "Catholic hospitals' and what happens in Brazil"...

The thread is about third trimester abortion and whether abortion is necessary to save a woman's life that late in the pregnancy...

But since you want to derail the thread, let's look at some of the special children you want to disregard, you don't believe they deserve to be born, and you among others seem to want to see dead because they were born with down syndrome .

9 successful people with Down syndrome who prove life is worth living
By Nancy Flanders | November 8, 2014 , 10:20am

Ninety percent of people diagnosed with Down syndrome are never allowed to be born. This is a staggering statistic that we hear quite often. Lives are struck down before they ever have a chance to fulfill their missions, succeed at their dreams, or even flash a smile at their parents.

This all started when people began to believe that those with Down syndrome are better off never being born. It’s the most judgmental action our society does – deciding that someone’s life isn’t worth living. It’s time we stop believing that lie. These nine individuals with Down syndrome prove that joy and success are attainable to anyone.

1. Angela Bachiller. In 2013 in Valladolid, Span, Angela became the first person with Down syndrome ever to be elected councilwoman. She worked for three years in Social Welfare and Family as an administrative assistant, and loves reading and traveling. She hopes to shine a light on the normalcy of life with Down syndrome and make a difference in the lives of those with disabilities.
2. Megan McCormick. The first person with Down syndrome to graduate with honors from a technical college, Megan attended Bluegrass Community Technical College. She wants to work in education at the elementary level. She proves that with the right support and resources, people anywhere can reach their goals, Down syndrome or not.
3. Tim Harris. Tim is the owner of his own restaurant called Tim’s Place. In high school he was elected homecoming king (by the highest margin of votes in the school’s history), and was named Student of the Year as well. He dreamed of owning a restaurant, so he found jobs in the industry to learn as much as he could. And, according to the Tim’s Place web site, former employer Red Robin says that the store’s revenue went up during Tim’s shifts. He graduated from college with certificates in Food Services, Office Skills, and Restaurant Hosting. In addition, Tim recently created Tim’s Big Heart Foundation to help other people with disabilities start their own businesses.
4. Pablo Pineda. Pablo earned a bachelor’s degree in educational psychology and has gone on to be a writer, speaker, and actor. Born in Spain, he is a successful actor in his home country, receiving the Silver Shell award for his acting skills as well as the San Sebastian International Film Festival’s “Concha de Plata” as best actor of 2009 for his lead role in the film Yo Tambien.
5. Christian Royal. School never came easy to Christian, but that is just fine because he holds a skill many of us admire. Christian is highly talented at making pottery. He sells his beautiful dishes and bowls online and at an art gallery in South Carolina.
6. Bernadette Resha. Bernadette is also an artist who has made a name for herself. She and her work have been featured on television shows, in music videos, commercials, and magazines. In addition to creating beautiful paintings, she is a public speaker and violinist as well.
7. Michael Johnson. A painter, Michael is a self-taught Naïve Folk Artist. He has painted more than 500 commissioned portraits and had a solo exhibition at Vanderbilt University in 2001. His art has been featured in posters and on the cover of the American Journal of Public Health.
8. Sujeet Desai. A musician, Sujeet graduated from high school with a 4.3 grade average and went on to graduate from the Berkshire Hills Music Academy. He plays seven instruments including the violin, piano, trumpet and saxophone. He has received numerous awards and was even featured in the Wall Street Journal and Time Magazine as well as on 20/20 and the Oprah Winfrey Show. In 2006 he married Carolyn Bergeron who also has Down syndrome.
9. Melissa Reilly. Melissa has accomplished quite a lot in her life. She has travelled the country as an inspirational speaker. She is a decorated, gold medal winning skier, cycler, and swimmer and she has interned for a state senator. Melissa also teaches reading and math to preschoolers with Down syndrome. She says she loves her life 100%, and she proves that you can have a very fulfilling life with Down syndrome.

The world is a very different place for people with Down syndrome than it was 50 years ago, in both positive and negative ways. People with Down syndrome are no longer automatically placed in group homes, but instead are raised by their parents who nurture their child’s talents and abilities rather than focusing on any disabilities.

However, in this day and age, a person with Down syndrome is lucky to be born at all due to prenatal testing and recommendations from uninformed doctors to abort. Thankfully there are many successful and happy people with Down syndrome sharing their story so that fewer and fewer parents who receive a prenatal Down syndrome diagnosis will be pressured into aborting their child.

liveactionnews.org...

Now, before you keep dismissing the lives of people with down syndrome, I am sure you have seen some children with down syndrome while walking in the streets. Next time you see one stop and tell her and her mom that you don't think that girl, or boy deserves to live because he/she has down syndrome, because that's the argument you are making. You, and the "pro-choice" crowd claim that because babies can be born with down syndrome, or deformities that it is enough o terminate their lives.

What's going to be next? There are babies who are born blind, is blindness also an excuse for you to terminate the life of a baby in the third trimester?

Some human fetuses can be born with health problems, and a lot of people have been born with these problems and lived/live happy lives... Those are the people you are claiming an abortion is necessary "to stop them from suffering"...

Well, you know that there also are "relatively normal babies" who are born and nothing seems to be wrong with them, but they grow up unhappy and many of them have even taken their lives?...

Being born with health problems, such as down syndrome, doesn't make anyone less likely to have a happy and fulfilling life. But your argument is that those children are better off dead.

Since you, and some others wanted to keep on derailing the thread I posed to you the fact that you, among others, don't want to accept. Your argument is no more about "abortions in the third trimester are for saving women's lives" which is a lie. Now your argument is "abortions on the third trimester are done because children are born with down syndrome, or some other health problem.