posted on Jan, 27 2005 @ 11:00 AM
"this has little credibility at best I feel. While hydrogen extraction would require massive amounts of energy to meet the worlds demands, do not
think that it would take the same amount of fossil fuels in cars today to make it, I feel that's a bit of an overstatement."
I agree; it is a bit of an overstatement. I am sure that the economies of scale for hydrogen generation, coupled with the fact that the
extractive, refining, and transportation processes for in-ground hydrocarbon are inherently dirty, will give you somehat less pollution from
But there are other factors as well, including the tremendous cost required to develop an entire hydrogen infrastructure, including all the additional
generating facilities, infrastructure for compressing, transporting, and storing the hydrogen, and, finally dispensing it into a whole new generation
of vehicles which may or may not cost less to run, but which will have insanely high developmental (non-recurring) costs which must be amortized over
the first ten or fifteen years of mass production.
These, I believe, tend to counteract your comment " ... they do not take into account other factors and that are required from getting the fuels
out of the ground and into the marketplace, which the energy requirements too are massive for fossil fuels...."
You go on to say: "This also doesn't take into account alternative methods to supplying power to hydrogen facilities, or even the latest
breakthroughs that are happening in nuclear fusion technology ... "
Agreed. But neither Horacid nor I (if I may speak for him) are looking at a hydrogen economy which may work if we can get an alternative fuel source
for the H2 generation, but H2 with our present state-of-the art in science and engineering.
There are two ways to do this. The first uses a readily-available solution (existing nuclear reactors providing the power to crack and
compress the H2). The second has already been proven but will need more engineering dollars to convert it to a large-scale approach. This is
offshore Stirling-cycle engines running off the temperature delta between surface- and 200-meter depth water to produce hydrogen from the sea
"What environmentalists don't understand exactly though is that we NEED fossil fuels, not for petroleum or other fuels for combustion, but we
need the oil and coal for the production of plastics and chemicals that our society would come to a halt without."
Absolutely. This is all the more reason, as you have said, not to waste hydrocarbons as firelogs.
My guess is that you, Horacid, and I are probably not all that far apart in our views of energy requirements.